Meme Thread v16: Korean Summit Edition

[jonharrison]

I said nothing of the sort. This is entirely made up. I actually consistently say the opposite of what you are claiming here, lol. I always point to how hard it was being an Irish or Italian immigrant, that is my background as well. It's hard work, and you deal with prejudice. That is why I don't appreciate people shitting on current immigrants who are in the same position.

Ah, I misunderstood your statement of:
“You'd agree that the Irish did not come here to undeveloped land and build civilization, right? They came from an awful situation, to a new situation that was full of opportunity, mostly in the 1800s and early 1900s.”
I thought you were making the point that the Irish came to an already established country and were not contributors to the development of that country. I thought you were ignoring cities such as MSP, Kansas City, Fargo, Duluth, etc. which were largely developed by more recent immigrants than those on the Mayflower. I get your point a bit more clearly now.

 

[nac386]

Ah, I misunderstood your statement of:
“You'd agree that the Irish did not come here to undeveloped land and build civilization, right? They came from an awful situation, to a new situation that was full of opportunity, mostly in the 1800s and early 1900s.”
I thought you were making the point that the Irish came to an already established country and were not contributors to the development of that country. I thought you were ignoring cities such as MSP, Kansas City, Fargo, Duluth, etc. which were largely developed by more recent immigrants than those on the Mayflower. I get your point a bit more clearly now.

Oh no, that's not what I meant at all. Irish and Italian immigrants contributed enormously to our society, all while dealing with hardships and prejudice. That is my family history too, and I say that all the time.

Let's rewind just to make sure we're clear.

This was the statement we were discussing:

Seano liked that, and he said his family was mostly Irish.

If the Irish and Italians "settled undeveloped land and build civilization" then so are the current immigrants. Current immigrants are over-represented as business owners, over-represented in patents, and they are farmers and land settlers and everything that immigrants have always been.

The attempt to paint new immigrants as "others" who do not really belong and contribute the way others did is just a rebranding of history. Irish were the others. Italians were the others. They were shit on too, and seen as dumb thieves and undesirables in many cases.

 

[Seano]

"I'm not against immigration but I'm going to say some really dumb textbook xenophobic shit anyway"

Billions and billions of dollars every year.

 

[Rational Poster]

Billions and billions of dollars every year.

They also pay billions and billions in Federal taxes and rent.

They also don't get Social Security or Medicare for it. It's a huge gain for us honestly.

Per the IRS, people without social security numbers paid $24B in income tax. That's just the small percentage that claim a return. There are many more that pay income taxes and don't file a return.

 

[jonharrison]

Oh no, that's not what I meant at all. Irish and Italian immigrants contributed enormously to our society, all while dealing with hardships and prejudice. That is my family history too, and I say that all the time.

Let's rewind just to make sure we're clear.

This was the statement we were discussing:


Seano liked that, and he said his family was mostly Irish.

If the Irish and Italians "settled undeveloped land and build civilization" then so are the current immigrants. Current immigrants are over-represented as business owners, over-represented in patents, and they are farmers and land settlers and everything that immigrants have always been.

The attempt to paint new immigrants as "others" who do not really belong and contribute the way others did is just a rebranding of history. Irish were the others. Italians were the others. They were shit on too, and seen as dumb thieves and undesirables in many cases.

Seano could still be technically right, however, that his ancestors “developed the land” depending on when they got here. As an example, the town I currently live in was founded in the 1870s, so depending on his age, he very well could be only two or three generations removed from settlers who founded a town in the western United States. His ancestors also could’ve just set up shop in Boston and didn’t settle anything, I don’t know his family history. My point is that there absolutely were Irish families that acted as settlers in the Midwest and Western US. They founded towns and cities, established railroads, and cut farms out of wilderness. That doesn’t mean, though, that they’re inherently better or “more American” than other immigrants. I’m in agreement with you on that. Developing land, today, isn’t really relevant for an immigrant. Instead, establishing a new business, serving in a public service such as the military, or inventing a new product are the factors that contribute to the development of our nation. I am in complete agreement with you on that. It’s just not outside the realm of possibilities that his great grandparent could’ve actually been the one to physically develop a piece of land.

