Serious Movie Discussion XLII

[Bubzeh]

The Accountant. Brilliant film. Loved it.

 

[burningspear]

In a Valley of Violence. Ethan Hawke gives an extraordinarily charisma free impersonation of the man with no name, so laughably limp it makes you realise just what an absolute fucking presence Clint had, legend.

 

[HenryFlower]

Just popping in to say Arrival was fucking dope. My FOTY2016 so far

 

[Ricky13]

Just popping in to say Arrival was fucking dope. My FOTY2016 so far

God I wept like a baby.

 

[HenryFlower]

God I wept like a baby.

Oh man, it took a serious effort to compose myself. My body just went numb. There were more people seeing it than I expected last night, & I've never experienced a silence of that caliber once the credits rolled. Everyone was still sitting in their seats for a good while as if it were a Marvel movie.

 

[HenryFlower]

Have I missed any discussion on the film? If so, a link would be appreciated so I can read through what was said. I've been a stranger for far too long.

 

[Ricky13]

Place is dead yo.

I am not aware of any discussions, though I'll chime in if it's brought up.

I loved it. Coarsely, it was Interstellar with a guy behind the wheel who knows how to channel ideas without grounding the film. You're constantly trying to keep up with everything - plot, motivation etc. - but he's landing emotional blows all the same.

Villeneuve is kind of a beast. Scares me a little. Lol.

 

[Bullitt68]

Place is dead yo.

That's because @Flemmy Stardust and @Sigh GunRanger are too cool for school while @europe1, @BeardotheWeirdo, and @chickenluver are cheating on us with @shadow_priest_x and the Movie Club.



I have to admit, I've also been slacking on you guys. I'm hoping to have a full draft of my PhD thesis done by next summer and, as I'm sure you know all too well, Ricky, this reading and writing shit takes for-fucking-ever.

Spoiler

Full disclosure: I've also spent the last couple of months locking down a girlfriend.

Anyway, I made it back to Chicago last week in time to be able to watch the UFC's NYC debut on my HD TV. Conor might have a tendency to get annoying, but that little fucker can fight. I haven't loved watching somebody strike the way I love watching Conor since prime Cro Cop. The way I'd marvel at how Cro Cop could dissect people, that's the way I find myself watching Conor. The way he destroyed Eddie was a thing of beauty. Unbelievable timing and accuracy. I don't love listening to him talk, but I love watching him fight.

In the coming weeks, I'll be watching @HUNTERMANIA's picks, starting with Black Swan. I don't know that any of my opinions on any of the films will be so volatile as to kick off another Civil War like the Mad Max Heresy, but I'm sure there'll be some interesting discussions to be had

And Ricky, I don't know what kind of voodoo powers you're working with, but this Friday, on some channel I didn't even know I had and the name of which I don't even know, they're kicking off a marathon of Gilmore Girls. And not just a bunch of episodes, not even just a season or two. They're showing every fucking episode, in order, one after the other. I told you I'd try to get to Gilmore Girls when I got back to the UK after the holidays. Well, it looks like Gilmore Girls is going to be my holiday TV project

 

[Flemmy Stardust]

That's because @Flemmy Stardust and @Sigh GunRanger are too cool for school

@theskza got off easy...

Don't worry, this place has been in its death throes before only to return to glory.

I, of course, miss mixing it up in this thread, but I haven't been watching much of anything lately...or even posting very much. Further, I haven't even really heard about anything coming out that I'm looking forward to.

I did notice that Minority Report is on one of the On Demand channels, and that's one that's been eluding me for a long time.

Spoiler

Full disclosure: I've also spent the last couple of months locking down a girlfriend.

You dog, you!

Anyway, I made it back to Chicago last week in time to be able to watch the UFC's NYC debut on my HD TV. Conor might have a tendency to get annoying, but that little fucker can fight. I haven't loved watching somebody strike the way I love watching Conor since prime Cro Cop. The way I'd marvel at how Cro Cop could dissect people, that's the way I find myself watching Conor. The way he destroyed Eddie was a thing of beauty. Unbelievable timing and accuracy. I don't love listening to him talk, but I love watching him fight.

