Star Wars Episode 9 to have more "improvisation"

[Jay Valero 1]

Does that mean more or less suck?

 

[Plutoburn]

How I'm picturing the series

 

[Deleted member 110072]

I stopped following Stuckman as I felt that his standards are a little too low. He is a bit sensitive too...like he legit cried and unsubscribed from redlettermedia after they made fun of him.

About the youtube culture of "movies are supposed to just be fun".....redlettermedias parody podcast "The Nerd Crew" review of Rogue One was hilarious. They made fun of that....but they also made fun of the same youtube/podcast groups that praised Rogue One as some masterpiece, like a dark war film in the vein of Full Metal Jacket, Apocalypse Now, Platoon, etc.

After that Nerd Crew episode....soooo many of the comments section on Collider Star Wars videos are just filled with redlettermedia fans making fun of them. It got to the point where many collider followers unsubscribed...but at the same time collider is getting a lot of clicks from redlettermedia viewers. So many comments say "redlettermedia brought me here" or..my favorite..."Holy crap...redlettermedia wasn't exaggerating"

Honestly Red Letter Media were probably the people who originally birthed that whole movement with the prequel Plinkett reviews, they were/are a good deal smarter than what followed and have often mocked it but I felt they were still rather apologetic towards TFA because it was basically the film they asked for.

Can't say I'v watched The Nerd Crew but I can probably imagine what its like praising absolutely everything to high heaven and focusing more on geekish aspects of films?

I'd say Red Letter got things totally backwards in terms of hammering Rogue One for nostalgia, its TFA that's the nostalgia fest. Thoughout that film you have the most well known aspects of Starwars rammed into your face via the camera with Lightsabers, X-wings, the Falcon, etc front and centre in the frame not to mention the majority of the plot is lifted from the originals. In Rogue One you get less of that and more a generalise recreation of the setting or the originals, an obvious weakness of Abrams film I think that felt far too small, the same with last Jedi.

They are also I think still a bit guilty of being afraid of being seen to take themselves too seriously, the kind of meta culture that exists in so many blockbusters today. You look back at a film like Empire though and yes it did take itself very seriously, it had humour in it mostly via wit but it wasn't constantly undermining itself.

 

[Eusung]

Honestly Red Letter Media were probably the people who originally birthed that whole movement with the prequel Plinkett reviews, they were/are a good deal smarter than what followed and have often mocked it but I felt they were still rather apologetic towards TFA because it was basically the film they asked for.

Can't say I'v watched The Nerd Crew but I can probably imagine what its like praising absolutely everything to high heaven and focusing more on geekish aspects of films?

I'd say Red Letter got things totally backwards in terms of hammering Rogue One for nostalgia, its TFA that's the nostalgia fest. Thoughout that film you have the most well known aspects of Starwars rammed into your face via the camera with Lightsabers, X-wings, the Falcon, etc front and centre in the frame not to mention the majority of the plot is lifted from the originals. In Rogue One you get less of that and more a generalise recreation of the setting or the originals, an obvious weakness of Abrams film I think that felt far too small, the same with last Jedi.

They are also I think still a bit guilty of being afraid of being seen to take themselves too seriously, the kind of meta culture that exists in so many blockbusters today. You look back at a film like Empire though and yes it did take itself very seriously, it had humour in it mostly via wit but it wasn't constantly undermining itself.

Yeah, the Nerd Crew parodies how a lot of these Geek/nerd podcasts get invited to premieres and then post reviews + spoiler review gushing over the movie.

It's here: the first episode.


I'd say Rogue One is the more divisive SW movie. Many SW fans love it. Many don't like it(they usually say they found the characters flat, like Jyn Erso).

TLJ..though...not divisive. It's universally disliked as far as I can see.

Speaking to people in Thailand, Japan, South Korea (they loved TFA), England, etc....My friends from those countries tell me how they didn't like it and how the movie was generally poorly received in their respective countries.

TLJ rottentomatoes audience score just keeps getting lower. It's at 45% now. The IMDB score use to be high hovering around 8.0.....back in December, January. Now it's at 7.2 and I honestly don't see it going higher.