 

[nac386]

Seano could still be technically right, however, that his ancestors “developed the land” depending on when they got here. As an example, the town I currently live in was founded in the 1870s, so depending on his age, he very well could be only two or three generations removed from settlers who founded a town in the western United States. His ancestors also could’ve just set up shop in Boston and didn’t settle anything, I don’t know his family history. My point is that there absolutely were Irish families that acted as settlers in the Midwest and Western US. They founded towns and cities, established railroads, and cut farms out of wilderness. That doesn’t mean, though, that they’re inherently better or “more American” than other immigrants. I’m in agreement with you on that. Developing land, today, isn’t really relevant for an immigrant. Instead, establishing a new business, serving in a public service such as the military, or inventing a new product are the factors that contribute to the development of our nation. I am in complete agreement with you on that. It’s just not outside the realm of possibilities that his great grandparent could’ve actually been the one to physically develop a piece of land.

That's the entire point. There is a chance an Irish guy physically developed a piece of land, just like there is a chance a Mexican guy physically developed a piece of land.

There is a chance his grandfather owned a business, and there is a chance an Indian immigrant owns a business.

 

[Seano]

They also pay billions and billions in Federal taxes and rent.

They also don't get Social Security or Medicare for it. It's a huge gain for us honestly.

Per the IRS, people without social security numbers paid $24B in income tax. That's just the small percentage that claim a return. There are many more that pay income taxes and don't file a return.

I believe our current immigration policy drives down wages and ensures a life of dependency. To me, its exploitation of the most vulnerable at the expense of the taxpayers.

 

[Rational Poster]

I believe our current immigration policy drives down wages and ensures a life of dependency. To me, its exploitation of the most vulnerable at the expense of the taxpayers.

Life of dependency lol.

 

[Seano]

Oh no, that's not what I meant at all. Irish and Italian immigrants contributed enormously to our society, all while dealing with hardships and prejudice. That is my family history too, and I say that all the time.

Let's rewind just to make sure we're clear.

This was the statement we were discussing:


Seano liked that, and he said his family was mostly Irish.

If the Irish and Italians "settled undeveloped land and build civilization" then so are the current immigrants. Current immigrants are over-represented as business owners, over-represented in patents, and they are farmers and land settlers and everything that immigrants have always been.

The attempt to paint new immigrants as "others" who do not really belong and contribute the way others did is just a rebranding of history. Irish were the others. Italians were the others. They were shit on too, and seen as dumb thieves and undesirables in many cases.

I didn't say mostly Irish. I said Irish and British. More British than irish.

 

[Seano]

Life of dependency lol.

Sorry, it bothers you but its true.

 

[Rational Poster]

Sorry, it bothers you but its true.

It's actually not, that's why I laughed.

The only ones living a life of dependency are the corporations getting tax cuts while wage gouging and deep red states that have completely failed their people for generations.

 

[nac386]

Mongrel. English, Irish mostly. A dash of native american and a little mystery on my mother's father and his background.

I didn't say mostly Irish. I said Irish and British. More British than irish.

Seano, The only way to interpret this post is that you are mostly Irish.

 

[nac386]

I believe our current immigration policy drives down wages and ensures a life of dependency. To me, its exploitation of the most vulnerable at the expense of the taxpayers.

Then you should be attacking the government and the government policies, not saying that immigrants are now more undesirable than your immigrant family. They are building businesses at a higher rate than American-born citizens.

 

[Seano]

Then you should be attacking the government and the government policies, not saying that immigrants are now more undesirable than your immigrant family.

I do. I am pro immigration reform. So are most conservatives. Its liberals that don't want a solution.

 

[nac386]

I do. I am pro immigration reform. So are most conservatives. Its liberals that don't want a solution.

That's not true Seano, you have to be more aware than that. Republicans and Democrats have both halted immigration reform over the years, there's no way you could be paying any attention and not see that.

 

[dontsnitch]

These new memes are getting really wordy.

 

[Rational Poster]

I do. I am pro immigration reform. So are most conservatives. Its liberals that don't want a solution.

Then why does the GOP congress keep rejecting their own conservative immigration bills?

They've killed two this past month, lol?

 

[HockeyBjj]

Why the fuck are there so many text replies to a damn meme thread!?!

 

[SurferH2O]

 

[Max Power]