I'm the same. I can't stand him until his fight starts, and then he starts annoying me again as immediately as the post-fight interview. He better not hold up the lightweight title though...that's been my favorite division since the Gomi days.

Khabib will mangle him, I'm pretty sure. Ferguson is much more interesting, but I see him wearing Conor down even moreso than Diaz did.

 

[ufcfan4]

@theskza got off easy...

Don't worry, this place has been in its death throes before only to return to glory.

I, of course, miss mixing it up in this thread, but I haven't been watching much of anything lately...or even posting very much. Further, I haven't even really heard about anything coming out that I'm looking forward to.

I did notice that Minority Report is on one of the On Demand channels, and that's been one that's been escaping me for a long time.



You dog, you!



I'm the same. I can't stand him until his fight starts, and then he starts annoying me again as immediately as the post-fight interview. He better not hold up the lightweight title though...that's been my favorite division since the Gomi days.

Khabib will mangle him, I'm pretty sure. Ferguson is much more interesting, but I see him wearing Conor down even moreso than Diaz did.

NY card was pretty damn fun. Not the best main card we've seen, but certainly a solid one.

That Wonderboy vs. Woodley fight was something else. That was one of the more entertaining bouts I can think of in recent months. How the hell Wonderboy made it out of the fourth round is beyond me. I scored it a draw as well since I gave Wonderboy three rounds but definitely had Woodley with the 10-8 fourth.

Conor delivered. Eddie is a legend and I've never seen a fighter make him look shitty like that. I mean you survive Cerrone, beat Melendez, beat Pettis, and blitz RDA but Mcgregor makes you look amateurish. That was the result that Dana was hoping for I'm sure.

Can't wait for Pettis vs. Holloway next ppv.

 

[Flemmy Stardust]

NY card was pretty damn fun. Not the best main card we've seen, but certainly a solid one.

That Wonderboy vs. Woodley fight was something else. That was one of the more entertaining bouts I can think of in recent months. How the hell Wonderboy made it out of the fourth round is beyond me. I scored it a draw as well since I gave Wonderboy three rounds but definitely had Woodley with the 10-8 fourth.

Conor delivered. Eddie is a legend and I've never seen a fighter make him look shitty like that. I mean you survive Cerrone, beat Melendez, beat Pettis, and blitz RDA but Mcgregor makes you look amateurish. That was the result that Dana was hoping for I'm sure.

Can't wait for Pettis vs. Holloway next ppv.

Word up on Pettis vs Holloway. Choi vs Swanson as well.

I wasn't much of a fan of the Woodley fight cause I wanted Wonderboy to take it...and he's so much better than what he showed.

Now get this...One of the judges that scored it a draw gave Woodley a 10-8 in the FIRST round...not the 4th?

I scored it 49-48 Wonderboy...but I'm not mad at the 10-8 4th round and subsequent draw. Wonderboy reversed by the end of the round and started landing significant strikes from top. I like to see 10-8s go to rounds where dominance lasts till the bell....but no question Woodley did damage in that round. And I do feel like Woodley won if you score the fight as a whole.

 

[ufcfan4]

Word up on Pettis vs Holloway. Choi vs Swanson as well.

I wasn't much of a fan of the Woodley fight cause I wanted Wonderboy to take it...and he's so much better than what he showed.

Now get this...One of the judges that scored it a draw gave Woodley a 10-8 in the FIRST round...not the 4th?

I scored it 49-48 Wonderboy...but I'm not mad at the 10-8 4th round and subsequent draw. Wonderboy reversed by the end of the round and started landing significant strikes from top. I like to see 10-8s go to rounds where dominance lasts till the bell....but no question Woodley did damage in that round. And I do feel like Woodley won if you score the fight as a whole.

I was all in on Wonderboy to win as well. Awesome dude. Would have been happy if it went his way, but figured it was either going to be a draw or a split for TWood before the cards were read. Biggest problem with round 4 is Woodley came close to finishing it like three times- vicious strikes and then the tight guillotine. While Thompson reversed at the end I felt like if he had landed just a few more flush shots he would have avoided a 10-8. As it stood though, Woodley was moving his head from what I remember and didn't absorb too many full on shots.

