International Russia/Ukraine Megathread V7

[lsa]

 

[lsa]

Huge news!
DPRK Officially Recognizes Donetsk and Lugansk
https://kcnawatch.org/newstream/1657751789-824945617/dprk-officially-recognizes-donetsk-and-lugansk

 

[PEB]

Huge news!
DPRK Officially Recognizes Donetsk and Lugansk
https://kcnawatch.org/newstream/1657751789-824945617/dprk-officially-recognizes-donetsk-and-lugansk

 

[PEB]

Huge news!
DPRK Officially Recognizes Donetsk and Lugansk
https://kcnawatch.org/newstream/1657751789-824945617/dprk-officially-recognizes-donetsk-and-lugansk

You would think by now an realize NO will be the answer every single time. Ukraine seems to be making serious headway to get Russia back in talks.

"
July 14 (Reuters) - A top Russian official said on Thursday that Moscow would respond positively should Kyiv be ready to resume peace negotiations, but that Ukraine must accept the "territorial realities" of the situation, the Interfax news agency reported.

Russia's Deputy Foreign Minister Andrey Rudenko said Kyiv must provide a clear response to Moscow's proposals that Ukraine accept "non-aligned" and "non-nuclear" status in order to strike a peace deal.

President Volodymyr Zelenskiy would also have to recognise Russia's control over Crimea and the status of the breakaway "people's republics" in Donetsk and Luhansk, Interfax reported, a day after Kyiv ruled out territorial concessions.

Negotiations on a possible peace deal have been stalled since tentative rounds of talks between the two sides broke down just weeks into the conflict.

"Russia's approach remains the same. A future agreement should fix the neutral, non-aligned and nuclear-free status of Ukraine and recognise the existing territorial realities, including the current status of Crimea, as well as the Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics," Interfax quoted Rudenko as saying.

He also blamed Ukraine for the collapse of talks and said the West had "forbidden Kyiv from negotiating."

Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba on Wednesday ruled out ceding territory to Russia as part of any peace deal and said no peace talks were under way between Moscow and Kyiv.

"The objective of Ukraine in this war... is to liberate our territories, restore our territorial integrity, and full sovereignty in the east and south of Ukraine," he told a briefing.

A return to negotiations has been hampered by an intensification of shelling on both sides of the frontline and by Russian strikes on cities, despite its insistence it does not target civilians.

On Thursday, a Russian strike on the central city of Vinnytsia killed at least 20 people, including a small child, Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said. (Reporting by Reuters)"

 

[SandisLL]

We don't care what stuff will tell or sign Ukraine or Russia.
Also, sorry, will not care about Germany....
We most likely will impose permanent ban to import Russia's natural gas. Forever and irreversible ban.
We will continue to maintain natural gas transit to Kaliningrad oblastj...
Nothing more.
We are preparing for real WAR....
Hybrid war and suff with hackers and spies & traitors etc...it is routine 14 years in row...on daily basis BTW.

 

[SandisLL]

We had suffered cos old idiot Lukashenko 2 years in row.

Lukashenko ordered to use fighters airplanes to intercept passenger airplane just cos....there was one noname blogger...
Next time maybe they will order to launch on passenger airplane missiles...
So we don't use Belarus airspace.

And unlike some " friends " from west, we didn't had used airspace over areas controlled by separatists for passenger airlines.
We suffered financially really a lot during 8 years in row ....serious financial damages cos this.
While our guys still value clients ( passengers ) safety more than salary and profit / loss.
Civil aviation is like " protect and serve " and we always will do all the best in our ability in order to protect clients....
Despite we had suffered financially damn a lot.

 

[Dalarna3]

How many people are left in Donbas to rebuild, anyway?

 

[SandisLL]

How many people are left in Donbas to rebuild, anyway?

No one have any clue...

Luhansk oblastj IMHO will require more than 20b USD alone....


I'm for example more concerned about our lads in civil aviation.
We appeared to be capable to ensure 0 deaths when provided civil cargo and passenger transport services during 30 years in all continents...
While we are suffering damn a lot cos stuff called " dumbass " and holy hole Belarus etc nice areas...

 

[AWilder]

How many people are left in Donbas to rebuild, anyway?

Russia has no qualms with continuing a centuries old tradition of russification. They will give poor russians money to relocate and live there.

 

[GhostZ06]

 

[ferrisjso]

In terms of negotiations this is why grabbing Kharkov is key for Russia. If you just take the land you want they're going to say no. You have to take more than you want. I don't think Russia expects Ukraine to accept being landlocked but threatening to do that would put the Ukranians in a spot where they need to accept the loss of their other lands.

As long as Russia holds lands Ukraine knows it's losing no matter what(lands that the govt would benefit electorally from losing) it's easy for Ukraine to just posture and play make believe. Russia has said Donbass and the land bridge were the main goals they aren't giving that up in negotiations so where do negotiations even start. Russia is mostly done with their goals but they haven't even finished yet. Once Russia starts taking things beyond that Ukraine really doesn't want to lose that's when we see progress.

 

[GhostZ06]

 

[SandisLL]

We will increase funding even if Germany and France + Italy and Austria + Hungary will not agree...
We don't care about their interests today....NO.

And we are still able to provide weapons and money to continue all this....for long time...really long time cos Russia should be weakened as much as this will be possible.
Ofc human bodies doesn't matter for them despite their propaganda. While lost technique is another stuff....

Harkov is ...russian city with >50% population hating Kremlin...this is what this is.
+ they ruined city economy when had built very large and expensive tank production factory in order to fill East Germany, Chech Republic etc with tanks called Т-64 and Т-80.
Today as tanks producer Harkov is ...piece of shit and useless...

