Question on WMMA great Yuka Tsuji

[Fork]

Idk why you are so convinced that Miku is overrated, she has better wins than Shinashi. Shinashi is great but due to her size she didn't fight the best competition for the majority of her career and was strictly a grappler, I would favor Miku had they fought.

she even drew and beat rena in kickboxing and shootboxing. shinashi is one of the greats for sure and deserves her spot in wmma history, but i don't think it's even particularly close between miku and shinashi.

 

[grilledcheese]

she even drew and beat rena in kickboxing and shootboxing. shinashi is one of the greats for sure and deserves her spot in wmma history, but i don't think it's even particularly close between miku and shinashi.

I dont want to get into the MIKU debate. Although I do agree MIKU made a lot of technical mistakes.

But beating RENA doesnt mean much. IF anyone is overrated it is RENA. She is super protected at all times and built her career fighting teenage thai fighters.

 

[grilledcheese]

Yuka Tsuji vs Megumi Fujii was the superfight that everyone wanted but it never happened.

They both fought in the same organizations. And both were the biggest stars in Smackgirl and JEWELS. I think the organizations didn't want Fujii or Tsuji to lose. So they didn't make that fight.

Yuka Tsuji lost the first time to Anne Tavares, but Tsuji came into that fight with a heavily bandaged shoulder. Megumi then fought Tavares and won.

Another common opponent was Erica Montoya. Yuka Tsuji submitted Erica (btw, that was a good fight). Fujii won by decision.

I would say Fujii is #1 and Yuka was #2. MIKU was way overrated and never on the same level as Tsuji or Fujii.

I could only find the first round of Yuka Tsuji's fight with Erica Montoya. Like Fujii, most of Tsuji's matches very fairly short because they were so good at submissions.

Here is the first round of Erica Montoya vs Yuka Tsuji. This fight was in 2004. So this is well before WMMA even hit the US. It is one of the few fights that was actually very competitive. I think Erica was only 19 years at the time. A few months after losing to Tsuji, Erica fought Megumi Fujii, lost that fight, and then she stopped fighting MMA. If she was somehow still in fitting shape, Erica would probably submit a lot of today's WMMA fighters.

Yeah I remember the Yuka vs Fujii hype. Man does that bring back memories.

Thought I'd try and tap the Sherdog fountain of MMA knowledge...

I'm looking for advice/opinion/knowledge from anyone who followed WMMA back in the day.

I've been working through the early history of women's 115lb MMA, and obviously Megumi Fujii is the most accomplished female fighter the sport has yet seen at that weight (and probably the most successful female MMA fighter pound-for-pound) - no disrespect to my girl Joanna Champion.

But I've been struggling to find much about Yuka Tsuji that's in English. It's difficult to find much footage of her too (unlike Fujii). However I gather that she is often considered the second-most successful 115lbs fighter, after Megumi. Is this accurate? She was clearly a highly dangerous submission artist, at least judging from her record. How did she compare with Megumi?

If anyone has any information/insight/context on Yuka Tsuiji and her place in WMMA history, I'd be grateful.

http://blog.livedoor.jp/anfg/

That is her blog. I remember reading it years ago and watching her highlights on youtube.

 

[Asurah]

I dont want to get into the MIKU debate. Although I do agree MIKU made a lot of technical mistakes.

But beating RENA doesnt mean much. IF anyone is overrated it is RENA. She is super protected at all times and built her career fighting teenage thai fighters.

Shinashi had a lot of technical issues, Hisae did, Tsuji did, doesn't mean they aren't all time greats.

She beat RENA in RENA's field of expertise, it's impressive even if you believe RENA to be overrated. I don't see how RENA is really overrated or super protected though as she has beaten every top female Shoot Boxer, that Thai line is completely false.

 

[grilledcheese]

Shinashi had a lot of technical issues, Hisae did, Tsuji did, doesn't mean they aren't all time greats.

She beat RENA in RENA's field of expertise, it's impressive even if you believe RENA to be overrated. I don't see how RENA is really overrated or super protected though as she has beaten every top female Shoot Boxer, that Thai line is completely false.

No it is not. Dude she fought young thai fighters to pad her record. That is a fact. You're getting super emotional about this. Beating RENA in shootboxing is nothing big.

Penne is a terrible striker and beat RENA in shootboxing. She is protected because she is hot. That is the truth. Anyone in Japan knows it.