Thompson was game as hell though. Few fights that display as much heart as he showed in that round in my opinion.

What'd you think of my girl Joanna vs. KK.

 

[Flemmy Stardust]

What'd you think of my girl Joanna vs. KK.

Watching live I had a lot invested in a JJ finish, and even knowing KK is very durable and strong-willed, I felt like she hadn't faced anyone that was going to put it on her the way JJ would. I thought she'd break eventually.

At some point it became clear that the fight was likely going to a decision and that was a little deflating watching live.

Rewatching it, man, Joanna very much outclassed her at nearly every turn, even as KK was able to sneak some damage in. Even in the 4th where KK had her big moment, Joanna was able to quickly recover, turn things around, and outland KK in the time remaining. I just wasn't expecting KK to live up in toughness against Joanna...but she sure did. I think anyone else would have been wearing it with everything Joanna was landing, but KK is built to last.

 

[ufcfan4]

Watching live I had a lot invested in a JJ finish, and even knowing KK is very durable and strong-willed, I felt like she hadn't faced anyone that was going to put it on her the way JJ would. I thought she'd break eventually.

At some point it became clear that the fight was likely going to a decision and that was a little deflating watching live.

Rewatching it, man, Joanna very much outclassed her at nearly every turn, even as KK was able to sneak some damage in. Even in the 4th where KK had her big moment, Joanna was able to quickly recover, turn things around, and outland KK in the time remaining. I just wasn't expecting KK to live up in toughness against Joanna...but she sure did. I think anyone else would have been wearing it with everything Joanna was landing, but KK is built to last.

exactly how I saw it. KK is the only opponent from Esparza onward that didn't get beaten down/worn down by Joanna. Really tough as nails and I think she's going to give a lot of girls in the division problems.

 

[Flemmy Stardust]

exactly how I saw it. KK is the only opponent from Esparza onward that didn't get beaten down/worn down by Joanna. Really tough as nails and I think she's going to give a lot of girls in the division problems.

There are definitely some good match ups to make with her at the top of the division, but I think a rematch might go even worse for her if it comes sooner than later. JJ has a very advanced understanding of the techniques she's throwing (what worked, what could've worked better), and KK is a bit more slapdash.

The stats in this fight were pretty overwhelming in favor of JJ. KK would have to make some serious improvements, I think.

 

[ufcfan4]

There are definitely some good match ups to make with her at the top of the division, but I think a rematch might go even worse for her if it comes sooner than later. JJ has a very advanced understanding of the techniques she's throwing (what worked, what could've worked better), and KK is a bit more slapdash.

The stats in this fight were pretty overwhelming in favor of JJ. KK would have to make some serious improvements, I think.

I think so as well. And don't get me wrong KK did some nice damage in the fourth but I think Bisping and some others were overstating it a bit. Bisping was like, Karolina not only did well in the fourth, she came close to finishing Joanna.
That's quite strong. Struck me more like Hendricks vs. GSP round 2 where Hendricks wobbled GSP but then St.-Pierre did solid for the remainder of the round and almost took it back.

Also, I like how Brian Stann was pronouncing her name "Carolina" with a long i.

 

[ufcfan4]

Also, I'm very frightened by Yoel Romero who seems good natured enough but will absolutely murder you in the cage. It was bad enough seeing him put one of my all-time favorite fighters in Lyoto to sleep by elbowing the shit out of him in the third round of their fight, but I had to watch another favorite, Wediman, go down like a sack of potatoes and get bloodied badly.

Romero has embarrassed the shit out of me as far as fantasy predictions go. I picked every fighter after Tavares to beat him and he beat every one of them.

Wins over Kennedy, Machida, Jacare, and Weidman consecutively already put him pretty high on GOAT middleweight list- even if he does engage in his shenanigans such as the dousing with water between rounds. I was laughing when the corner was yelling for a towel and Yoel gave the annoyed shrug like as if to say someone fucked up. Riiight.