They can't produce more modern shells for tanks guns than 1988 th stuff.
With scandals and delays had statisfied 2 foreign orders....

We know that almost all tanks and ammo for tanks Ukr is using is...stuff produced before 1992 th....This is reality.

 

[Videer]

I remember when I was insulted for raising this as a potential issue weeks ago, fun times

https://www.ft.com/content/bce78c78-b899-4dd2-b3a0-69d789b8aee8

EU does not appear to agree with you or that FT writer.



edit. how am I not suprised that the author is former Moscow bureau chief.

 

[GhostZ06]

 

[GhostZ06]

Anyone in poland ?

According to information published on the Twitter account of "Jakub Spyrka" on July 12, 2022, Poland could give Ukraine 232 PT-91 Twardy Main Battle Tanks in exchange for American-made M1 Abrams tanks. Citing information from Jakub Spyrka, the Abrams M1A1 tanks that would be given to Ukraine could be the tanks that were recently withdrawn from service from the U.S. Marine Corps.

This does make logical sense, we do have a bunch of Abrams now that marines got rid of theirs.

https://www.armyrecognition.com/def..._tanks_in_exchange_for_us_m1_abrams_mbts.html


These are better then T-80 thats for sure.

 

[SandisLL]

AFIAK stuff about Poland and Abrams tanks is like this: Obama and after him Trump had applied serious efforts to sell tanks ....
Biden continued the same...
Poland IMHO really today does have at least 28...
While sales efforts are for higher volumes.

Poland value Abrams cos supplier isn't Germany or France + cos city package + most likely unlike with tanks from ...crybaby Germany they will not have restrictions to add NeRA or Active armour here on them.
+ will have so called city fight package....

Otherwise most likely tank is...just large battleship of 21 th century....nothing more here...

IMHO Poland had gave Ukr older their T-72 versions in best case equpped with 1990 ies- 2000 ies era reactive armour...

Tank's combat value vs self propelled 155 mm gun is really like this: it will turn into wreck any modern tank, regardless is this called Leopard or Le Clerk or last gen T-90 or Armata....

 

[ferrisjso]

Russia has no qualms with continuing a centuries old tradition of russification. They will give poor russians money to relocate and live there.

Ukraine is Russian. Even more so than Muscovy aka Russia. Not that they should be part of Muscovy/Russia like Austria and Germany there's centuries old political reasons they aren't together.

They only aren't Russian until it's time to do a stunt like cancelling Moscows charter, a city THEY founded. Then they're the OG Russians. Having a seperate identity because they were seperate for centuries and centuries doesn't mean they aren't Russian.

These areas being taken are largely pro Russian. That will change if they go much further West but if Ukraine was going to leave Russia's orbits and give the finger to Russia's attempts to make the country geopoltiically neutral why would Ukraine just let the whole country leave their orbit when the whole country didn't make that decision? Both the US and Russia have installed puppets but the reality is it was a near 50-50 split along strictly regional lines who won by 4-5 percent when adding up everything is largely irelevant to the dynamic.

Here's the 04 and 09 election results. Basically the Donbass and Lyviv areas(the far west of Ukraine which is the furthest removed from Russia historically and culturally) were 90-10 for the Russia and West backed candidates with most other regions only being slightly less polarized in the 70-90 percent range some 60 percents but not a lot less than that. Only the very center of the country was in the 50-60 range.

To put this in context the US is often cited as polarized(both parties are right wing but most left leaning people are trapped voting Dem) in 2020 there wasn't ONE state that gave 70 percent to one party and only a minority where one party got 70%. And there usually is either 1 or 2 small states tops. In 1984 when Reagan won 49 states he got 70 in 4 and 2 barely. "Blue or Red" state means a consistantly safe 50%. This is a different animal altogether.

Most of the territory Russia has taken or is threatening to take was in the 70-90 percent range. Does a mandate for a Russian puppet include supporting a Russian invasion? No, especially outside the Donbass where the war hasn't been ongoing since 2014. But there were extreme regional differences here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Ukrainian_presidential_election#/media/File:Вибори_2004.png

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Ukrainian_presidential_election#/media/File:Другий_тур_2010_по_округах-en.png

 

[SandisLL]

Unlike countries called Luxemnourg and Austria...
Ukraine does have their own language.
For this reason alone Ukraine does have more rights to have their own country than Austria or Luxembourg ...

BTW all world will be helpless.
World had did all the best to oppress jews and gypsies, to insult them and make them to forget their own language...
Didn't happened despite xxxx years long dreams worldwide....

With Ukr here will be stuff that ALL stuff here is only in beginning stage...
What will happen with Ukr as country will not matter any bare thing for long term.

Russia's statement about their long term plans how to do rusification in all Ukraine had been posted in RIA etc media for russians in Russia.
Nazism statement....
Russians also had promised sooner or later to eliminate from face of earth Moldova as nation and as country....regardless how long time this will take until this task will be done...

They openly had stated for russians in Russia that Ukraine isn't country and isn't nation....

We know killers nazists speeches for russians in Russia.

 

[SandisLL]

BTW bragging that if you have some nationality or even just cos know some language ....then automatically you should be someone's slave and property ....is Kremlin's stuff.

Harkov really is at least 90% russian city by language...
While looks that they doesn't want to be under xxx old rich idiots in Kremlin.
With rude russian + with 0 accent in russian they already once had kicked back ...Kremlin's friends russians...