So Jon Jones can pulse turinabol metabolites from inadvertent use but not clomiphene metabolites?

[dim_]

Thats right i don’t care about baseless opinions regardless of which idiot it comes from. The fact is that jones tested positive for three banned substances multiple times and neither you or any corrupt cog at USADA or UFC can come up with a valid, proven explanation. Am I wrong? .

What you are missing is this:

+ There is no evidence at all, that his recent atypical findings for DHCMT long term metabolite M3 are the result of a fresh ingestion after July 2017.

If there is no evidence of a fresh ingestion, USADA simply cannot charge him with an anti doping violation. Its not possible under the WADA code.






It doesnt matter what you or I may "think" or what hunches we may have, or what Jones prior history may be. It doesnt even matter if there are or arent excretion studies on m3, or evidence of other athletes doing it.

They do not have evidence its a fresh ingestion. Without that, they cannot charge him.

 

[dim_]

I’m just not a blind cum cuzzling fanboy, show me the evidence documenting any athlete pulsing turinabol and I will suck jon off myself.

Firstly. Jones is not "pulsing turinabol". At no point has he been "pulsing turinabol".

He is pulsing long term metabolite m3 which comes from a chlorinated steroid (it could be something other than turinabol)

https://ufc.usada.org/testing/results/sanctions/



Secondly, theres two other cases just in the UFC

Grant Dawson

https://www.mmafighting.com/2019/3/...second-chance-after-jon-jones-like-usada-case

Muslim Salikhov

https://www.mmafighting.com/2019/3/...oping-case-similar-to-one-involving-jon-jones

Do you prefer strawberry or banana cock rub or are you happy to just suck jons cock as it is?

 

[Towerworld]

What you are missing is this:

+ There is no evidence at all, that his recent atypical findings for DHCMT long term metabolite M3 are the result of a fresh ingestion after July 2017.

If there is no evidence of a fresh ingestion, USADA simply cannot charge him with an anti doping violation. Its not possible under the WADA code.




It doesnt matter what you or I may "think" or what hunches we may have, or what Jones prior history may be. It doesnt even matter if there are or arent excretion studies on m3, or evidence of other athletes doing it.

They do not have evidence its a fresh ingestion. Without that, they cannot charge him.

There is never 100% complete evidence of a fresh ingestion, using your logic any fighter caught with PED's could have been pulsing from PED abuse or contaminated substances 20 years ago.

Multiple positive drug tests over the course of a year demonstrate continued ingestion of banned substances unless there is evidence of metabolite pulsing, in this case there is not any whatsoever so USADA is merely making baseless assumptions.

Anyways, I know that USADA nor NSAC will overlook Jones's positive tests in the future and I don't really care anymore I've accepted it. I'm just telling you that their explanation is for said positive tests is faulty and based on nothing.

 

[kflo]

There is never 100% complete evidence of a fresh ingestion, using your logic any fighter caught with PED's could have been pulsing from PED abuse or contaminated substances 20 years ago.

Multiple positive drug tests over the course of a year demonstrate continued ingestion of banned substances unless there is evidence of metabolite pulsing, in this case there is not any whatsoever so USADA is merely making baseless assumptions.

Anyways, I know that USADA nor NSAC will overlook Jones's positive tests in the future and I don't really care anymore I've accepted it. I'm just telling you that their explanation is for said positive tests is faulty and based on nothing.

don't forget vada, smrtl, wada, csac.....

and again, it's you making the baseless assumptions......

it's all public and not a single anti-doping expert has taken YOUR position on this. globally. it's literally transparent to the entire world and not one expert has taken a public position against what they have publicly done.

 

[Towerworld]

don't forget vada, smrtl, wada, csac.....

and again, it's you making the baseless assumptions......

it's all public and not a single anti-doping expert has taken YOUR position on this. globally. it's literally transparent to the entire world and not one expert has taken a public position against what they have publicly done.

and NO one cares, prove that jon jones pulsed m3 metabolites or go away.

 

[kflo]

and NO one cares, prove that jon jones pulsed m3 metabolites or go away.

you realize this is built into usada policy now? recognized by wada? it's not going away.....

 

[dim_]

There is never 100% complete evidence of a fresh ingestion, using your logic any fighter caught with PED's could have been pulsing from PED abuse or contaminated substances 20 years ago..

I didnt say it needed 100% evidence.

I said there is NO evidence

And there is NO evidence its a fresh ingestion.

 

[dim_]

Multiple positive drug tests over the course of a year
.