I have yet to meet a single person who liked The Last Jedi here in Asia.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

I would say the issue with Rogue One is probably more general blockbuster viewers. Its a film that's not really in step with what you expect from a modern blockbuster, that is characters who are constantly larger than life and a lot of meta humour. I would say actually you've had a few films in the last decade like Tron Legacy or the recent live action Ghost in the Shell that suffered the same fate being out of step with the times but didn't have the very large inbuilt fanbase of Starwars that Rogue One did. I mean even with Marvel I'v often heard WInter Solider called a dull film as well were as increasingly its viewed as one of the best of the MCU but bigger fans of it.

The issue with TFA and TLJ for me like ABrams Trek films is that I think they basically operate by throwing action, nostalgia, humour and plotting at the viewer so rapidly you don't really have time to digest it when you first watch it. TLJ especially kind of left me with a "what did I just watch?" feeling and I can see some people in that position just taking the view "it must have been good then" when really a little more thought and a second viewing actually confirmed "nope it was a bit of a sloppy mess of a film".

Going back and trying to watch TFA at home for me was a bit of an eye opener for me as well, it shifted from an okish diversion to just a bad film on the same kind of level as the prequels, alebit with somewhat different weaknesses.

 

[sh1tehawke]

Rogue One was the only one of the new films that felt like a classic star wars film to me. They really captured the spirit and look of the original imo, how everything looked a bit grubby. I enjoyed how some of the actors had 70s style facial hair too, nice attention to detail.

 

[Frank23]

Isaac was bad in the last movie and even worse as Apocalypse in X-Men. I don't trust him.

 

[Eusung]

I would say the issue with Rogue One is probably more general blockbuster viewers. Its a film that's not really in step with what you expect from a modern blockbuster, that is characters who are constantly larger than life and a lot of meta humour. I would say actually you've had a few films in the last decade like Tron Legacy or the recent live action Ghost in the Shell that suffered the same fate being out of step with the times but didn't have the very large inbuilt fanbase of Starwars that Rogue One did. I mean even with Marvel I'v often heard WInter Solider called a dull film as well were as increasingly its viewed as one of the best of the MCU but bigger fans of it.

The issue with TFA and TLJ for me like ABrams Trek films is that I think they basically operate by throwing action, nostalgia, humour and plotting at the viewer so rapidly you don't really have time to digest it when you first watch it. TLJ especially kind of left me with a "what did I just watch?" feeling and I can see some people in that position just taking the view "it must have been good then" when really a little more thought and a second viewing actually confirmed "nope it was a bit of a sloppy mess of a film".

Going back and trying to watch TFA at home for me was a bit of an eye opener for me as well, it shifted from an okish diversion to just a bad film on the same kind of level as the prequels, alebit with somewhat different weaknesses.

I totally hear you on "What did I just watch?" feeling about The Last Jedi.....and that followed by "oh it must be good"....wow do I feel stupid for thinking that way. I give a lot of credit to fans who were able to watch it on one viewing and realize how crappy it was...like Roz Weston in Entertainment Tonight Canada...one of the few mainstream media critics who gave it a negative review, and he's a Star Wars fan.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

I totally hear you on "What did I just watch?" feeling about The Last Jedi.....and that followed by "oh it must be good"....wow do I feel stupid for thinking that way. I give a lot of credit to fans who were able to watch it on one viewing and realize how crappy it was...like Roz Weston in Entertainment Tonight Canada...one of the few mainstream media critics who gave it a negative review, and he's a Star Wars fan.

Its really Micheal Bay style cinema for me were everything is pushed along so rapidly that plotholes and flaws in logic don't becomes quite as apparent on first viewing, add in constant rug pulling twists and I think beyond Disney influence and politics you have a lot of the reason for the critical praise.

There does seem to be an obsessions with people rating cinema the instant the credits roll these days and sticking to that opinion forever more as if every cinema going is the words greatest critic.

 

[Eusung]

Its really Micheal Bay style cinema for me were everything is pushed along so rapidly that plotholes and flaws in logic don't becomes quite as apparent on first viewing, add in constant rug pulling twists and I think beyond Disney influence and politics you have a lot of the reason for the critical praise.

There does seem to be an obsessions with people rating cinema the instant the credits roll these days and sticking to that opinion forever more as if every cinema going is the words greatest critic.

Yeah before when thinking about how the movie got critical acclaim...I was puzzled. I was thinking maybe the critics just gave the movie a pass because they didn't want to be harassed by SW fans....or maybe they were scared of getting on Disney's bad side.

