side control

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by zicherja, Dec 16, 2005.

  1. zicherja

    zicherja White Belt

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    I got my ass whipped the other day from a stronger and better grappler than myself.

    The problem is I do not know what the hell I could have done differently.

    When I had him in side control, I felt like I was riding a bull. He was bucking me off. I tried two variations of holding him down; chest to chest, one arm by hip and one elbow by head on the other side. The other variation was from the Sauol Robeiro tape where you place your entire weight on his hips to "control" him. Needless to say, I couldn't keep him down let alone secure anything close to a submission.

    When he was on side of me, I kept real tight and tried to hip escape out--I couldn;t even budge him. he was real dynamic transitioning to north south, other side, knee on belly and mount within seconds. Even keeping my elbows tight and protecting myself, he got armbars at will.

    Very discouraging because I wasn't doing anything wrong that I know of. I was quite embarrased. Usually when I get owned, I can think of things that I did wrong or could have done differently.

    SO, here is the question:


    How do you prefer controlling your opponent in side control; chest to chest or placing your hips on top of theirs with legs sprawled out?
     
  2. knoxpk

    knoxpk Black Belt

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    From side I like to be chest to chest with my legs sprawled away from their body, I also keep my hips off the mat. This puts max pressure on them and helps hold them in place. It also allows you to adjust to their movements.
    The downside is that its not a very aggressive sub position BUT once you have settled the bucking down then you can move your knees in closer to a more agressive position.
     
  3. triso

    triso Green Belt

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    I prefer chest to chest, elbow against his hip, knee against his hip, and hand under his head grabbing his gi around the shoulder area and pulling him towards the mat.

    I also like to make sure that the shoulder near my leg is not flat on the mat, but in my stomach area, forcing them to look away from me, making it more difficult to turn into me, and easier to take the back.
     
  4. Terrier

    Terrier Brown Belt

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    I'm told north south is a better option than side control when you're facing someone much bigger/stronger than you.

    I wouldn't know cause i never get off my back :/
     
  5. FStep

    FStep Brown Belt

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    he escaped because he knew escapes that you didn't know therefore you didn't see them coming and didn't adjust to stop them simple as that you can't really stop a much more experienced person from escaping just by using the basics ... in time your side control techniques will develop just be patient
     
  6. oc10spray

    oc10spray Blue Belt

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    When in side control were you just looking to maintain position or really looking to improve what you had? Or, were you not there long enough to decide? If I've got a guy who I don't think I can hold in side control very long (I usually know that before I even get to that position) I always go straight for north south or mount. If I'm gonna get swept or something, I'm going to do it while being aggressive and trying something, anything. Sometimes you'll find that someone bucking hard, etc will open up something you never thought would be there...
     
  7. Bama Zulu

    Bama Zulu Blue Belt

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    To keep someone from bucking like that this is what I do. Underhook head with left arm, under hook their far arm with my right arm, clasp my hands together and drive my shoulder into their face. Then sprawl out and keep your hips low.

    This is a variation of two positions and I find it's almost impossible to get out of. Just keep your hips really low and when you sprawl on them don't push straight down, push foward and down. If you go against flexible guys then they will get their legs in if you don't have your hips low enough.

    You can also try transitioning into N/S position or even Knee on belly. When people spazz out on my when in side body control I just pop up in knee on belly and pull up on their body to gas them out and calm them down. Then go into a more submission friendly position.
     
  8. Bama Zulu

    Bama Zulu Blue Belt

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    Oh and important thing I feel you may have been missing. When going against stronger/better grapplers and you are on the bottom your job is to make space right? Well that does not mean making space by pushing him, push YOURSELF away. This small detail helped my game tons when going against bigger guys. Try to move yourself away, not him.
     
  9. Big Red

    Big Red Green Belt

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    Simple things like this took me ages to click with. So simple yet so true. Good point BZ.
     
  10. Cameron

    Cameron Green Belt

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    well put thats why its best to prolly get some wrestling training.
     
  11. Brad

    Brad Yellow Belt

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    yes yes yes yes yes!.. I love this, the best part is, this is not lost transitioning from gi to no gi. another subtlety is that if you're up against a really explosive guy who's stronger than you, when you sink your hips and sprawl your legs out, keep on your toes with one or both feet, you'll still have your hips low, but if he goes with and explosive buck and tries to shrimp or hip out, you can drive into him and he ain't goin' nowhere.
     
  12. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    I have been having good luck with the Bama Zulu approach ... it's a hybrid of the lock the head/arm approach and the Saulo approach of smashing down on the hip with your legs off the mat and your hip low.

    Basically I make sure my weight is driving in, and not supported by the mat, keep the hips low and driving into the other guy's hips, and then as the final element make sure to have control over his head, so that his back is flat to the mat. You want to control both the head and the hip, that's the key.

    You will get bucked at the hip, but as long as you stay loose, keep the head pinned, and keep forward pressure, it shouldn't matter.
     
  13. TapouTime

    TapouTime Guest

    chest to chest.. arm under his neck and his far arm pit.. palmstogether , weight on his chest, use your shoulder against his chin and drive it down this is VERY IMPORTANT.. if his chin is looking away he cannot turn because of his neck and he wil have no power.. keep your legs away from his so he doesnt pull half guard
     
  14. Bama Zulu

    Bama Zulu Blue Belt

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    Another important tip is to squeeze real hard before transitioning into N/S or Knee mount. Like when you are going to pop up into Knee mount place one hand on their hip closet to you and their shoulder farthest from you, press down as hard as you can with all your weight when you pop up and slide your knee in quickly.

    And when going into N/S, continue underhooking the far arm, but let go of the grip and block the hip closet to you with your other arm.
     
  15. ATTfighter

    ATTfighter Blue Belt

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    if you cant hold him down from side control move to the head and get a north south position, it should be a little easier to control him from there
     

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