He hasnt had multiple "positive tests"

he has had multiple "atypical findings"

An ATF is not the same as an AAF (adverse analytical finding)

 

[Mortal Wombat]

Common offenders in this thread.

 

[Katsumi Yamada]

if he's allowed to cheat, what is he doing? what is his protocol for tbol that results in only pulsing traces of m3 metabolites? i don't think you can answer.

No I can't answer. All I know is that he's allowed to fight with banned substances in his system.

 

[Katsumi Yamada]

Which explains why he has been suspended for years.

He was suspended for 2 years for using a substance which they have said takes 7 years to get out of his system.

How pathetic does that sound?

Ban should be minimum 7 years followed by a 1 year probation where he has to pass 4 random tests within the year, if not passed then the ban extended to life.

 

[Arne Rud]

They all use almost, and I have said it a long time

 

[San Griente]

Here's a controlled dose administered excretion study of clomiphene (something that Jones has popped for before)

https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article-abstract/104/3/906/5115462 (Which I downloaded a copy of before there was a paywall)

And yes pulsing ("Undetectability followed by Redetectability") is a thing.

USADA, UFC, and co. substantiated pulsing with this paper to say that Jones' most recent positive tests were the result of residual metabolites left over in his system from previous use (which they claimed was inadvertent). They also claimed Jones' clomiphene positive test was from inadvertent use.

There seems to be an inconsistency here;

1) Use a paper on clomiphene metabolites and apply it to turinabol metabolites (let's grant this premise)

2) Conclude that Jones can pulse metabolites from inadvertent use of turinabol.

3) But he's not pulsing metabolites from inadvertent use of clomiphene?

Shouldn't he be pulsing (\have pulsed) clomiphene metabolites? Why just turinabol metabolites?

Is it because they didn't test him "for awhile" following his UFC 200 positive test?

@-Dim- pointed out that I'm conflating the viewpoints of UFC damage control and USADA. Fair point. In this post I'm addressing the former. He also pointed out that "<LOD" should not be conflated with "negative" which makes this study flawed, thus making any inference that Novitzky and Co. draw from this paper questionable.

"Until you post your M.D. with PhD post-doc from Peer Review U., you need to stfu and listen to the experts who all agree that Jones is clean!" -Sherdog Hall Monitors

 

[San Griente]

It’s interesting that the "pulsing" phenomenon was utterly unknown to medical science prior to the Jones fiasco:

 

[UsernameLOL]

It’s interesting that the "pulsing" phenomenon was utterly unknown to medical science prior to the Jones fiasco:

View attachment 654711


View attachment 654719

Granted "pulsing" is a colloquial term it still seems like they are proposing a paradigm shift for Jones' sake. If they would just come out and admit that he's being given the benefit of doubt because of a (very) slim margin of plausible deniability I think I would be satisfied.

But if they admitted this then they would have to admit that their highest priority is preserving athletes innocence over preserving a drug free sport. In certain instances those two conflict.

But hell what do I know?

Right now, I'm trying to figure out why the magnetic field inside a rectangular waveguide for EM waves is in fact an ellipse (or at the very least an elongated squircle) for the TE-1,0 mode. Yes, "squircle" is a thing. And I'm feeling like a goddamn moron. I'm also drunk. I am but a humble physics grad student (in the last semester of my masters).

 

[UsernameLOL]

"Until you post your M.D. with PhD post-doc from Peer Review U., you need to stfu and listen to the experts who all agree that Jones is clean!" -Sherdog Hall Monitors

Also, it's not like these findings can be properly scientifically scrutinized. After all, as far as I know they are not submitted to peer review in say Analytical Chem Journals or Bio Chem Journals. I think if someone used this the Jones' case as evidence of novel excretion patterns/behavior they would be laughed off the face of the planet.

The reason "no other anti-doping expert has criticized the pulsing explanation" is because all "anti-doping experts" (a sub class of analytical chem and bio chem) are in some sense subsumed by WADA and thus bound by WADA protocols. Namely the protocol which says something to the effect of "upon second offense for the same drug/metabolite it is WADA's burden to show re-ingestion" which is nearly impossible to do given the lack of excretory data.

Either way, how the fuck is the magnetic field inside a waveguide in the TE-1,0 mode a fucking "squircle"? What the fuck?

 

[San Griente]

Also, it's not like these findings can be properly scientifically scrutinized. After all, as far as I know they are not submitted to peer review in say Analytical Chem Journals or Bio Chem Journals. I think if someone used this the Jones' case as evidence of novel excretion patterns/behavior they would be laughed off the face of the planet.

