SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: Week 67 Discussion - The Room

[Guestx]

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Here's a quick list of all movies watched by the SMC. Or if you prefer, here's a more detailed examination.



@jeicex decided to make his week a torture chamber of hilarious badness, and so this week we'll be talking about The Room.

Our Director​

The Room is directed by TOMMY WISEAU.

Wiseau's best known production is the film The Room, released in 2003. Its budget was $6 million, the financing of which has remained a source of intrigue. The film was based on an unpublished 540-page novel written by Wiseau himself. The movie was immediately lambasted by critics, but ultimately became a "cult classic" with late-night showings at theaters around the world. Audience members typically arrive wearing wigs resembling their favorite characters, interact with the dialogue on screen, and throw plastic cutlery and footballs around the theater. This attention grew into what was dubbed The Room's 2010–2011 "Love is Blind" International Tour, with the movie being screened in the United Kingdom, Germany, Denmark, Australia and India, among other locations. Wiseau appears at many of these events, posing for photographs with fans and often addressing the audience before screenings.

In 2004, Wiseau produced and appeared in a short documentary, Homeless in America. In 2010, Wiseau acted in a short film entitled The House That Drips Blood on Alex, a parody horror film written and produced by sketch comedy group Studio8. The film had a preview showing at Comic-Con on July 24, 2010. It premiered on Comedy Central and appeared online on October 14, 2010.

Wiseau has stated that he has been influenced by the films The Guns of Navarone and Citizen Kane, and specifically the actors James Dean and Marlon Brando.[23][25][29] According to Sestero, Wiseau's obsession with James Dean was so intense that he often visited a Los Angeles restaurant owned by a former acquaintance of Dean, and that several lines of dialogue in The Room (including the infamous cry "You are tearing me apart, Lisa!") were based on lines from Rebel Without a Cause.

In the upcoming film adaptation of The Disaster Artist, James Franco is set to portray Wiseau. Franco also won a Golden Globe for playing James Dean in 2001. Wiseau approved of the choice, as well as that of Dave Franco playing Disaster Artist author/friend Greg Sestero.

In March 2015, Tommy claimed in a Reddit "ask me anything" thread that he had commenced work on a new project named "The Foreclosure". He also was featured as the villain Linton Kitano in Samurai Cop 2: Deadly Vengeance, the sequel to the cult classic Samurai Cop. In October 2016, it was announced that Wiseau, alongside his The Room co-star Greg Sestero, would star together in a new movie called Best F(r)iends. The movie was written by Sestero and was shot in secret in Los Angeles.

Our Stars​

Tommy Wiseau: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1382072/

Greg Sestero: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0802995

Juliette Danielle: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1382799/

Film Overview and YouTube Videos​

Premise: Johnny is a successful banker who lives happily in a San Francisco townhouse with his fiancée, Lisa. One day, inexplicably, she gets bored with him and decides to seduce his best friend, Mark. From there, nothing will be the same again.

Budget: $6 million
Box Office: $1,800

​

Trivia
(courtesy of IMDB)​

* Greg Sestero stated in his book The Disaster Artist that Tommy Wiseau took 32 takes to say the lines "It's not true! I did not hit her! It's bullshit! I did not. Oh, hi, Mark!" Wiseau sometimes needed cue cards to help him with his lines.

* According to Juliette Danielle, when Tommy Wiseau said the line "In a few minutes, bitch," everyone on the set began laughing at him. Wiseau came out of the bathroom and demanded to know what was so funny.

* According to Greg Sestero, Tommy Wiseau submitted the film to Paramount, hoping to get them as the distributor. Usually, it takes about two weeks to get a reply. The film was rejected within twenty-four hours.

* Entire scenes were out of focus because nobody bothered to check the lens.

* Shot simultaneously on 35 mm film and high-definition video. Tommy Wiseau was confused about the differences between the formats, so he used both cameras on the same mount. He also purchased the cameras, instead of renting them as film productions usually do.

* According to Greg Sestero's book, Tommy Wiseau insisted on having his bare bottom filmed. "I have to show my ass or this movie won't sell" was Wiseau's reasoning.

* Tommy Wiseau claims to have financed the film by importing and selling leather jackets from Korea. He refuses to further elaborate on this. But according to Greg Sestero's book "The Disaster Artist", he said Tommy financed the film from working in real estate and entrepreneurship.

* After a very limited theatrical run, the film has become popular as a "midnight movie," with a cult following. Audience members dress up as the characters, throw plastic spoons at the screen, and toss footballs to each other. Tommy Wiseau attends many screenings, and holds Q&A sessions with the audience.

* Filming took over six months. In that time, two cinematographers (along with their crews) resigned and three actors left, being either recast or replaced with a completely different character.

* According to Greg Sestero, Tommy Wiseau intended for the film to contain a subplot in which Johnny was revealed to be a vampire, due to Wiseau's own fascination with the creatures. Sestero recounts how, at the outset of production, Wiseau tasked members of the crew with figuring out a way to execute a sequence in which Johnny's Mercedes Benz would lift off from the roof of the townhouse and fly across the San Francisco skyline, revealing Johnny's vampiric nature. Wiseau eventually decided to drop the subplot after learning that there was no practical way to film the flying car scene on the production's budget.