Dude is such a beast though. Crazy finishing prowess deep in the fight. I'm assuming he crushes Bisping BAD but with my luck I'll finally pick Romero and Bisping will stick and move and gas him to decision.

 

[Flemmy Stardust]

I think so as well. And don't get me wrong KK did some nice damage in the fourth but I think Bisping and some others were overstating it a bit. Bisping was like, Karolina not only did well in the fourth, she came close to finishing Joanna.
That's quite strong. Struck me more like Hendricks vs. GSP round 2 where Hendricks wobbled GSP but then St.-Pierre did solid for the remainder of the round and almost took it back.

Also, I like how Brian Stann was pronouncing her name "Carolina" with a long i.

Carolina...haha

I heard Rogan was catching shit for saying that JJ might have won the 4th despite the wobble. I thought it was a reasonable assessment. It was like one blitz and then she landed a couple more in the aftermath....and JJ was getting some in as well. JJ took her back for a sec, they separated, and JJ finished the round winning exchanges.

 

[ufcfan4]

Carolina...haha

I heard Rogan was catching shit for saying that JJ might have won the 4th despite the wobble. I thought it was a reasonable assessment. It was like one blitz and then she landed a couple more in the aftermath....and JJ was getting some in as well. JJ took her back for a sec, they separated, and JJ finished the round winning exchanges.

Same here. I pretty much expected at least one of the three to call it 50-45 for Joanna. But I had no problem with them all giving Karolina the round in that she landed the most significant offense of it.

 

[Ricky13]

For this particular question, there are a couple of different levels of answer. Big picture answer: When I watch The West Wing, I'm there for Martin Sheen. When I watch The Newsroom, I'm there for Jeff Daniels. When I watch Steve Jobs, I'm there for Michael Fassbender. At the end of the day, I'm there for the person I think is the best of the bunch. They're not the only reason I tune in. Not by a long shot. But they're absolutely the main reason. They're the main characters, so they're the ones I'm tuning in to see (the corollary is: They're the ones for whom Sorkin pulls out all the stops).

Down a level, when I'm looking at the ensemble in The West Wing, no, I can't say I'm ever tuning in for C.J. But then, to be fair, I'm not tuning in for Josh, either. In The Newsroom, I can't say I'm tuning in for Mac, but then I'm not tuning in for Charlie, either.

Another level down, when I'm looking at episodes of The West Wing, sometimes the arc I'm the most into is a C.J. arc. Other times it's a Josh arc. Other times I want them all to get the fuck out of the way so I can just focus on Toby. In The Newsroom, Will is gold, but sometimes I just want to be with Mac and Sloan. Other times, Charlie is holding court. Other times I want everyone to shut up so I can watch the Jane Fonda show.

Yeah for me it's the four guys. Probably Josh most often. I like him... he's got swag when the comedy isn't making a doofus out of him (I like that too).

If someone wants to mine the stats, I'm sure the numbers can be put up to show what a horrible misogynist Sorkin is, but I'm not bullshitting when I say that I literally don't think of this shit when I'm watching Sorkin. Everybody clicks regardless of who's packing a dick and who isn't, everyone has moments to shine, everyone has their scene/episode/arc where they get the chance to hit it out of the park. At the end of the day, the main character is always a dude. Then again, Sorkin's currently at work on what's to be his directorial debut, and it's called Molly's Game and the main character is a woman.

Story and character rule in Sorkinland. Gender is for the peanut gallery.

Of course (to the bit in bold). It's a fantastic show. We're only talking about this because you and I are obsessed with the minutiae. I brought it up because we were talking Sorkin in the context of the greats. For a show made after the phenomena that were Ellen Ripley, Sarah Connor etc., I just wish it did something like that with its women instead of focusing on the struggles of being a woman.

No disagreements at all that it's well written.

Well, if we ever come back around to Cloverfield, this is a discussion that I think is worth having, because I can't guess for the life of me where you'd go with it.

LOL!