The reason "no other anti-doping expert has criticized the pulsing explanation" is because all "anti-doping experts" (a sub class of analytical chem and bio chem) are in some sense subsumed by WADA and thus bound by WADA protocols. Namely the protocol which says something to the effect of "upon second offense for the same drug/metabolite it is WADA's burden to show re-ingestion" which is nearly impossible to do given the lack of excretory data.

Either way, how the fuck is the magnetic field inside a waveguide in the TE-1,0 mode a fucking "squircle"? What the fuck?

Your first part is very well expressed. Believe it or not, I have seen work published in august medical journals that is even more transparently "political" than the WADA/Jones affair as you describe it. I hope that this doesn’t happen in the journals in your field. I like to believe that there are still a couple of realms, such as Chemistry, where Reason is king.

Your second part is astonishing, although I have no idea what it means. Are you saying that you are on the verge of accomplishing that goal, striven for through the millennia yet heretofore unrealized, of Squaring the Circle? If so, the Key to the Mysteries will have been lain at your feet. Or maybe you’ll just have finally been broken on the corner’d wheel like the rest of us damned souls, reduced to professing belief in absurdities in order to stay employed.

STEM away, all day, I say. Committing to "the humanities" was the worst choice I ever made.

 

[UsernameLOL]

Your first part is very well expressed. Believe it or not, I have seen work published in august medical journals that is even more transparently "political" than the WADA/Jones affair as you describe it. I hope that this doesn’t happen in the journals in your field. I like to believe that there are still a couple of realms, such as Chemistry, where Reason is king.

Your second part is astonishing, although I have no idea what it means. Are you saying that you are on the verge of accomplishing that goal, striven for through the millennia yet heretofore unrealized, of Squaring the Circle? If so, the Key to the Mysteries will have been lain at your feet. Or maybe you’ll just have finally been broken on the corner’d wheel like the rest of us damned souls, reduced to professing belief in absurdities in order to stay employed.

STEM away, all day, I say. Committing to "the humanities" was the worst choice I ever made.

No not on the verge of anything revolutionary (I wish) just trying to establish on my own what has already been established. (But not very well justified in the numerous undergrad/grad electromagnetism books that I have). Notice how the magnetic fields in the tubes are "rounded rectangles" that's what I was getting at. Although in the most fundamental "TE-mode" (Tranverse Electric Mode) I think the magnetic field degenerates to an ellipse.

https://www.allaboutcircuits.com/up...se-electric-and-transverse-magnetic-modes.png (Click the link the picture is gigantic)

Humanities have their place and utility, but I find STEM far more interesting.

 

[kflo]

Granted "pulsing" is a colloquial term it still seems like they are proposing a paradigm shift for Jones' sake. If they would just come out and admit that he's being given the benefit of doubt because of a (very) slim margin of plausible deniability I think I would be satisfied.

But if they admitted this then they would have to admit that their highest priority is preserving athletes innocence over preserving a drug free sport. In certain instances those two conflict.

But hell what do I know?

Right now, I'm trying to figure out why the magnetic field inside a rectangular waveguide for EM waves is in fact an ellipse (or at the very least an elongated squircle) for the TE-1,0 mode. Yes, "squircle" is a thing. And I'm feeling like a goddamn moron. I'm also drunk. I am but a humble physics grad student (in the last semester of my masters).

Why are you now calling it a (very) slim margin of plausible deniability? Again, it’s far more likely than proposed alternative hypotheses.

 

[San Griente]

No not on the verge of anything revolutionary (I wish) just trying to establish on my own what has already been established. (But not very well justified in the numerous undergrad/grad electromagnetism books that I have). Notice how the magnetic fields in the tubes are "rounded rectangles" that's what I was getting at. Although in the most fundamental "TE-mode" (Tranverse Electric Mode) I think the magnetic field degenerates to an ellipse.

https://www.allaboutcircuits.com/up...se-electric-and-transverse-magnetic-modes.png (Click the link the picture is gigantic)

Humanities have their place and utility, but I find STEM far more interesting.

Back in the 80’s, a friend of mine was a post-grad EE designing missile-guidance systems. I got him to drop acid, and it triggered a major crisis of conscience. He felt like it was his fault that Uncle Sam was bombing little brown people.

He had no other way to make money than advanced signal-processing stuff, so he thought he was screwed. Then he dropped acid again, got an inspiration, and created the world’s first effective electronic guitar tuner (he was also a metalhead). Now he owns a factory cranking out nice things like DACs and pre-amps.

Engineering is awesome,