* The film's editor tried to convince Tommy Wiseau to cut the shot of his naked ass from the movie, on the grounds that the sight of it scared his wife.

* The reason why Peter seemed dazed and was touching things in one scene was because the actor had suffered a concussion and Tommy Wiseau wouldn't let him leave for treatment.

* Unlike most movies, where the sets are generally closed while filming nude sequences, Tommy Wiseau insisted that the set be open while filming the long love scene between Lisa and Johnny.

* Tommy Wiseau was adamant about only using English in the movie. While shooting the 'Mark and Johnny play catch' scene Greg Sestero said 'catch this' in French and Tommy lost his cool and tackled him saying 'No French dammit!'.

* After filming the first love scene, Tommy Wiseau decided to write in a second love scene, but the actress playing Lisa was uncomfortable. As a compromise, the second love scene between Johnny and Lisa was created from unused shots from the first love scene (which is why the candles are already lit when they arrive).

* Much of the furniture and decor for the living room set was a complete display room taken from the window of a thrift shop. The glass-top television table supported by white pillars belonged to Tommy Wiseau. When the cinematographer complained that the set was too sparsely furnished, Wiseau sent the art department out to buy new items. They returned with framed pictures of plastic spoons, which Wiseau, impatient to continue filming, ordered hung up. Plastic spoons have become a staple of midnight screenings of the film, often being thrown at the screen upon the occurrence of a spoon shot. There are thirty-four spoon shots.

* Tommy Wiseau esoterically addressed several fan questions in a special Q&A feature filmed for the DVD release. Among these are "Why is it called 'The Room'?" (to which Wiseau replies that the title is meant to evoke a safe place for viewers) and "Why is everyone playing football in tuxedos and standing only three feet apart?" (which Wiseau doesn't answer except to say that football is fun and that playing it without protective gear is a challenge).

* The original script was significantly longer than the one used during filming, and featured a series of lengthy monologues; it was edited on-set by the cast and script supervisor, who found much of the dialogue incomprehensible. Speaking to Entertainment Weekly, one anonymous cast member claimed that the script contained "stuff that was just unsayable. I know it's hard to imagine there was stuff that was worse. But there was".

* Many of the crew members had to conceal their laughter about what they were witnessing. Even the cameraman began to laugh so hard the camera would shake during takes. The first DP even had his own tent where he would laugh out of sight, while ostensibly watching the footage.

* Most of the crew were convinced the film would never be seen by anyone.

* Tommy Wiseau insisted on the entire cast being present during the filming of every scene, in case he suddenly felt like throwing them into the background.

* Tommy Wiseau actually made Juliette Danielle cry when he tactlessly pointed out that she had pimples and everyone heard it.

* Juliette Danielle was shocked by the lengthy sex scenes during a screening; she thought they were going to last a couple of seconds. In fact, Tommy Wiseau was so pleased with the sex scene footage that he wanted all of it in the film, before being talked out of it by the editor. The first sex scene between Johnny and Lisa was nearly six minutes before being cut in half.

* Although the rooftop scenes were shot with green screen, an actual rooftop was available but never used during filming.

* While filming the fight between Johnny and Mark, Tommy Wiseau really was hurting Greg Sestero. By the end of it, the latter had bruises all over his arms and wrists from the former's hands, which have apparent "cyborg-like strength".

* On the first day of filming, Tommy Wiseau and Greg Sestero showed up to the set several hours late. (Greg arrived to pick up Tommy on time, but Tommy has a very different biological clock). Tommy's first act was to bark orders at the production crew, saying they were too slow and being unprofessional. Again, this was the first day.

* The film was promoted almost exclusively through a single billboard in Hollywood, located on Highland Avenue just north of Fountain, featuring an image Tommy Wiseau refers to as "Evil Man": an extreme close-up of his own face with one eye in mid-blink. Although more conventional artwork was created for the film, featuring the main characters' faces emblazoned over the Golden Gate Bridge, Wiseau chose the "Evil Man" for what he regarded as its provocative quality; around the time of the film's release, the image led many passers-by to believe that The Room was a horror film. Despite the film's failure to enjoy immediate success, Wiseau paid to keep the billboard up for over five years, at the cost of $5,000 a month. Its bizarre imagery and longevity led to it becoming a minor tourist attraction. When asked how he managed to afford to keep the billboard up for so long in such a prominent location, Wiseau responded: "Well, we like the location, and we like the billboard. So we feel that people should see The Room (2003). [...] we are selling DVDs, which are selling okay."

* Michael Rousselet and Scott Gairdner started the cult movement in 2003 upon seeing the first initial run of The Room in theaters. Mesmerized and obsessed, they brought a hundred friends to the final four screenings during the last three days of The Room's theatrical run. They ran amock in the theater bringing props such as spoons, football, and roses as a sort of "viking funeral" believing the film would never be seen again.

