Sparring with stronger people

B

boxerz

Guest
I'm only 5'6" 145lbs and cutting so I'm generally smaller than most of the people I roll with. I end up rolling with guys a lot bigger and stronger and a lot of the times I feel like a rag doll not able to get anywhere. Some guys go light but still they won't let you get anywhere so I feel like I'm not able to use any of the techniques I learn.

Well anyway, people keep saying to me, if you roll with stronger guys, you get better. I find this statement so wrong. It's like you are able to bench 225lbs max but they set 250lbs on the bar and it's not possible to gain any strength when you can't even get the bar off your chest.

I believe as for strength/endurance progression, you have to fight someone on your level or slightly above your level. That way you have a chance of a struggle going both ways. I rolled against a weaker guy but he is far more technical and experienced. I was able to use the half guard pass technique that we learned that day. I managed to pass his half guard and get into sidemount and finished with an arm triangle. I was able to use something I learned because I wasn't dominated by someone so much stronger than me. Does anyone else feel this way?
 
Keep training, you will be FORCED to use technique if you want to survive vs the big boys. You are wrong, I'm just telling you now. You are probably new though, you will realize how silly you are a year later.
 
boxerz said:
I'm only 5'6" 145lbs and cutting so I'm generally smaller than most of the people I roll with. I end up rolling with guys a lot bigger and stronger and a lot of the times I feel like a rag doll not able to get anywhere. Some guys go light but still they won't let you get anywhere so I feel like I'm not able to use any of the techniques I learn.

Well anyway, people keep saying to me, if you roll with stronger guys, you get better. I find this statement so wrong. It's like you are able to bench 225lbs max but they set 250lbs on the bar and it's not possible to gain any strength when you can't even get the bar off your chest.

I believe as for strength/endurance progression, you have to fight someone on your level or slightly above your level. That way you have a chance of a struggle going both ways. I rolled against a weaker guy but he is far more technical and experienced. I was able to use the half guard pass technique that we learned that day. I managed to pass his half guard and get into sidemount and finished with an arm triangle. I was able to use something I learned because I wasn't dominated by someone so much stronger than me. Does anyone else feel this way?
Click to expand...

You live in baltimore and drive out all the way to 88 to train?
 
it's in elkridge, about 25min drive, i grew up in columbia area so i'm around there half the times. i don't know of many bjj gyms
 
When you are first starting use your speed, they are slower than you. Avoid being on bottom like the plague. Later, you will learn how to work from the bottom, but for now use quickness to take the top. Once you get on top, don't worry about tapping them, focus on control. Once you can control them the submissions will be there.

PS- They also gas faster than you, work on your cardio, never let them rest and keep moving. You strength against a bigger or taller guy is in tight.
 
ic, i'm in baltimore county atm, not inside the city so it is a 25min drive to that as well. they seem to have a nice system, it seems a bit more MMA fixated but i am interested in doing muay thai/mma in the future.
 
HeadBanger said:
When you are first starting use your speed, they are slower than you. Avoid being on bottom like the plague. Later, you will learn how to work from the bottom, but for now use quickness to take the top. Once you get on top, don't worry about tapping them, focus on control. Once you can control them the submissions will be there.

PS- They also gas faster than you, work on your cardio, never let them rest and keep moving. You strength against a bigger or taller guy is in tight.
Click to expand...

i'm not much of a top person, i like to usually pull guard no matter how much stronger they are. i make them work from my rubber guard and i try to sweep if i can into the mount where it's the only place i feel i have a tremendous advantage on a bigger person. i've rolled with a couple 200-225lbers but those people aren't the issue cause usually if you are that big, you aren't in the best shape. it's the strong 170-180lbers that give me a lot of trouble. most people at that weight are in good condition, decently experienced, and strong so i feel like in all those aspects, i'm outperformed. i'm not clueless on what to do, i've been training for a few months but i just feel like if someone is stronger than you and have the same technique or slightly better, there isn't much of a shot. i can see i have improved but the days where i'm getting rolled by bigger guys, i feel like i'm not progressing at all.
 
I get a lot out of grappling with bigger and stronger guys. It makes you do everything perfectly to get anything to work. You can't jump the gun and power through a pass or sweep because you happen to be explosive, you have to acquire the correct positioning and apply the proper setup with the proper timing in order to have success. It simply makes you do things right. That said, some things are very tough to practice if you are always on bottom or outclassed or even just badly outmuscled, but there is a lot to learn from working with people who really require you to use the right technique and timing to gain any kind of advantage.
 
boxerz said:
i'm not much of a top person, i like to usually pull guard no matter how much stronger they are. i make them work from my rubber guard and i try to sweep if i can into the mount where it's the only place i feel i have a tremendous advantage on a bigger person. i've rolled with a couple 200-225lbers but those people aren't the issue cause usually if you are that big, you aren't in the best shape. it's the strong 170-180lbers that give me a lot of trouble. most people at that weight are in good condition, decently experienced, and strong so i feel like in all those aspects, i'm outperformed. i'm not clueless on what to do, i've been training for a few months but i just feel like if someone is stronger than you and have the same technique or slightly better, there isn't much of a shot. i can see i have improved but the days where i'm getting rolled by bigger guys, i feel like i'm not progressing at all.
Click to expand...

Fighting against a variety of guys is best IMO, but fighting against big guys can make your defense solid.

Did you ever think that your success in passing the guard of a guy who is your size with a bunch of experience had something to do with the fact that you are used to training with people bigger than you?

