Push/Pull Ratio

[Bry]

Recently, in the last five years I have been experiencing shoulder issues. At first I assumed it was just part of getting older, as I am now on the other side of 50. Since I am a curious person though, I am always reading and looking at different ideas. I recently ran across a post from Dr. John Rusin who recommends a 3 to 1 volume ration for pull to push. This got me thinking about my own workout exercises and how I program. His reference was specifically to upper body. I usually do a more balanced approach, for every push I do a pull exercise.
So I generally fall into the 1 to 1 ratio.
Any thoughts on this?
What do your ratios look like?

Bry

 

[teepsandbarleywine]

Probably more like a 1.5:1 ratio of pull to push exercises for me. My warm-ups also usually include a good number of rear delt or external rotation exercises as well.

 

[deadshot138]

Matt Wenning recommends to pull twice as much as you push and he’s benched over 600lbs raw. He says it’s to help offset peoples unbalanced musculature that typically happens when you train without knowledge. Tons of pressing and no back work.

 

[Bry]

Supposed to also help with the rounding of the shoulders, which is a big problem I have from sitting in front of a computer all day long. I do keep a band in my office and do band pull aparts during the day, when I'm not on meetings all day.

Bry

 

[Fahcough]

Never put thought into that ratio, curious now. It's probably close to 1:1 being the splits are usually even.

 

[aus101]

I train a ppl split but will often do ring chin ups between sets of my compound lifts to pump up the lats on bench and military and decompress the spine on squats and deadlift.

Helps with push imbalances (also like machine rear delt fly's between sets of bench for a horizontal pull to warm and bring up the rear delts) but also big lats aid bench and military due to acting like a spring board at the bottom of the movement (also helps with stability) so if you want a decent press (I have a double bw touch and go on bench) you may as well hit the lats hard.

 

[Ronnan72]

Turning 50 myself on Monday. I recently bought Becoming a Supple Leopard by Kelly Starret. It has some brilliant information, breaking the archetypal Olympic movements down into stages. I highly recommend it, especially for the older lifter. The rehab section is outstanding, voodoo floss and myofacial massage with a "peanut" have helped me continue to train with shagged elbows.

On topic, Rusin's advice makes a lot of sense. I used to do band pull-aparts on chest days, I need to incorporate them again.

 

[National Acrobat]

2:1, 3:1. probably a good rule of thumb

I think the benefits of more pulling volume comes down to the relative complexity of the back musculature and the mechanics of pulling vs pressing.

Pressing is primarily a pecs, front delts and triceps movement. With different emphasis depending on angles and apparatus. (emphasis on primarily before someone decides to be a smart ass)

Whereas pulling you have the lats, rhomboids, traps, teres minor and major, biceps, brachialis, rear delts. There's a lot of shit going on back there. So training all that with the "same volume" measured in total push/pull sets you're giving to you pecs, front delts, and tris seems like a good way to get imbalances, because in actuality you're not using the same volume. You're either undertraining or maybe not training at all (depending on your exercise selection) significant portions of your back.

 

[STRYDG]

Was considering adding more back work. My posture isnt complete shit but do have a slight nerd neck, rounded shoulders, apt. Luckily besides looking ugly they do not affect me. Was hoping this would help a little in this instance.

What would be the go to exercises to totally cover your back? Have BB, DB and bar for pulls ups. Mostly do BB row (super), DB row (neutral) and chin/pull ups I alternate grip each time. Might go for the 2:1 approach.

 

[Bry]

He also recommended more horizontal pull then vertical pull, as vertical pulls hit the front of the shoulders more, which is also the same part horizontal pushing hits.
My current pull day looks like this:
Pull-ups
Seated Row
Band pull a parts
Deads or high pulls
DB curl supersetted with 1 arm DB row or landmine single arm row
The exercises stay the same but alternate between deads and pullups being my first pull movement.

Try and hit pulls twice a week.

Bry