* In an interview with Entertainment Weekly, script supervisor Sandy Schklair claimed that it was he who actually handled the direction of the film. According to Schklair, Tommy Wiseau was too busy with his acting duties leaving Schklair to do the directing. Schklair's claim was corroborated in the article by a cast member who remained anonymous. Greg Sestero partially corroborates Schklair's version of events, describing him taking charge of numerous sequences in which Wiseau found himself unable to remember lines properly or adequately interact with the rest of the cast; Sestero further questioned Schklair's desire to receive a directorial credit, equating it with bragging about "[working] on the Hindenburg". Wiseau said of Schklair's assertion, "Well, this is so laughable that... you know what? I don't know, probably only in America it can happen, this kind of stuff."

* Greg Sestero's venomous delivery of "Keep your stupid comments in your pocket" is due to him channelling all the frustrations of the shoot, and imagining he was actually saying to Tommy Wiseau "Why are you doing this to me?"

* Carolyn Minnott had always wanted to act and this was one of the only parts she could get. As such, she gave it everything she had, even nailing a scene right after being hospitalized for heat stroke.

* When Kyle Vogt tried to bring up that legally, Greg Sestero could not be filmed until they signed a contract, Tommy Wiseau replied "I hire you as actor, smart guy! Act!"

* Tommy Wiseau paid for a small television and print campaign in and around Los Angeles, with taglines calling The Room "a film with the passion of Tennessee Williams".

* The budget for the film reached $6 million, all of which was spent on production and marketing. Tommy Wiseau has claimed that the reason the film was relatively expensive was because many members of the cast and crew had to be replaced, and each of the cast members had several understudies.

* Greg Sestero considered leaving the set due how difficult it was. He stayed because he needed the money.

* The costume designer was working with a limited budget and was forced to go to thrift shops.

* While filming establishing shots in a high-end residential area of San Francisco, Tommy Wiseau got into an argument with a police officer, who asks to see their filming permit (which Tommy insisted they wouldn't need). After a few minutes, the crew immediately start packing everything with a lens or a cable and fled.

* Two cinematographers quit the film early in filming. The first, Rafael Smadja left after only three days, accusing Tommy Wiseau of being unprofessional and impossible to work with. His replacement, Graham Futerfas quit when Wiseau refused to pay the still photographer after trying to cancel her call time at 3 in the morning, and also because Wiseau wanted to get rid of the generator that was powering the set, even though they were still shooting in there.

* Todd Barron was the film's third director of photography. He was a cameraman who was one of the few people who didn't walk out with the second director. He just asked for the job, and got it.

Members: @shadow_priest_x @europe1 @iThrillhouse @chickenluver @jeicex @MusterX @Coolthulu @Scott Parker 27 @the muntjac @Caveat @FierceRedBelt @RabidJesus

 

[MusterX]

Oh my lord, what in the FUUUUCKKKKKKKK @jeicex

Ok now that we have that out of the way. This is a good ole classic story about a whore done with all time great bad acting. The acting is so bad I have to believe they were told to act in that manner. Lisa, played by Juliette Danielle, likes to bang, almost to the point of it being distracting. I thought I was watching some Showtime soft core porn for the first half hour of the movie. She isn't even that good looking but she is strangely seductive. I'm not sure I could resist her. So basically, would.

According to Juliette Danielle, when Tommy Wiseau said the line "In a few minutes, bitch," everyone on the set began laughing at him. Wiseau came out of the bathroom and demanded to know what was so funny.

I actually laughed as well. It was just hilarious the way he said it.

The plot was just as horrible as the acting. From scene to scene there were weird emotional discrepancies. Lisa would say I don't love Johnny anymore or something like that then in the next scene act as if nothing is wrong and she does love Johnny. The entire thing is just strange to watch play out, even more so when you realize all of us probably have met someone like Lisa. They are out there, by the tens of thousands and they will bang your best friend or your brother or whoever if they decide they are done with you. I don't guess its an indictment against women because men behave in the same manner. The difference is women wield seduction like a nuclear weapon.

An interesting statement in the movie was, "Women are either too beautiful, too ugly, or too smart." I'm not sure what this says about relationships but I found some of these nuggets of truth in the film despite how horrible it really is. Look at Johnny's fuck this gay earth moment for an example of how bad the film is and realize that every actor in this film is equally as bad.



I was going to five this movie a 4 out of 10 but Lisa showed her tits multiple times so I raised it to 4.9. Then I realized the acting and plot is so bad its special in its own way and had to revise the rating up again.

5.7/10, but in a good way.

 

[europe1]

Our Stars​

Can this word really be used with a straight face in this context?

Anyways, some random thoughts. I've seen this film before so I'm just listing some things that I thought about while watching it.

* The film puport itself to be a "torrid drama", which was changed to a "Black Comedy" once the fan-machine started working. But it's basically a 90's skinemax movie. There's like what, 4 sex scenes in this film? All filmed in that soft-core, roses and pillows style. Frankly... I don't even think Shannon Tweed could have saved this one.

