Muslim control vs gun control

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

Illegals have some rights but not nearly as many as citizens i.e. federal law does not allow them to own a gun and the courts have found that to be constitutional. Lawful visitors have more rights than illegals but not that many. Finally lawful permanent resident i.e. green card holders have almost all the same rights.

I can agree with this in regards to the way law is written. But law isn't exactly the way it actually is out there in the mean streets lol.

Not much is preventing illegals from obtaining firearms, or even punishing them much when they do

 

[Lord Coke]

I can agree with this in regards to the way law is written. But law isn't exactly the way it actually is out there in the mean streets lol.

Not much is preventing illegals from obtaining firearms, or even punishing them much when they do

I am not a big fan of illegals but you'd agree that the government has to have some restrictions on how they deal with it. E.g. what if ICE started shooting illegals on sight? I think most people would have a problem with that.

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

I am not a big fan of illegals but you'd agree that the government has to have some restrictions on how they deal with it. E.g. what if ICE started shooting illegals on sight? I think most people would have a problem with that.

Of course. I agree it's a tough problem to tackle. I obviously lie in the "they need to do more" camp, but I also agree they need to do it properly, and not abuse their powers. If there is something I actually hate, it's government overstepping their bounds. I dont hate illegals, I just think they pose a problem to our system

 

[TSO]

Actually the constitution only applies to the government - it's the rules the government has to follow. It doesn't apply to the people.

Holy shit you guys are dense. I linked the law itself and none of you seem to be able to read.

 

[Hasn't Learnt]

Great post. Though I don't think anyone is arguing that we can prevent all crimes. Just, in the case of this thread, Islamic terror or mass/school shootings.

How do we prevent mass school shootings?

also how do you prevent a random person from walking up and killing You.

I think you'll find the answer is the same to both questions.

 

[Hasn't Learnt]

I don't see a lot of people calling to ban all guns in the USA, but I do see people who want to ban every muslim. It's a false equivalence imo.

Just like you see people wanting better background checks for guns, you have people that want better background checks for muslims/immigrants. You dont see a lot of people clamoring for the total banning of either.

 

[Hasn't Learnt]

One muslim shooting up a night club killed more people than the amount of kids that die by school shooting in 2 years.

since 2012, about 450 kids have been shot in school with about 138 being killed. Thats less than 30 a year.

In what other area of life or crime or reality do we call 30 deaths a year an "epidemic"?

Now of course muslims dont kill many people at all in the US either (well, when they arent shooting up night clubs or flying planes into building, but you get my point). But we call one an epidemic and the other we call people racist for wanting to talk about it.

 

[panamaican]

Holy shit you guys are dense. I linked the law itself and none of you seem to be able to read.

I commented on your post re: the constitution. I'm not dense, you're simply wrong regarding the Constitution. The Constitution applies to the government, not the people.

 

[Leagon]

How do we prevent mass school shootings?

also how do you prevent a random person from walking up and killing You.

I think you'll find the answer is the same to both questions.

How do the vast majority of other countries on Earth prevent school shootings? How did America prevent school shootings up through the 70s?

 

[Hasn't Learnt]

How do the vast majority of other countries on Earth prevent school shootings? How did America prevent school shootings up through the 70s?

exactly, guns have always been readily available but only an increase in the last 20 years. I think it has more to do with the breakdown of the family unit and social media. Man back when i was a kid if i got picked on, at least i got a break when i went home, now kids get to see people make fun of them on facebook, instagram, twitter, etc etc.

Without outright banning guns (and then thinking their ill magically not be a black market for them) how do we stop a person from randomly walking into a place and shooting or getting it in their head that they want to come shoot you.

We don't, fact is there is no we can stop school shooting (unless you are going to put multiple armed guards at every school) or stop anyone from walking up and killing you. I also dont think this is some how an epidemic. Less than 30 kids a year die from school shootings. More kids die from that walking home from school.

 

[Islam Imamate]

How do the vast majority of other countries on Earth prevent school shootings? How did America prevent school shootings up through the 70s?

Well I don't think most countries actually prevent school shootings, its just not a problem for them to begin with. Many developing countries struggle to expand access to basic education to all their citizens. In a sense its a bit of a first world problem with the exception of the threat terrorists pose to schools as evidenced by the massacre at a school in Peshawar a few years ago.

I think part of the problem is that this epidemic was willed into existence intentionally. Once the first major school shooting happened and was covered incessantly the idea entered our public consciousness and then from there could resonate with the few disturbed individuals capable of carrying out such an act. Without that idea in the public consciousness their pathological outlook might've manifested in a different form of violence. Maybe they would just torture cats until hanging themselves or something like that.

