People are over-emphasizing 2nd Stipe fight for NGANNOU

[BFoe]

When I read the thread title I thought I was going to agree—until I saw the goofy OP. People are over-emphasizing the 2nd Stipe fight, but not for the weird reasons TS said. They’re reading too much into the wrestling sequences imo. It was clear throughout the Cormier trilogy that Stipe was declining. In the 2nd Ngannou fight he was skinny, tentative, not nearly as explosive, and used poor technique on his TD attempt. Ngannou clearly has been working on his wrestling, but the Stipe fight did not show the massive types of improvements some people seem to think, imho.

 

[mjfan23]

He pretty much realized after fight one; there is absolutely no way he can finish Francis. Francis realized after fight one; if he can sprawl on a takedown or two he murks Stipe.

 

[mjfan23]

When I read the thread title I thought I was going to agree—until I saw the goofy OP. People are over-emphasizing the 2nd Stipe fight, but not for the weird reasons TS said. They’re reading too much into the wrestling sequences imo. It was clear throughout the Cormier trilogy that Stipe was declining. In the 2nd Ngannou fight he was skinny, tentative, not nearly as explosive, and used poor technique on his TD attempt. Ngannou clearly has been working on his wrestling, but the Stipe fight did not show the massive types of improvements some people seem to think, imho.

I agree with your point but how was it clear in Stipe vs DC trilogy that Stipe was declining? He was fighting a declining DC and got better every round or fight in the trilogy.

the problem in Francis vs Stipe 2: Stipe met a good fighter in his prime!


Stipe has never beaten a good fighter in their prime, just look at his entire career

 

[Melas Chasma]

Did Stipe even through a punch or kick let alone actually connect? Anybody could see he was in some kind of emotionally bad state for that fight from his weird emo haircut, lack of game plan change, no take down attempts, etc. I personally feel most of his problems are related to his wife's controlling nature (you could see her smiling proudly with him at the hospital after the loss - mission accomplished.) He threw the fight even if he doesn't realize it.

I completely disagree about the fight but gave you a like only because I remember once getting the same kind of vibe about his wife, so your theory made me laugh.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Devaluing wins is an age old Sherdog tradition, I've partaken of it myself from time to time. But this is next level shit right here.

Forget Chuck With That Look in His Eye, cuz I'm telling you that Chuck With Less Female Drama would have dominated for years.

 

[BFoe]

I agree with your point but how was it clear in Stipe vs DC trilogy that Stipe was declining? He was fighting a declining DC and got better every round or fight in the trilogy.

the problem in Francis vs Stipe 2: Stipe met a good fighter in his prime!


Stipe has never beaten a good fighter in their prime, just look at his entire career

You’re right, maybe I should’ve said “I strongly suspected” Stipe was declining, because it was somewhat tough to tell. Cormier was also 40 years old, declining, and about to retire. But to me, Stipe started looking more and more hittable, far less explosive and his movement wasn’t as good. After watching that trilogy I had serious doubts as to whether Stipe could avoid massive damage like in the first fight, and whether he’d be explosive enough to outwrestle Ngannou in the 2nd fight.

 

[Oz.Pride]

That version of Stipe was 38 out of prime family man that is focused on kids and his hair to look good opposed to investing everything into his career and having a real hunger like he did back in 2016 when he was a different beast

Facts

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

You’re right, maybe I should’ve said “I strongly suspected” Stipe was declining, because it was somewhat tough to tell. Cormier was also 40 years old, declining, and about to retire. But to me, Stipe started looking more and more hittable, far less explosive and his movement wasn’t as good. After watching that trilogy I had serious doubts as to whether Stipe could avoid massive damage like in the first fight, and whether he’d be explosive enough to outwrestle Ngannou in the 2nd fight.

I felt the same. It wasn't quite as big a factor against Cormier, because he was more or less on the same trajectory of decline.

I feel like Ngannou definitely showed improvement in the rematch, and he deserves credit for that. He showed he could be more patient and more defensively responsible, and that he could defend the takedown without overreacting. But yeah, people did seem to overreact.