* I don't think I need to point out that Wiseau obviously have no idea how humans work. He doesn't seem to understand motivations, mannerisms or basic conversations. According to wikipedia he claims that he spent most of his life in New Orleans. Yet that's disputed and it's clear that his mastery of the language is very lacking. Part of me wonders just how much of the ineptness is due to his cognitive deficiencies and how much its just foreginess. Wiseau seems to be completely oblivious to certain western social customs, for example, like how the kid interacts with them. But considering how the insipidness just seeps through every pour of the movie, I'm betting that it's the former that is to blame.

* Related to what I was talking about... notice how basic the word-use is. It's not only that the dialogue is heavily based on hefty exposition and reads like something no one would ever say. Wisaue uses words like "future-wife", "future husband" when he could have just used a word like fiance. Why!? Is his english really so lacking that he doesn't even know the word fiance?`

* My favorite part of the film is when Lisa is talking to her mother. Mom says that she has cancer and they utterly gloss over that subject and never bring it up again. Then Lisa tells her that Tommy beats her to which the mom responds with total incredulity. Yeah it's a lie -- but mom just tosses her accusations aside on the spot and says that Tommy is such an angle that he would never do that. WTF? Who the fuck reacts like that when hearing that their daughter has been abused? Who is so casual about it?

* Wisae laughs when he's heard that a woman who was sleeping around with a dozen men get's beaten into a coma? WTF? I'd say that's Tommy trying to inject some darkness into his character but nope -- he probably though that was funny and justified. Explains a lot about how he writes his female characters though.

 

[europe1]

Forgot to add...

* The ending of the movie basically makes it a "You'd all be sorry if I was Gone" fantasy. Tommy dies and everyone is heartbroken -- lamenting what an excellent guy he was. Even Lisa who utterly despised him wails at his corpse (nice continuity). It's all rather... infantile really, and utterly egocentrical. Like something that a moapy child would write.

 

[europe1]

They are out there, by the tens of thousands and they will bang your best friend or your brother or whoever if they decide they are done with you. I don't guess its an indictment against women because men behave in the same manner. The difference is women wield seduction like a nuclear weapon.

To be fair though -- it's seems like Wiseau thinks that's just how normal women act.

It's also odd because... apparently Lisa and Tommy have been genuinely in love up until a certain point. They're even engaged (future husband/wife as Tommy would say). Yet, for some reason, Lisa just becomes a cold-blooded seductress over a very short time span. The motivations for this is blurred. She doesn't seem to be able to articulate any other reasoning other than "just because". Nor can she explain her sudden character drift other than "I just grew into it". And she's utterly callous to Tommy's own emotions -- despite being purportedly in love with him previously.

I mean... the closest I can come up with is Lisa's mom always talking about material needs while she wants sensual one, creating some sort of repressed-upbringing scenario where she unhealthily externalises all those locked-away desires in adulthood. But that doesn't seem to be so much character development as just how Wiseau sees women and marriage in their "status quo" state.

She isn't even that good looking but she is strangely seductive

I thought she was had a pretty sensual face. Not classically beautiful but carved with certain voluptuous qualities. Lusty-looking I guess... especially with that make-up.

 

[MusterX]

To be fair though -- it's seems like Wiseau thinks that's just how normal women act.

It's also odd because... apparently Lisa and Tommy have been genuinely in love up until a certain point. They're even engaged (future husband/wife as Tommy would say). Yet, for some reason, Lisa just becomes a cold-blooded seductress over a very short time span. The motivations for this is blurred. She doesn't seem to be able to articulate any other reasoning other than "just because". Nor can she explain her sudden character drift other than "I just grew into it". And she's utterly callous to Tommy's own emotions -- despite being purportedly in love with him previously.

I mean... the closest I can come up with is Lisa's mom always talking about material needs while she wants sensual one, creating some sort of repressed-upbringing scenario where she unhealthily externalises all those locked-away desires in adulthood. But that doesn't seem to be so much character development as just how Wiseau sees women and marriage in their "status quo" state.



I thought she was had a pretty sensual face. Not classically beautiful but carved with certain voluptuous qualities. Lusty-looking I guess... especially with that make-up.

Yea you are trying to make sense of a very disjointed plot line that often doesn't make sense. Its awful in so many ways but then sometimes its funny and what was up with that ending? I didn't see that coming at all. I mean I get that he was distraught over his situation but suicide didn't feel right to me. Its like it didn't fit at all to me. Did he put that in there just to make a social statement about the impact that men and women have on each other?

And yes, I think lusty-looking fits.

 

[europe1]

Did he put that in there just to make a social statement about the impact that men and women have on each other?

Frankly, I just think that he's a very egocentric person and constructed the film around that.

The theme of The Room is that Tommy is a stand-up guy. He loves his wife. He is the best of friends. He takes care of kids. The neighborhood loves him. Hell, Lisa's mom even thinks better of him than her own spawn. As the trivia mentioned: he put that ass-shot in the film to sell tickets. Tommy Wisaue thinks that he is sexy, and therefore films himself naked to further endear him to the audience.