Nowadays, I don't think the critics were scared of Disney or bought. I think they genuinely didn't catch the glaring plotholes because of the reason you just wrote - it just moves too fast. And a professional critic doesn't wanna write "I can't form a stance on this movie because I'm feeling a little confused" -that's just a bad look for professional critics.

Critics are supposed to analyze film...this film moves too fast to analyze well on one viewing.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Yeah before when thinking about how the movie got critical acclaim...I was puzzled. I was thinking maybe the critics just gave the movie a pass because they didn't want to be harassed by SW fans....or maybe they were scared of getting on Disney's bad side.

Nowadays, I don't think the critics were scared of Disney or bought. I think they genuinely didn't catch the glaring plotholes because of the reason you just wrote - it just moves too fast. And a professional critic doesn't wanna write "I can't form a stance on this movie because I'm feeling a little confused" -that's just a bad look for professional critics.

Critics are supposed to analyze film...this film moves too fast to analyze well on one viewing.

I would say both together helped, if you were inclined to give the film a positive review due to those things then it made it favourable to do so.

It doesn't help as well that the standards of film critics today are at an all time low, a high perecentage of net reviewers are basically just people who blaged themselves into their position plus again I think a lot of playing to the lowest common demoninator. The appeal of someone like Chris Stuckman is that his criticism is so simplistic its very easy to understand on a casual youtube viewing.

 

[Eusung]

I would say both together helped, if you were inclined to give the film a positive review due to those things then it made it favourable to do so.

It doesn't help as well that the standards of film critics today are at an all time low, a high perecentage of net reviewers are basically just people who blaged themselves into their position plus again I think a lot of playing to the lowest common demoninsator. The appeal of someone like Chris Stuckman is that his criticism is so simplistic its very easy to understand on a casual youtube viewing.

Yeah, and I ate his simplistic criticism up.

Collider is even worse. When reviewing the spin off SW movies...their main criticisms are:

-no opening crawl
-the soundtrack doesn't sound like John Williams SW
-Lack of the Imperial March theme

....seriously?? Those are the main flaws they caught in those films??? They are actually encouraging more more of the same old same old.

I actually found the lack of an opening crawl refreshing. And I didn't want the imperial march theme because that song wasn't introduced until ESB. That's another issue I have with new fans watching the movies in chronological order. When they reach the OT....they feel that everything is repetitive because they already saw the same aliens, ships, music, and dialogue in the prequels and spin offs.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Yeah, and I ate his simplistic criticism up.

Collider is even worse. When reviewing the spin off SW movies...their main criticisms are:

-no opening crawl
-the soundtrack doesn't sound like John Williams SW
-Lack of the Imperial March theme

....seriously?? Those are the main flaws they caught in those films??? They are actually encouraging more more of the same old same old.

I actually found the lack of an opening crawl refreshing. And I didn't want the imperial march theme because that song wasn't introduced until ESB. That's another issue I have with new fans watching the movies in chronological order. When they reach the OT....they feel that everything is repetitive because they already saw the same aliens, ships, music, and dialogue in the prequels and spin offs.

The phase "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing" comes to mind when talking about these kinds of reviewers. Like so much of Youtube I think you end up with a situation were its not the most knowledgeable people who rise to the top but rather those with the easiest message to digest and stuff like Stuckman or Lessons from the Screenplay is exactly that for me. People with very limited understanding of cinema putting far too much weight on their questionable analysis.

Really I would trust the opinon of an average joe viewer far more than these people, for one thing less agenda but more importantly they just view the film as its ment to be viewed. They might not understand the more advanced film making processes their seeing in scripting, directing or acting but they do respond to them were as such reviewers end up viewing films though their own simplified prism often misunderstanding higher quality cinema or overplayed the strengths of poor cinema.

These something rather egotstical about this kind of reviewing as well for me, I think you'd find that most more qualified reviewers would also view the film more as intended and then go back and consider why it was or wasn't successful for them rather than viewing it as a kind of check list.

 

[Eusung]

Funny thing is whenever these channels (screenjunkies, collider, etc) talk or speculate about SW episode IX....they don't seem excited at all.

I think they are genuinely worried for their reputation after so many of their followers unsubscribed after they defended TLJ by saying bots contributed to its low audience rottentomatoes score. That was like the nail in the coffin for people who were on the fence.

Many Ep 8 really gave some us a lot of perspective and self-reflection LOL