 

[ShinkanPo]

Muhhslims

 

[Leagon]

exactly, guns have always been readily available but only an increase in the last 20 years. I think it has more to do with the breakdown of the family unit and social media. Man back when i was a kid if i got picked on, at least i got a break when i went home, now kids get to see people make fun of them on facebook, instagram, twitter, etc etc.

Without outright banning guns (and then thinking their ill magically not be a black market for them) how do we stop a person from randomly walking into a place and shooting or getting it in their head that they want to come shoot you.

We don't, fact is there is no we can stop school shooting (unless you are going to put multiple armed guards at every school) or stop anyone from walking up and killing you. I also dont think this is some how an epidemic. Less than 30 kids a year die from school shootings. More kids die from that walking home from school.

This post exemplifies how weird this whole gun conversation is. You agree that guns have always been around. You agree that guns aren't the problem. And yet you say, "Without outright banning guns" as if that is an applicable solution. If guns aren't the problem, then why are guns part of the solution?

Even more strangely, you identified the problem in your post: media and the decay of the family. Yet you didn't offer a solution involving either of those.

 

[Leagon]

Well I don't think most countries actually prevent school shootings, its just not a problem for them to begin with. Many developing countries struggle to expand access to basic education to all their citizens. In a sense its a bit of a first world problem with the exception of the threat terrorists pose to schools as evidenced by the massacre at a school in Peshawar a few years ago.

I think part of the problem is that this epidemic was willed into existence intentionally. Once the first major school shooting happened and was covered incessantly the idea entered our public consciousness and then from there could resonate with the few disturbed individuals capable of carrying out such an act. Without that idea in the public consciousness their pathological outlook might've manifested in a different form of violence. Maybe they would just torture cats until hanging themselves or something like that.

Agreed.

But it also presumes that we almost inevitably have to have a certain percentage of sociopaths in society (as opposed to biological psychopaths). We don't. My background is in education and psychology, so maybe I'm only seeing it this way because of that, but we know much of the ingredients that go into sociopathy, and we know how to mitigate them. If we willed this into existence, we can will it out of existence.

The problem is that I don't think we want to. Listening to multiple posters discuss this with such feevent helplessness has really made me feel that there's some weird virgin sacrifice/social bloodletting thing that is being tapped into.

 

[Hasn't Learnt]

This post exemplifies how weird this whole gun conversation is. You agree that guns have always been around. You agree that guns aren't the problem. And yet you say, "Without outright banning guns" as if that is an applicable solution. If guns aren't the problem, then why are guns part of the solution?

Even more strangely, you identified the problem in your post: media and the decay of the family. Yet you didn't offer a solution involving either of those.

lol, im not trying to solve the issue in a sherdog post. Im commenting on how the only possibly way to stop school shootings or anyone from killing you is more guns to magically disappear.

You asked why has there been an increase, I gave you some possible reasons why, Im not going to write a dissertation on the topic for you. guns can be a problem, but what are you going to do to make them "not a problem" for school shootings? What new laws or bannings do you want to see thta would stop school shootings. Im talking real world logical solutions. Saying ban all guns in this country is not a legitimate answer to the problem.

 

[Hasn't Learnt]

Well I don't think most countries actually prevent school shootings, its just not a problem for them to begin with. Many developing countries struggle to expand access to basic education to all their citizens. In a sense its a bit of a first world problem with the exception of the threat terrorists pose to schools as evidenced by the massacre at a school in Peshawar a few years ago.

I think part of the problem is that this epidemic was willed into existence intentionally. Once the first major school shooting happened and was covered incessantly the idea entered our public consciousness and then from there could resonate with the few disturbed individuals capable of carrying out such an act. Without that idea in the public consciousness their pathological outlook might've manifested in a different form of violence. Maybe they would just torture cats until hanging themselves or something like that.

what is it about school though, why noit go into day care centers and shoot up a bunch oif 3 yera olds if you want maximum screw you.

Along with what you said, the breakdown of the family unit has to be a reason as well as social media.

 

[Leagon]

lol, im not trying to solve the issue in a sherdog post. Im commenting on how the only possibly way to stop school shootings or anyone from killing you is more guns to magically disappear.

You asked why has there been an increase, I gave you some possible reasons why, Im not going to write a dissertation on the topic for you. guns can be a problem, but what are you going to do to make them "not a problem" for school shootings? What new laws or bannings do you want to see thta would stop school shootings. Im talking real world logical solutions. Saying ban all guns in this country is not a legitimate answer to the problem.

You're misunderstanding me.

I asked why there was an increase. You said it was because of social media and the decay of the American family.

So then why are you talking about guns?

If my car isn't working and the problem is a dead battery, I would hope the mechanic doesn't start rambling about gas prices.