Yet he is beaten by the feminine capriciousness of his wife and treacherous friends. It's the story of a perfect, lovable person being beaten by the vagrancies of caricatures. I think that Wisaue meant this as a tragedy. We were meant to feel sad at the injustice of Tommy dying in the ending. How could something so cruel happen to such a nice person? You even have the rest of the cast morning at his corpse, them just being overcome with what a wonderful guy he was.

Wisaue made a film where he was perfect and the subject of a grand tragedy. Of course, he failed so utterly in doing that that it became a comedy instead.

 

[MusterX]

* I don't think I need to point out that Wiseau obviously have no idea how humans work. He doesn't seem to understand motivations, mannerisms or basic conversations. According to wikipedia he claims that he spent most of his life in New Orleans. Yet that's disputed and it's clear that his mastery of the language is very lacking. Part of me wonders just how much of the ineptness is due to his cognitive deficiencies and how much its just foreginess. Wiseau seems to be completely oblivious to certain western social customs, for example, like how the kid interacts with them. But considering how the insipidness just seeps through every pour of the movie, I'm betting that it's the former that is to blame.

I knew a guy similar to this one time named Victor that gave a strange impression during conversation. The way he replied just seemed empty, the tone of his voice didn't fit the words he was speaking. It was almost like he was just speaking the lines he thought you might want to hear but they always felt empty. Similar to something simple as Johnny saying hi to Denny. Its just......off.

 

[chickenluver]

So this movie starts and we have nice establishing shots of San Francisco, the bay, the bridge, some of the city. I liked the music by Mladen Milicevic a lot, particularly in this opening sequence. This set the mood well.

In the credits we see that one man was the director/writer/producer/executive producer/star so we know were about to witness the work of an auteur. Tommy Wiseau has a very unique acting style. He really puts his whole self into every line, like Brando, De Niro or Mifune. Most of the others get easily overshadowed by him. I wonder if he's a method actor. It might make it difficult to direct while in character, but I guess in this case it would be ok since Johnny is such a smart and good person. They would have to film the end of the picture last because it would be very difficult for Wiseau to direct while Johnny is suffering such mental and emotional distress. But I'm getting ahead of myself.

Johnny is a very likable character. He's clearly very kind and loving. He practically raised Denny, he supports Lisa and buys her flowers and dresses and showers her with rose petals while he makes love to her, he even pet the doggie in the flower shop, how could anyone not love this guy? Sadly from very early we can tell he's going to betrayed. His fiancee Lisa is revealed almost immediately to be a dumb whore when she seduces Johnny's best friend Mark. This guy Mark seems oblivious at first, and to his credit he rightly points out that it's wrong and tries to resist, but then he gives easily, and who could blame him really?

My favorite character (aside from Johnny obviously) was Lisa's mother Claudette. Everything she said was so logical. Every time Lisa would drone on about I don't Love Johnny I love Mark her mom would try to set her straight, tell her marriage has nothing to do with love, pointing out that Lisa was too dumb to provide for herself without a man taking care of her. She was awesome, I loved her. She really was the voice of the audience, saying what everyone was thinking, like when they walked in on those random people getting it on in the apartment and Claudette says What are these characters doing here? or when Lisa says I'm sleeping with someone else, mom says who, Lisa says I don't want to talk about it, mom says Then why did you bring it up? lmao good fucking question. It's a shame we never found out more about how her treatment for breast cancer was going, but Lisa said people are getting cured everyday and Claudette said she would be fine, so I'm sure she got that taken care of.

I really loved Denny as well, his sweetness and naivety was very endearing, like when he didn't realize he was trying to initiate a threesome with Johnny and Lisa. They may as well have let him stay and watch, what harm could that do? I really felt for him when he was trying to tell Johnny that he wants to bang Lisa, and Johnny says It's ok to love Lisa Denny, she's basically your mom. Thanks Johnny that's really what Denny wants to hear. Johnny has a good heart, but could sometimes be a little naive, I guess that's where Denny learned it.

It wasn't the main focus of the film, but they did a commendable job with some of the side plots illustrating the dangers of getting involved with drugs. The scene of Denny getting threatened was one of the most tension filled of the film. And did you see how violent Mark got with Peter after smoking that reefer cigarette? He almost threw him off the building and killed him for God's sake! Most people nowadays want to deny the dangers of the Devil's lettuce.

Those scenes of Johnny and Mark throwing the football around in the park and jogging were really heartbreaking to watch knowing this evil woman was coming in between them.

The tension in the party scene was so thick you could cut it with a knife. It's here Mark fully crosses over to the dark side, making out with Lisa while everyone's outside, dancing so close with Lisa in front of everybody, actually daring to put his hands on Johnny etc. I was really hurting for Johnny. He should have whupped Mark's ass, but I respect that he chose to be the bigger man.

