Russia threatens to dump the dollar

[Jukai]

Don't play dumb with me, I know you better than that :icon_lol:

I guess I don't. None of that made sense. It's like your mother getting a better job and suddenly making you nicer lunches to bring to Middle School, and conspiring that she must have worked out a deal with the food industry because that is the only reason you would get nicer lunches.

I'm confused.

 

[IDL]

I guess I don't. None of that made sense. It's like your mother getting a better job and suddenly making you nicer lunches to bring to Middle School, and conspiring that she must have worked out a deal with the food industry because that is the only reason you would get nicer lunches.

I'm confused.

No it's more like if a parent company owned two 'competing' companies and all the customers viewed all the interactions as legit competition. They even run advertisements against each other!

Even the smartest person would come to the wrong conclusion about the nature of the game if they weren't aware of the parent company.

The global financial network is the glue that binds all these 'competitors' together.

 

[ben236]

Hahaha, that is why Putin had to come out with a statement about how he was gonna work with American and Europe on resolving the Ukraine crisis to stop his country from having to prop up the country with reserves after just a THREAT of sanctions.

Because sanctions are the only factor at play here?

That's funny.

 

[Jukai]

No it's more like if a parent company owned two 'competing' companies and all the customers viewed all the interactions as legit competition. They even run advertisements against each other!

Even the smartest person would come to the wrong conclusion about the nature of the game if they weren't aware of the parent company.

The global financial network is the glue that binds all these 'competitors' together.

Right, that would make sense if you could prove that parent company existed beyond vague references of research that you can never provide.

Always enjoy these talks, though.

Because sanctions are the only factor at play here?

That's funny.

Tell me what other factors caused the Russian stocks to plummet.

 

[Kevin Rudd]

Russia will negotiate the annexing of the Crimea and then support fresh democratic elections. There won't be any sanctions, nor will there be any violent conflict. Putin is not the sharpest tool in the shed but he is no dummy either. He knows the consequences of conflict far outweigh the benefits.

It is pretty clear that the Russians don't want to fight the Ukranians, but they want to secure their assets and the strategic importance in the Crimea which is fair enough imo.

 

[ncordless]

Because sanctions are the only factor at play here?

That's funny.

Ben, don't tell me you're another Putin-lover. You're better than that, and a libertarian, no?

 

[ben236]

This is predictably vague. Can you attempt to put some numbers out here and go into the mechanism a little further? Could be a bit of work so if you've seen anyone else do it, a link would be fine.

What is there to get into? I said it could have an impact on the US and it can. By predictably vague I take it your referring to when I said a reduction in demand leads to a rise in prices.

Of course you want specific numbers and don't plan on spending much time compiling data and coming out with 5 year projection just for you.

I think you greatly overestimate Russia's power here.

Europe gets 40% of it's natural gas from Russia. Germany gets 1/3 of it's oil from Russia.

If that were cut off you think that wouldn't have an impact?

 

[crowded]

Well, we're in agreement if you're spouting platitudes and staying away from making positive claims, but if you're saying that this flunky's "threat" would have any large impact on the American economy or that the minimal effect there would be would be negative, we're not.

I'm saying that people such as yourself can't foretell the future because you can't predict with any certainty what people will do next. Especially under highly stressful circumstances. You can say that generally speaking when x rises y decreases and that type of thing, but factoring in everything that might have an impact and saying for sure what will happen next is not possible. Something of this magnitude (a major economy eschewing dollars and creating a new alternative) could be a whirlwind chain-reaction and textbook probabilities don't really determine what happens in reality. And people do things all the time that would seem to cause them more harm than good. That's why we have the phrase "cutting off your nose to spite your face.".

How well has the field of economics predicted the trajectory of bitcoin? Surely it was all economists making the news with things like selling their $100 bitcoin investment for enough to buy a house. lol

 

[IDL]

Right, that would make sense if you could prove that parent company existed beyond vague references of research that you can never provide.

Always enjoy these talks, though.

I understand that most people don't believe that parent company exists, I'm just clarifying the angle in which I am looking at things.

