Judo vs wrestling.

[Rvd Slmr]

Trigg loves getting choked.

Holy shit, the choke was held for almost eight seconds, WTF.

 

[RyuHayabusa]

Judo, wrestling, kickboxing they are all bollocks names just made up by individuals to appeal for more students rivaling rival teachers.

Theres only 2 art - grappling and striking

 

[shortlefthook]

Catch wrestlers have pretty shitty takedowns, they are a lot better than bjj takedowns, but you're not going to take someone down who is better at it than you. Freestyle/folkstyle > catch.

Yeah I think I'll take the submission grappler over someone who trains no submissions.
Guess what happens when you pin a blackbelt in mma? Nothing

 

[eternaldarkness]

Judo, wrestling, kickboxing they are all bollocks names just made up by individuals to appeal for more students rivaling rival teachers.

Theres only 2 art - grappling and striking

3 actually, grappling, striking and running like a bitch. the most effective self defence of all.

 

[deev]

 

[deev]

 

[RyuHayabusa]

3 actually, grappling, striking and running like a bitch. the most effective self defence of all.

 

[wrestlefan]

Might as well make the thread knife Vs gun.

 

[Claude]

Pure wrestling vs. pure Judo, I'd give Judo the edge due to joint locks.

In MMA you have countless other variables, so it becomes more about transitioning than anything.

Neither Judo nor Sambo have conditioning/weight cutting cultures surrounding them. Sambo is slowly getting there, but it's still light years away from Folkstyle. There's a reason that most MMA champions have been Folkstyle wrestlers, especially in the modern era.

Yes,

American orgs. like the UFC sign up mostly american fighters who often have collegiate wrestling backgrounds.

No rocket science.

 

[eternaldarkness]

damn that was smooth.

 

[eternaldarkness]

Might as well make the thread knife Vs gun.

funny you mention that, because knives have been proven to be more deadly within a certain range of engagement. also more people that have been stabbed die than those that have been shot due to the multiple strikes involved in most stabbings.

 

[JustBleed69]

someone posted a thread about the downfall of ronda and it got me thinking about the differences between judo and wrestling takedowns\throws. i think judo really excels when you have someone trying to push forward into the clinch to dirty box or wrestle, but falls apart a bit when you have someone the is purely focused on denying the clinch and staying on the outside to strike.
all it takes is a couple of knees and then push away, because upper body throws take a bit more to set up than leg takedowns. the advantage judo throws have if performed correctly, is they take less energy and have great impact. i think it has a bit to do with judo being a more defensive art by nature.

How many top guys now are formed judo athletes vs wrestlers?

That should answer your question.

 

[eternaldarkness]

How many top guys now are formed judo athletes vs wrestlers?

That should answer your question.

it wasn't a question, it was an analyse of the differences in style. i wasn't saying one was better that the other, just that they both excel in different areas. i had a mate the was right into judo as a kid and he helped our grappling game tremendously. i have more of a wrestling style and never really got comfortable with the way you have to sacrifice your weight to perform a lot of judo throws. i also am a big believer in basics and wrestling takedowns take a bit less to learn and are easier to perform under pressure. however they don't work as well against bigger opponents as judo throws do, if performed properly.

 

[srdrgz11]

A good example is Karo vs Sanchez. I don't know too much about Judo as it relates to top position but in folk style wrestling there's a huge emphasis on top control. In that fight, Karo was able to implement his judo throws but Sanchez easily scrambled out to gain top control.

As wrestlers, we are taught several upper body throws and trips as well. I've often seen many of these throws being labeled as judo throws. When in fact, there is a ton of crossed in the two sports when it comes to upper body throws and trips.

The reason u don't see a lot of wrestlers, especially folk style, go for throws is they are high risk and low probability. Additionally, even when they are successful, it's often easy to roll through with them and end up in top control. That's exactly what Sanchez did to Karo.

In my opinion, BJJ will always be the single best discipline to know.
Wrestling will always be the best base.

 

[Deleted member 509215]

If you're referring to Sambo, yes it does, but the grappling in Sambo is mostly a hybrid of Judo + Wrestling in the first place.

Ah no, I just thought the Russian style of judo incorporated that but thank you man

 

[14.09]

Freestyle wrestling has TDs below the waist, Judo doesnt.

Judo definitely does. They are just banned in the big competitions to make a difference to wrestling.

 

[14.09]

Judo has TDs below the waist (morote gari for example) they are just banned in competition along with pick up throws because the Japanese got whipped at the Olympics by the Mongolians and Russians extensively using those techniques.
Unfortunately that's why those techniques aren't taught in competition oriented schools. But a few decades ago they were usual in judo competition.

You are spreading a myth. Name me the times or they guys where Japanese "got whipped at the Olympics" by below the waist throws. It may have happened once or twice, but it definitely wasn't extensive or a reason for rule changes. I remember reading that the Olympics wanted to differentiate judo from wrestling, and wanted to give the casual audience more spectacular throws. Same reason that they've been shortening the ground time for.

 

[SeaLevelMizugaki]

Judo definitely does. They are just banned in the big competitions to make a difference to wrestling.

The point was that elite judokas dont use them anymore

 

[14.09]

Judo is whatever, but for MMA, it's largely a joke. Especially pure Judo players making the cross over.

Pure judo beats pure wrestling. We got to see proof of this during JMMA heydays. Look at the performances of Olympic medalist wrestlers like Karam Gaber Ibrahim, Istvan Majoros, Katsuhiko Nagata, Eldar Kurtanidze who tried MMA. Then look at how Yoshida, Akiyama, Takimoto, Nastula, Nakamura etc did right away without much cross-training. And look beyond their records too.

EDIT: And I have to add that all of those judokas were way out of their primes when they crossed over.

As for a base for further MMA training, I don't know. Wrestling benefits from being no-gi, judo benefits from submissions. Both train hard and physically.

 

[14.09]

The point was that elite judokas dont use them anymore

Well you quite clearly said that judo doesn't have below waist takedowns, which is wrong. And I can assure you that the elite knows their judo thoroughly. Even at the Olympic medal level there are some ground wizards, even though it wouldn't be that necessary anymore. And after all, the elite never cross over to MMA, at least not in their primes.