It's tragic that Johnny couldn't get over Lisa and took his own life, but who knows how one would react having dedicated years to this woman and being betrayed by her and his best friend of all people. Hearing their conversation on the tape was clearly the last straw. We get a room destroying scene at least on par with the one from Citizen Kane, then the heart-wrenching moment when Johnny shoots himself to death. To compound the tragedy Denny sees what has happened and knows he has to go through life without his surrogate father. It's just as Johnny says, if a lot of people loved each other the world would be a better place to live.

The sex scenes seemed rather long and numerous for a serious drama, especially one made in prudish USA, but I'm not afraid of erotic cinema, so no complaints from me.

I know this movie has been compared to Citizen Kane, which I can understand because of the director/writer/producer/star aspect, but I get more of a Tennessee Williams influence, particularly A Streetcar Named Desire. I don't want to get ahead of myself and say that Wiseau is a modern combination between Orson Welles and Tennessee Williams, but he's clearly shown great potential.

8/10 This is a very good drama, even profound at times. 2 points knocked because not enough Johnny.

 

[MusterX]

This scene is so incredibly awkward, I could take 3 drunk Sherdoggers, let @shadow_priest_x film it, and it would be better by order of magnitude.

 

[MusterX]

This is pretty funny, 50 awkward moments in The Room. It pretty much encapsulates all the things that make this film "special."

 

[chickenluver]

* My favorite part of the film is when Lisa is talking to her mother. Mom says that she has cancer and they utterly gloss over that subject and never bring it up again. Then Lisa tells her that Tommy beats her to which the mom responds with total incredulity. Yeah it's a lie -- but mom just tosses her accusations aside on the spot and says that Tommy is such an angle that he would never do that. WTF? Who the fuck reacts like that when hearing that their daughter has been abused? Who is so casual about it?

Claudette knows Johnny doesn't drink and that he's not violent, so right away she has reason to doubt Lisa's story. She reacts because she knows when she's being lied too, she's a very shrewd woman.

 

[MusterX]

Claudette knows Johnny doesn't drink and that he's not violent, so right away she has reason to doubt Lisa's story. She reacts because she knows when she's being lied too, she's a very shrewd woman.

You notice how she kept repeating that Johnny didn't get his promotion? She said it three or four times in the movie. Without that cheddar she decided to move on which makes her look even more shallow and as @europe1 has posted, it seems like this is a situation where the director, Tommy Wiseau, views women as driven by money rather than real love.

 

[Guestx]

Well if nothing else, I can confirm that the rumors are true: This movie sucks dick.

And while I can get how some people might find this film to be so-bad-it's-good, I mostly found it to be so-bad-it's-boring-as-fuck. Yes, it's terrible, but it's terrible in a dull way. Unlike say, a movie like Troll 2, which is actually terrible while also managing to have some entertainment value.

I will say that nearly every entertaining moment that DOES exist belongs to Tommy Wiseau. The dude is obviously so batshit crazy, while simultaneously completely lacking in acting talent, that he does yield a few positive moments. In fact, I think the only entertaining moment in the film that does not involve him is the hilarious bit where Z-grade Paul Walker acts like he's about to throw the psychologist guy off the building.

It blows my mind that this dude had $6 million to blow on the making of a film and this is what he came up with. Let me remind you guys that Primer only cost $7,000; Sound of My Voice was only $130,000; and Blue Ruin was only $450,000. But this dude had $6 million and the end result was this film.

If I make a genuine effort to say something nice about it, I guess. . .

I thought the main actress actually wasn't terrible. If you took her out of this movie and dropped her into some shit like Melrose Place then she'd actually fit in pretty well. And the young kid was probably the second best performer, for whatever that's worth, and could probably fit in well on a sitcom or something.

But 99% of this film really does suck, from the questionable camerawork (like the cameraman making little microadjustments, either because he's just inexperienced or the actors didn't properly hit their marks), to the shitty soundtrack, to the flat lighting, to the amateur hour ADR, to the overly obvious use of greenscreen on the obviously fake rooftop set.

This is one of those films that I think that any "movie person" needs to see, because it's one of those films that's out there in the public consciousness and it's helpful to be able to have a conversation about it, so for that reason alone I'm glad I've finally seen it and can mark it off. But I think that I am largely immune to the so-bad-it's-good effect. For me, that kind of thing is amusing for about five minutes. I really prefer to spend my time watching films that are so good because they are actually good.

 

[Guestx]

I thought I was watching some Showtime soft core porn for the first half hour of the movie.

That's exactly what I thought as well.

Not Showtime, though. Cinemax. Specifically Cinemax After Dark, circa 1995. Because that's EXACTLY what all the sex scenes looked like.

She isn't even that good looking but she is strangely seductive. I'm not sure I could resist her. So basically, would.

She's not a bombshell, but I like girls who are cute in a slightly off-beat way and she falls into that category.

According to Juliette Danielle, when Tommy Wiseau said the line "In a few minutes, bitch," everyone on the set began laughing at him. Wiseau came out of the bathroom and demanded to know what was so funny.

So much of the trivia is hilarious. A few of my favorites:

* According to Greg Sestero's book, Tommy Wiseau insisted on having his bare bottom filmed. "I have to show my ass or this movie won't sell" was Wiseau's reasoning.