Is Penne a "top" shootboxer?

Penne is a bjj specialist with awful boxing. Penne got out struck by Sugirock before Sugirock took her down.

RENA is the definition of overrated.

 

[Asurah]

No it is not. Dude she fought young thai fighters to pad her record. That is a fact. You're getting super emotional about this. Beating RENA in shootboxing is nothing big.

Penne is a terrible striker and beat RENA in shootboxing. She is protected because she is hot. That is the truth. Anyone in Japan knows it.

Is Penne a "top" shootboxer?

Penne won off of throws, not her striking, you do know Shoot Boxing isn't just kickboxing right? Most people also thought RENA should have gotten the nod before the extension rounds. That fight was also 5 years ago, RENA was just leaving her teen years.

Yes she beat some young Thais but to say she built her career off of that is false. She beat Ai Takahashi, Erika Kamimura (one of the best Japanese female kickboxers ever) and many top MMA fighters. She has only fought 3 or 4 Thais in her career.

 

[grilledcheese]

Penne won off of throws, not her striking, you do know Shoot Boxing isn't just kickboxing right? Most people also thought RENA should have gotten the nod before the extension rounds. That fight was also 5 years ago, RENA was just leaving her teen years.

Yes she beat some young Thais but to say she built her career off of that is false. She beat Ai Takahashi, Erika Kamimura (one of the best Japanese female kickboxers ever) and many top MMA fighters. She has only fought 3 or 4 Thais in her career.

lol beating her off throws is beating her end of story Penne also outstruck her as well. Everyone here knows wtf shootboxing is. Penne is not a top shootboxer and beat RENA.

No one thought RENA should have won. You're just make shit up. and you forget to mention Erika completely owned RENA as well dropping her. Meanwhile RENA won some weird decision.


Jesus christ you're delusional. Just watch any RENA fight and realize Mizuki or anyone else would completely own her.

Fight was 5 years ago. Lmao using that excuse now but not mentioning that fight was way after MIKU beat her. So what does that mean about MIKU's win?

You can go fanboi somewhere else. I exposed you about hyping Korean cans who can barely beat DATE fighters and now you're mad.

 

[Asurah]

lol beating her off throws is beating her end of story Penne also outstruck her as well. Everyone here knows wtf shootboxing is. Penne is not a top shootboxer and beat RENA.

No one thought RENA should have won. You're just make shit up. and you forget to mention Erika completely owned RENA as well dropping her. Meanwhile RENA won some weird decision.

I never said she didn't lose. You said an awful striker beat her, I just said it was due to her grappling. Penne was not a top Shoot Boxer because she didn't regularly fight in Shoot Boxing, she is still a high level grappler and fighter. Again that fight was 5 years ago, RENA hasn't lost a fight since.

I'm making shit up? You are the one that tried to say she made her career off of beating Thai teens which is 100% false.

 

[grilledcheese]

I never said she didn't lose. You said an awful striker beat her, I just said it was due to her grappling. Penne was not a top Shoot Boxer because she didn't regularly fight in Shoot Boxing, she is still a high level grappler and fighter. Again that fight was 5 years ago, RENA hasn't lost a fight since.

I'm making shit up? You are the one that tried to say she made her career off of beating Thai teens which is 100% false.

I said thai fighters. Can be from thailand which was some but also just thai fighters in general. Look im done talking to you. Anyone can follow RENA's career and look at the cans she built her name off of. Not all were cans but that is not was I said.

Like I said, you're making shit up.


Anyone thinks it's fair for Thai fighters to come in to Shootboxing with totally different sport and fight RENA a shootboxer NOT A THAI fighter please tell me.

 

[Asurah]

I said thai fighters. Can be from thailand which was some but also just thai fighters in general. Look im done talking to you. Anyone can follow RENA's career and look at the cans she built her name off of. Not all were cans but that is not was I said.

Like I said, you're making shit up.

Still untrue dude. Yeah she beat some cans, everyone does. She also beat some of the top names, saying she made her career off of beating cans and teens is just false and you keep pushing it.

 

[grilledcheese]

Still untrue dude. Yeah she beat some cans, everyone does. She also beat some of the top names, saying she made her career off of beating cans and teens is just false and you keep pushing it.

So it's okay for Shootboxing promotion to book fighters FROM A DIFFERENT SPORT and throw them in there with a "great" as their first fight in that sport? You know what shootboxing is right?