Really it changes the entire paradigm.

 

[ben236]

Tell me what other factors caused the Russian stocks to plummet.

There's frankly zero support from the Russian population to intervene in the Ukraine. I personally think that this was all political posturing from the get-go from all sides and that nothing was ever going to come of it from the start.

Ben, don't tell me you're another Putin-lover.

Not really.

 

[Kevin Rudd]

edit

 

[Kevin Rudd]

I understand that most people don't believe that parent company exists, I'm just clarifying the angle in which I am looking at things.

Really it changes the entire paradigm.

The angle without any substantiated evidence?

I'm looking at it from the angle the the earth will blow up in 10 days time, really changes the paradigm don't you think

 

[Jack V Savage]

I understand that most people don't believe that parent company exists, I'm just clarifying the angle in which I am looking at things.

Really it changes the entire paradigm.

So how does that fit with thinking that the U.S. is so vulnerable here? Wouldn't the evil bankers prefer a strong dollar?

 

[IDL]

The angle without any substantiated evidence?

I'm looking at it from the angle the the earth will blow up in 10 days time, really changes the paradigm don't you think

I have done enough studying on the subject to prove its existence to myself. I have no doubt whatsoever. Proving it to others is far more difficult. It takes work, therefor it requires curiosity.

Anything that requires a paradigm shift in the mind has to overcome a lot of preconditioning. If someone believes that the two companies have been in honest competition for their entire lives and has seen all the ads on TV then they will have built up a very engrained view of how it all works.

So I know how difficult it is. I understand when people reject even the possibility because of what that opens up. If that is possible.. Then what else is possible?

 

[IDL]

So how does that fit with thinking that the U.S. is so vulnerable here? Wouldn't the evil bankers prefer a strong dollar?

They certainly have wanted a strong dollar for quite a long time, but it depends what their end game is. Perhaps the dollar was only ever intended to last for so long.. Eventually they are going to want a one world currency to really tie everything together. Would that be the dollar? Could be. Or it might not be.

 

[OldGoat]

So how does that fit with thinking that the U.S. is so vulnerable here? Wouldn't the evil bankers prefer a strong dollar?

Inflation weakens the dollar which is what the evil bankers want. Therefore they can get more dollars for less stuff. Clever isn't it?

 

[Kevin Rudd]

I have done enough studying on the subject to prove its existence to myself. I have no doubt whatsoever. Proving it to others is far more difficult. It takes work, therefor it requires curiosity.

Anything that requires a paradigm shift in the mind has to overcome a lot of preconditioning. If someone believes that the two companies have been in honest competition for their entire lives and has seen all the ads on TV then they will have built up a very engrained view of how it all works.

So I know how difficult it is. I understand when people reject even the possibility because of what that opens up. If that is possible.. Then what else is possible?

You are funny. And not a ha ha type funny either.

 

[OldGoat]

I have done enough studying on the subject to prove its existence to myself. I have no doubt whatsoever. Proving it to others is far more difficult. It takes work, therefor it requires curiosity.

Anything that requires a paradigm shift in the mind has to overcome a lot of preconditioning. If someone believes that the two companies have been in honest competition for their entire lives and has seen all the ads on TV then they will have built up a very engrained view of how it all works.

So I know how difficult it is. I understand when people reject even the possibility because of what that opens up. If that is possible.. Then what else is possible?

Remember Icarus.

 

[IDL]

You are funny. And not a ha ha type funny either.

oh well. There are millions of people that take it for granted that the world is really controlled by the financial elites. It really isn't that strange a concept when you think about it.

 

[Jukai]

There's frankly zero support from the Russian population to intervene in the Ukraine. I personally think that this was all political posturing from the get-go from all sides and that nothing was ever going to come of it from the start.

And so, the stock drop was... designed by Russia or something? :icon_conf

Were you talking about the overall situation when you said there was more to it? I'm specifically talking about the fact that the US came out with an official statement threatening sanctions and it WRECKED Russia's stock market. There was no other possible catalyst. The "we're going to drop the dollar" statement didn't have much of an effect on ours.