* The original script was significantly longer than the one used during filming, and featured a series of lengthy monologues; it was edited on-set by the cast and script supervisor, who found much of the dialogue incomprehensible. Speaking to Entertainment Weekly, one anonymous cast member claimed that the script contained "stuff that was just unsayable. I know it's hard to imagine there was stuff that was worse. But there was".

* Many of the crew members had to conceal their laughter about what they were witnessing. Even the cameraman began to laugh so hard the camera would shake during takes. The first DP even had his own tent where he would laugh out of sight, while ostensibly watching the footage.

Also, why the fuck did it take him six months to finish principal photography? Six months? For this? A film that has no real action, very little in the way of moving camera, and is only 100 minutes long?

 

[Guestx]

To be fair though -- it's seems like Wiseau thinks that's just how normal women act.

It's also odd because... apparently Lisa and Tommy have been genuinely in love up until a certain point. They're even engaged (future husband/wife as Tommy would say). Yet, for some reason, Lisa just becomes a cold-blooded seductress over a very short time span. The motivations for this is blurred. She doesn't seem to be able to articulate any other reasoning other than "just because". Nor can she explain her sudden character drift other than "I just grew into it". And she's utterly callous to Tommy's own emotions -- despite being purportedly in love with him previously.

I dunno, I think she may have been a golddigger from the start. She attached herself to him because he was able to afford her the kind of life she was looking for, materially speaking. And she thought that was enough.

Eventually she realized that wasn't really enough, especially as the wedding day began to loom. She wanted more: excitement, passion, etc. And since she's basically a sociopath, once she realized this, she began pursuing those things.

 

[MusterX]

Well if nothing else, I can confirm that the rumors are true: This movie sucks dick.

And while I can get how some people might find this film to be so-bad-it's-good, I mostly found it to be so-bad-it's-boring-as-fuck. Yes, it's terrible, but it's terrible in a dull way. Unlike say, a movie like Troll 2, which is actually terrible while also managing to have some entertainment value.

I will say that nearly every entertaining moment that DOES exist belongs to Tommy Wiseau. The dude is obviously so batshit crazy, while simultaneously completely lacking in acting talent, that he does yield a few positive moments. In fact, I think the only entertaining moment in the film that does not involve him is the hilarious bit where Z-grade Paul Walker acts like he's about to throw the psychologist guy off the building.

It blows my mind that this dude had $6 million to blow on the making of a film and this is what he came up with. Let me remind you guys that Primer only cost $7,000; Sound of My Voice was only $130,000; and Blue Ruin was only $450,000. But this dude had $6 million and the end result was this film.

If I make a genuine effort to say something nice about it, I guess. . .

I thought the main actress actually wasn't terrible. If you took her out of this movie and dropped her into some shit like Melrose Place then she'd actually fit in pretty well. And the young kid was probably the second best performer, for whatever that's worse, and could probably fit in well on a sitcom or something.

But 99% of this film really does suck, from the questionable camerawork (like the cameraman making little microadjustments, either because he's just inexperienced or the actors didn't properly hit their marks), to the shitty soundtrack, to the flat lighting, to the amateur hour ADR, to the overly obvious use of greenscreen on the obviously fake rooftop set.

This is one of those films that I think that any "movie person" needs to see, because it's one of those films that's out there in the public consciousness and it helpful to be able to have a conversation with it, so for that reason alone I'm glad I've finally seen it and can mark it off. But I think that I am largely immune to the so-bad-it's-good effect. For me, that kind of thing is amusing for about five minutes. But I really prefer to spend my time watching films that are so good because they are actually good.

Watching Tommy act is like if you took someone with Asperger's syndrome and told them to act in an emotional role.

 

[MusterX]

That's exactly what I thought as well.

Not Showtime, though. Cinemax. Specifically Cinemax After Dark, circa 1995. Because that's EXACTLY what all the sex scenes looked like.



She's not a bombshell, but I like girls who are cute in a slightly off-beat way and she falls into that category.



So much of the trivia is hilarious. A few of my favorites:

* According to Greg Sestero's book, Tommy Wiseau insisted on having his bare bottom filmed. "I have to show my ass or this movie won't sell" was Wiseau's reasoning.

* The original script was significantly longer than the one used during filming, and featured a series of lengthy monologues; it was edited on-set by the cast and script supervisor, who found much of the dialogue incomprehensible. Speaking to Entertainment Weekly, one anonymous cast member claimed that the script contained "stuff that was just unsayable. I know it's hard to imagine there was stuff that was worse. But there was".

* Many of the crew members had to conceal their laughter about what they were witnessing. Even the cameraman began to laugh so hard the camera would shake during takes. The first DP even had his own tent where he would laugh out of sight, while ostensibly watching the footage.

Also, why the fuck did it take him six months to finish principal photography? Six months? For this? A film that has no real action, very little in the way of moving camera, and is only 100 minutes long?

LOL, where is @jeicex , he needs to answer for this.

Six months, six million dollars. Takes a while to spend that money. How the fuck did he get 6 million dollars? Coherence was made for $50,000 and shot in 5 nights.