You must just hate thai fighters.

Cesar is a piece of shit promoter that makes Don King look ethical. Imagine if Mike Tyson could face fighters from a different ruleset for their first fight in boxing over and over like what SB does for RENA.

 

[Asurah]

So it's okay for Shootboxing promotion to book fighters FROM A DIFFERENT SPORT and throw them in there with a "great" as their first fight in that sport? You know what shootboxing is right?

You must just hate thai fighters.

Yes I know what Shoot Boxing is, I have followed it for years. I probably wouldn't know RENA, Takahashi, or Kamimura if I didn't. Shoot Boxing is basically kickboxing and throws, MMA fighters cross over to it all the time and have success right away (Michihiro Omigawa is a recent example).

Yeah, I hate Thai fighters. That's it. Saenchai, Rambaa, Dejdamrong, and others aren't some of my favorite fighters or anything

 

[Asurah]

lJesus christ you're delusional. Just watch any RENA fight and realize Mizuki or anyone else would completely own her.

Fight was 5 years ago. Lmao using that excuse now but not mentioning that fight was way after MIKU beat her. So what does that mean about MIKU's win?

You can go fanboi somewhere else. I exposed you about hyping Korean cans who can barely beat DATE fighters and now you're mad.

Missed your edit.

It's still a good win, RENA was still a good fighter but she is better now. It's not rocket science that a fighter gets better with more experience.

You sound mad that I was right about the Date losing.

 

[leto1776]

Grilled cheese still here? Thought you were leaving for Reddit?

 

[Fork]

Although I do agree MIKU made a lot of technical mistakes.

hahaha, i certainly don't agree to that.

but like you said, i'm not interested in getting into a debate about how good MIKU is, and especially not with the kind of responses you're posting in this thread. frankly, i expect better from someone who posts good information on here.

 

[leto1776]

On topic, it's a shame that anytime a WMMA greatest thread comes up, Yuka Tsuji is almost never mentioned. I think there are a few reasons for this:

-fought too early. Way too many Johnny come lately fans of this sport with no sense of, or respect for, the history of the sport.
-Only fought in Japan. This is kind of a joke reason, it's so bad, because for the women the only stable scene existed in Japan. Fights elsewhere were few and far between.
-Again, fought in Japan, which had silly rules for women with shorter rounds, limited time on ground, and limited or no ground strikes.
-Suffered a loss long before Fujii did, back in 2003.
-Internet fans love to pick and choose, usually with no real logic behind their choices of favorites.



Miku Matsumoto was great, while she lasted. Oh, what could have been.

Shinashi was good, but not great. Too much padding of her record.

I also think Hisae Watanabe is brought up in Greatest discussions too little. One of few women with genuine one punch KO power, and she showed it repeatedly.

 

[chamcham]

lol beating her off throws is beating her end of story Penne also outstruck her as well. Everyone here knows wtf shootboxing is. Penne is not a top shootboxer and beat RENA.

No one thought RENA should have won. You're just make shit up. and you forget to mention Erika completely owned RENA as well dropping her. Meanwhile RENA won some weird decision.


Jesus christ you're delusional. Just watch any RENA fight and realize Mizuki or anyone else would completely own her.

Fight was 5 years ago. Lmao using that excuse now but not mentioning that fight was way after MIKU beat her. So what does that mean about MIKU's win?

You can go fanboi somewhere else. I exposed you about hyping Korean cans who can barely beat DATE fighters and now you're mad.

Mizuki actually lost a Shootboxing match last December to a Japanese fighter, but it was a controversial decision. It was the opponent's retirement match.

RENA isn't quite yet ready for MMA. Her first opponent in RIZIN was owning her in the standup. If it wasn't for the flying armbar, RENA would have lost. You could see that Shootboxing was effective, but once RENA took her opponent to the ground she had no idea what to do. Maybe it was her Shootboxing instinct kicking in and telling her to get up immediately. Anyway, I'd say RENA may be a white belt on the ground (like Holly).

I would actually like to see RENA's first RIZIN opponent fight some MMA matches overseas.
I think she'd do OK. RENA needs to seriously spend the next couple of years working on MMA. I actually think fighting Shootboxing is bad for her due to the different rules.

 

[InfinityLens]

Grilled cheese still here? Thought you were leaving for Reddit?

Is there a World Wide MMA Reddit?