Fair enough. I view an audience surrogate as either 1) telling us how to feel or 2) telling us what's going on, because the camera isn't able to do the job.

Functionally, Hud is the camera. I know that sounds pedantic. I'm trying to stress the difference between blabbermouths like Ariadne and Donna telling you how to feel, and the person manically manipulating a viewfinder.

What it's about: Man A told Woman A she looked good. Woman B took offense, and even though Woman A wasn't offended, Man A now feels guilty and confused.

What he's saying: Woman A thinks Woman B should mind her business and chill the fuck out and Man A shouldn't walk around on eggshells for fear of all the Woman B's of the world.

He's actually casting a pretty wide net in that scene. Ainsley is arguing that ribbing works across genders, and that if it's part of her becoming "part of the team," then that means the intent is very different than the stereotype of the construction site hollering at women walking by and she's cool with it. She's also arguing that blowing your top every time a guy says anything remotely sexual (or even just gender-specific) distracts from legit instances of sexual harassment. And she's arguing that nobody, male or female, gets to dictate what any individual is comfortable with, that a person's sexuality is his/her own and they don't need constant white-knighting.

I think it's problematic for Ainsley to be saying all this, because Sorkin's a dude. It comes off as though Sorkin is a bit fed-up with PCness, while assuming things he doesn't have access to. For instance, does he really know how women feel about sexual ribbing? Has he been a woman, or had to live with the expectations of being one in a corporate environment? Is it true that women being annoyed about this stuff really does distract from legitimate instances of harassment - eg. how often do complaints really turn out to be about nothing?

One could argue it's art, and we should be able to say anything without having to worry about evidence. And that's true. But when it has the potential to make a young girl who is watching think that maybe she should just suck it up the next time someone talks about her legs at work, it's worth dissecting, I think.

This applies better to The Newsroom and the mission to civilize. I think you think Sorkin is a lot more on Sam's side than he really is. He's on Will's side all the way. Sam, on the other hand, is being used to indicate a very specific (and, as Sorkin seems to be suggesting, perhaps outmoded) form of nobility, and one that importantly gets rejected.

Very interesting. I actually think that Sorkin wishes things were the way they used to be in the classic era. It's how he approaches the tech stuff as well (The Social Network's message, for instance).

Need to watch Steve Jobs again.

I don't want to be assigning you homework or anything, but I'm not going to lie and say that I wouldn't be interested to hear your thoughts on The Philadelphia Story, His Girl Friday, and Adam's Rib in light of this conversation. However, I can't stress enough that, more than anything, I want you to watch the first two seasons of The Newsroom.

Aaarrrghh. Was the only thing I was hoping you wouldn't ask me to watch. I'd rather watch that show Felicity you mentioned earlier. But if you insist, I will.

People in here seemed to dig Snowpiercer.

That's because it's greatness.

That's because @Flemmy Stardust and @Sigh GunRanger are too cool for school

Punks.

while @europe1, @BeardotheWeirdo, and @chickenluver are cheating on us with @shadow_priest_x and the Movie Club.

I kid. I'm glad there's threads like that with some direction. This one can seem all over the place sometimes, though it's kind of what makes it what it is.

I have to admit, I've also been slacking on you guys. I'm hoping to have a full draft of my PhD thesis done by next summer and, as I'm sure you know all too well, Ricky, this reading and writing shit takes for-fucking-ever.

It's bullshit man.

Spoiler

Full disclosure: I've also spent the last couple of months locking down a girlfriend.

Spoiler

And Ricky, I don't know what kind of voodoo powers you're working with, but this Friday, on some channel I didn't even know I had and the name of which I don't even know, they're kicking off a marathon of Gilmore Girls. And not just a bunch of episodes, not even just a season or two. They're showing every fucking episode, in order, one after the other. I told you I'd try to get to Gilmore Girls when I got back to the UK after the holidays. Well, it looks like Gilmore Girls is going to be my holiday TV project

Ok. Pick anything for me to watch. ANYTHING, though I admit it would rather not be The Newsroom. But yeah, if it has to be.....