 

[Guestx]

Watching Tommy act is like if you took someone with Asperger's syndrome and told them to act in an emotional role.

According to his IMDB bio:

Tommy Wiseau is an American actor, director, screenwriter & producer. He trained to be an actor at: American Conservatory Theater, Vince Chase Workshop, Jean Shelton Acting Lab, Laney College and Stella Adler Academy of Acting.

If that's actually true, it kind of blows my mind to think that he might have ANY kind of formal training.

 

[Guestx]

So this movie starts and we have nice establishing shots of San Francisco, the bay, the bridge, some of the city. I liked the music by Mladen Milicevic a lot, particularly in this opening sequence. This set the mood well.

In the credits we see that one man was the director/writer/producer/executive producer/star so we know were about to witness the work of an auteur. Tommy Wiseau has a very unique acting style. He really puts his whole self into every line, like Brando, De Niro or Mifune. Most of the others get easily overshadowed by him. I wonder if he's a method actor. It might make it difficult to direct while in character, but I guess in this case it would be ok since Johnny is such a smart and good person. They would have to film the end of the picture last because it would be very difficult for Wiseau to direct while Johnny is suffering such mental and emotional distress. But I'm getting ahead of myself.

Johnny is a very likable character. He's clearly very kind and loving. He practically raised Denny, he supports Lisa and buys her flowers and dresses and showers her with rose petals while he makes love to her, he even pet the doggie in the flower shop, how could anyone not love this guy? Sadly from very early we can tell he's going to betrayed. His fiancee Lisa is revealed almost immediately to be a dumb whore when she seduces Johnny's best friend Mark. This guy Mark seems oblivious at first, and to his credit he rightly points out that it's wrong and tries to resist, but then he gives easily, and who could blame him really?

My favorite character (aside from Johnny obviously) was Lisa's mother Claudette. Everything she said was so logical. Every time Lisa would drone on about I don't Love Johnny I love Mark her mom would try to set her straight, tell her marriage has nothing to do with love, pointing out that Lisa was too dumb to provide for herself without a man taking care of her. She was awesome, I loved her. She really was the voice of the audience, saying what everyone was thinking, like when they walked in on those random friends getting it on on the apartment and Claudette says What are these characters doing here? or when Lisa says I'm sleeping with someone else, mom says who, Lisa says I don't want to talk about it, mom says Then why did you bring it up? lmao good fucking question. It's a shame we never found out more about how her treatment for breast cancer was going, but Lisa said people are getting cured everyday and Claudette said she would be fine, so I'm sure she got that taken care of.

I really loved Denny as well, his sweetness and naivety was very endearing, like when he didn't realize he was trying to initiate a threesome with Johnny and Lisa. They may as well have let him stay and watch, what harm could that do? I really felt for him when he was trying to tell him that he wants o bang Lisa, and Johnny is like It's ok to love Lisa Denny, she's basically your mom. Thanks Johnny that's really what Denny wants to hear. Johnny has a good heart, but could sometimes be a little naive, I guess that's where Denny learned it.

It wasn't the main focus of the film, but they did a commendable job with some of the side plots illustrating the dangers of getting involved with drugs. The scene of Denny getting threatened was one of the most tension filled of the film. And did you see how violent Mark got with Peter after smoking that reefer cigarette? He almost threw him off the building and killed him for God's sake! Most people nowadays want to deny the dangers of the Devil's lettuce.

Those scenes of Johnny and Mark throwing the football around in the park were really heartbreaking to watch knowing this evil woman was coming in between them.

The tension in the party scene was so thick you could cut it with a knife. It's here Mark fully crosses over to the dark side, making out with Lisa while everyone's outside, dancing so close with Lisa in front of everybody. I was really hurting for Johnny. He should have whupped Mark's ass, but I respect that he chose to be the bigger man.

It's tragic that Johnny couldn't get over Lisa and took his own life, but who knows how one would react having dedicated years to this woman and being betrayed by her and his best friend of all people. Hearing them on the take was clearly the last straw. We get a room destroying scene at least on par with the one from Citizen Kane, then the heart-wrenching moment when Johnny shoots himself to death. To compound the tragedy Denny sees what has happened and knows he has to go through life without his surrogate father. It's just as Johnny says, if a lot of people loved each other the world would be a better place to live.

The sex scenes seemed rather long and numerous for a serious drama, especially one made in prudish USA, but I'm not afraid of erotic cinema, so no complaints from me.

I know this movie has been compared to Citizen Kane, which I can understand because of the director/writer/producer/star aspect, but I get more of a Tennessee Williams influence, particularly A Streetcar Named Desire. I don't want to get ahead of myself and say that Wiseau is a modern combination between Orson Welles and Tennessee Williams, but he's clearly shown great potential.

8/10 This is a very good drama, even profound at times. 2 points knocked because not enough Johnny.

LOL. Somehow I ended up reading the last line of your post first, and it let me know I was in store for some prime Grade-A bullshit.

I appreciate the laugh. I needed that.