Training with people who are stronger than you is a blessing. You just have to train your perspective on free sparing. For example if you are trying to work rubber guard (for whatever reason) just work on keeping them broken down. If you do that consider it a victory for yourself. The next time you train try to sweep them off the stack. If you can accomplish that once or twice consider that a victory. Than as you get better start working transitions, pins and subs. Once you finally go up against guys your size it should be a walk in the park.
 
boxerz said:
ic, i'm in baltimore county atm, not inside the city so it is a 25min drive to that as well. they seem to have a nice system, it seems a bit more MMA fixated but i am interested in doing muay thai/mma in the future.
Click to expand...

I mean we offer everything, yeah 3 times a week you can do GI, monday through sat its Nogi, boxing and Muay thai.

Henry smith is a really good stand up coach plus they just brought in a new Boxing coach to help out.
 
most people have suggested rolling with bigger guys will improve your techinque and i agree.
being 145lbs myself i have found working escapes with people of all sizes has proven the best in terms of building confidence. if you know how to escape side mount from a 200 lbs guy then ur guard tends to feel a bit more comfortable.
moral of the story: techinque rules power; escapes lead to more confidence
 
boxerz said:
I'm only 5'6" 145lbs and cutting so I'm generally smaller than most of the people I roll with. I end up rolling with guys a lot bigger and stronger and a lot of the times I feel like a rag doll not able to get anywhere. Some guys go light but still they won't let you get anywhere so I feel like I'm not able to use any of the techniques I learn.

Well anyway, people keep saying to me, if you roll with stronger guys, you get better. I find this statement so wrong. It's like you are able to bench 225lbs max but they set 250lbs on the bar and it's not possible to gain any strength when you can't even get the bar off your chest.

I believe as for strength/endurance progression, you have to fight someone on your level or slightly above your level. That way you have a chance of a struggle going both ways. I rolled against a weaker guy but he is far more technical and experienced. I was able to use the half guard pass technique that we learned that day. I managed to pass his half guard and get into sidemount and finished with an arm triangle. I was able to use something I learned because I wasn't dominated by someone so much stronger than me. Does anyone else feel this way?
Click to expand...

I am the exact same size 5'6" 145 and I fight usually at 139 or 142 (depending on the tournament.

My advice is to get strong. Now don't take that as get bigger , just get stronger. Go to the S&P for how to do this. You should be at 225 315 405 (bench, squat, DL, respectively).

Learn how to armdrag, learn the DLR, learn how to use shoulder pressure, learn how to keep pressure between transitions, if you give a big guy any chance you're fucked. I got subbed the other day by a blue belt that had 80+ lbs on me (I've been a purple belt for over 3 year, and he is a former D linebacker for UF) because I went for a sneaky choke, missed, and he got side control. After that it was just a matter of time.

The first time you get in a tournament with someone your own size and you grab their wrist, when they go to jerk their hand away but can't you'll be happy all your training partners are giant monsters.
 
Going against bigger guys really improves your technique because you cant muscle your way out of anything. When I first started I would get thrown around at will and mounted and submitted. Months and months go by and thats not happening anymore. Just the other day I triangled a guy 100lbs heavier than me. I'm just about 130lbs. So rolling with heavier guys does help you from my experience.
 
Calibur said:
Fighting against a variety of guys is best IMO, but fighting against big guys can make your defense solid.

Did you ever think that your success in passing the guard of a guy who is your size with a bunch of experience had something to do with the fact that you are used to training with people bigger than you?

Training with people who are stronger than you is a blessing. You just have to train your perspective on free sparing. For example if you are trying to work rubber guard (for whatever reason) just work on keeping them broken down. If you do that consider it a victory for yourself. The next time you train try to sweep them off the stack. If you can accomplish that once or twice consider that a victory. Than as you get better start working transitions, pins and subs. Once you finally go up against guys your size it should be a walk in the park.
Click to expand...

i do realize one thing, my defense is a lot more solid than my offense since i'm usually on the defensive against stronger guys. i guess that is a benefit with working with stronger people. i guess my mentality was i wasn't able to be too offensive against stronger guys because i could never get a control of their wrists or to a dominant position. i have beaten guys a lot bigger than me (225lbs) but they were complete newbies, the ones that try to submit you while they are in your guard but yea, i do try to gas them out and sweep.

whipyourasstyle said:
I am the exact same size 5'6" 145 and I fight usually at 139 or 142 (depending on the tournament.

My advice is to get strong. Now don't take that as get bigger , just get stronger. Go to the S&P for how to do this. You should be at 225 315 405 (bench, squat, DL, respectively).

Learn how to armdrag, learn the DLR, learn how to use shoulder pressure, learn how to keep pressure between transitions, if you give a big guy any chance you're fucked. I got subbed the other day by a blue belt that had 80+ lbs on me (I've been a purple belt for over 3 year, and he is a former D linebacker for UF) because I went for a sneaky choke, missed, and he got side control. After that it was just a matter of time.

The first time you get in a tournament with someone your own size and you grab their wrist, when they go to jerk their hand away but can't you'll be happy all your training partners are giant monsters.
Click to expand...
Damn, you put up those numbers? I am on par with bench strength but I've been working on squatting mainly and deadlifts secondary. What's DLR? One of my biggest weaknesses is grips, I climb rope without using my legs to help improve it once in a while but I also have an issue with gripping the bar when I dead lift as well.
 
As for the CoC's I know a guy that recently did two reps each hand on a #3. un-fucking-believable!!!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,247,559
Messages
56,202,931
Members
175,107
Latest member
AntMcQueen

Share this page

Back
Top