 

[Ahem]

While I don't agree with the premise of this thread (Ngannou proved he was on a different level than Stipe), I do find that many fans exaggerated Ngannou's "improved grappling skills". He stopped one takedown attempt, and some folks were posting about him like he put on some kind of a grappling clinic. Curious to see if Gane even attempts a takedown being that it's not his bread and butter either, but until proven otherwise, it could play a major factor in Gane's gameplanning despite everyone expecting a slug fest.

 

[Juan Bombadil]

Did Stipe even through a punch or kick let alone actually connect? Anybody could see he was in some kind of emotionally bad state for that fight from his weird emo haircut, lack of game plan change, no take down attempts, etc. I personally feel most of his problems are related to his wife's controlling nature (you could see her smiling proudly with him at the hospital after the loss - mission accomplished.) He threw the fight even if he doesn't realize it.

 

[Kos Fan]

This deserves an insta ban.

 

[HindustaniKush]

I don’t know about that but coming in at 230 lbs if the game plan was to wrestle was a massive mistake. Giving up 35 lbs in that situation is just not a good idea. Maybe he was over confident? Maybe his mind wasn’t in the right place? Maybe age and inactivity actually caught up with him? Idk.

But in no way was he the same fighter from the first fight.

He lost a lot of muscle yeah he made a bad decision

 

[Post 2 Decision]

Username checks out

 

[BFoe]

I felt the same. It wasn't quite as big a factor against Cormier, because he was more or less on the same trajectory of decline.

I feel like Ngannou definitely showed improvement in the rematch, and he deserves credit for that. He showed he could be more patient and more defensively responsible, and that he could defend the takedown without overreacting. But yeah, people did seem to overreact.

Yeah, I’m totally with you. Ngannou was more patient, showed his jab a bit IIRC, and defended the TD attempt properly. Thing is, it was a verrrry tentative single leg with Stipe leaving his head on the wrong side of Ngannou’s leg, rather than the explosive blast doubles of the first fight. It doesn’t take a monster wrestler to defend that TD. And after Ngannou took Stipe down with that waist lock, he only kept him there for like 2 seconds, whereupon Francis shot his own double-leg against the cage that Stipe defended very easily.

 

[TRUS8888]

Haha well I dont know about his emotional state or the nature of his wife etc etc. You could be right though who knows..

But I 100% agree stipe looked like absolute dog shit. Somehow coming in leaner made him even slower with less head movement, while also getting weaker.

People are giving ngannou way more credit than he probably deserves for this win. Its like how when poirer beat the mighty mcgregor (lol) twice so then people assumed he would just automatically run through Charlie olives.

 

[JonJonesNeedle]

In the Naganu vs Stipe rematch, Stipe came in light, old, and off of a trilogy war with one of the best HW's of all time in DC.

Naganu's win was a combination of Naganu improving and Stipe declining.

 

[Deleted member 499399]

they looked like they were in different weight classes. Francis played it smart because he knew the only way Stipe could beat him was if he tired himself out like the first fight. Vs Gane he won’t have that size advantage so it’s a different fight all together. I think he needs to do the opposite, apply pressure and force exchanges. Gane is going to want to stay outside and point fight and Francis should make it more of a brawl.

 

[El Panteron]

Anybody could see he was in some kind of emotionally bad state for that fight from his weird emo haircut

Made me chuckle, more than I can say for most troll jobs, 7,5/10

 

[deman]

Did Stipe even through a punch or kick let alone actually connect? Anybody could see he was in some kind of emotionally bad state for that fight from his weird emo haircut, lack of game plan change, no take down attempts, etc. I personally feel most of his problems are related to his wife's controlling nature (you could see her smiling proudly with him at the hospital after the loss - mission accomplished.) He threw the fight even if he doesn't realize it.

Spectacular. Of all the things I was expecting to read when I clicked on this thread, I wasn't expecting this, I gotta admit

 

[MeatWagon06]

WTF??