Jon Jones CSAC Hearing and Future

[Daniel Rosenke]

Jon Jones was fined $205,000, and stripped of his CSAC license on Feb 26.
The facts of the case:
1) Jones passes two pre-fight drug tests on July 6, and 7.
2) Jones tests positive for the anabolic steroid Turinabol in a post-fight drug test, July 28.
3) Jones tests clean in a post-fight drug test July 29 (though apparently he wasn't tested for Turinabol at that time, which makes zero sense).
4) Jones tests clean on Oct. 11, in an out-of-competition test.
5) Sometime after, it is revealed Jones' A-sample from his first post-fight test contained Turinabol metabolites.

A few questions:
Why the fuck would anybody take a 'dinosaur' steroid like Turinabol, which has a long half-life (anywhere from 3-6 weeks), and little potential to yield any ergogenic benefit 3-weeks from the fight?
Given that the blood concentration of T-bol metabolites was so minute, is it possible Jones accidentally ingested the compound via a tainted supplement, or perhaps stomped down cocaine (yes, this is a theory posed by his defense team)?
Notwithstanding his errant behavior in the past, Jones is a smart guy. Knowing full well that the heat was already on him, and this was potentially his last chance with the organization, why take the risk? Remember, should this case be a straightforward one, Jones started a short and relatively ineffective T-bol cycle 3-weeks prior to the fight. Bones might have impulse control issues, but he's fully aware of the life-ruining repercussions of a positive test.


http://mmajunkie.com/2018/02/califo...5000-revokes-license-failed-ufc-214-drug-test

 

[Substance Abuse]

Jones is not a smart guy.

 

[Megatronlee]

He’s a good guy. Our lord and savior Jesus Christ will protect us

 

[Daniel Rosenke]

Maybe not in some ways, but he's educated and well-spoken, and can certainly appreciate that taking an easily detectable relic of a steroid 3-weeks out isn't advisable.
My point was this case doesn't make any sense.

Jones is not a smart guy.

 

[waldywaldy]

He took some other undetectable designer shit that was contaminated. Just because he didn't intentionally take/get busted for t-bol doesn't mean he wasn't taking something to gain an edge.

 

[Senzo Tanaka]

People act like there's some universal drug test they give guys. When you drug test someone, you look for a handful of drugs. It also depends on if you test blood or urine on what you can detect.

It may simply be a case that they checked for turinabal in one test and not the other. It would be a waste of time, money and resources to test for every single possible PED out there. That's not how drug testing works.

 

[dim_]

Jon Jones was fined $205,000, and stripped of his CSAC license on Feb 26.
The facts of the case:
1) Jones passes two pre-fight drug tests on July 6, and 7.

which is totally normal. every single athlete that has ever tested positive has also had non positive tests prior

2) Jones tests positive for the anabolic steroid Turinabol in a post-fight drug test, July 28.

It wassnt a post fight drug test, it was a test on teh day of weigh-ins

3) Jones tests clean in a post-fight drug test July 29 (though apparently he wasn't tested for Turinabol at that time, which makes zero sense).

makes total sense.. the turinabol metabolites test is a urine test, his post fight sample was a blood sample

4) Jones tests clean on Oct. 11, in an out-of-competition test.

Again, totally normal. the detection window of the turinabol metabolite is 50-60 days, so of course he would be negative in october (unless he was stupid enough to take prohibited substances AFTER being informed he had tested positive)

5) Sometime after, it is revealed Jones' A-sample from his first post-fight test contained Turinabol metabolites.

no, again, it was a post weigh-in, pre fight test




And your point is (apart from demonstrating you know nothing about the case or anti doping )?

 

[Daniel Rosenke]

That's certainly a theory, but what exactly do you mean? Testing assays used by USADA and WADA are designed to detect molecules similar to testosterone, ie. any anabolic steroids, pro-hormones, unknown compounds. It's possible Jones did attempt this without knowledge of the testing measures in place.
This also begs the question: what "designer drugs"? There has yet to be any evidence supporting this idea, that there are 50 different BALCO-like anabolic compounds out there, and if they were, there would be 'red-flags' in the GS-MC tests.

He took some other undetectable designer shit that was contaminated. Just because he didn't intentionally take/get busted for t-bol doesn't mean he wasn't taking something to gain an edge.

 

[Pierced7681]

Masking agent, timed his cycle wrong, trace amounts found.

Any questions?

 

[Crimp_Keeper]

TS said Jones is a “smart guy”

 

[dim_]

Why the fuck would anybody take a 'dinosaur' steroid like Turinabol, which has a long half-life (anywhere from 3-6 weeks), and little potential to yield any ergogenic benefit 3-weeks from the fight?

It doesnt have a long half life. The "metabolite" M3 has a long "Detection window"

Im not going to explain to you the difference between biological half life and detection window, you can google

Given that the blood concentration of T-bol metabolites was so minute,

Fucking hell, where to start on this.. First, "Blood concentration",.. the metabolite isnt even present in the blood.. i think you mean "urinary concentration"

Second, there is no record ANYWHERE of what the actual urinary concentration was, but its largely irrelevant.. everything in urine is by its very nature "trace"

is it possible Jones accidentally ingested the compound via a tainted supplement,

They tested every single supplement he declared on his doping control form and another ten on top. none contained turinabol. which is no susprise. USADA and the FDA have never found a single supplement containing turinabol where it wasnt obvious that the supplement contained prohibited substances

or perhaps stomped down cocaine (yes, this is a theory posed by his defense team)?

that was not put forward by his defence team. It was put forward by Joe Rogan

 

[thehighking]

which is totally normal. every single athlete that has ever tested positive has also had non positive tests prior




It wassnt a post fight drug test, it was a test on teh day of weigh-ins




makes total sense.. the turinabol metabolites test is a urine test, his post fight sample was a blood sample




Again, totally normal. the detection window of the turinabol metabolite is 50-60 days, so of course he would be negative in october (unless he was stupid enough to take prohibited substances AFTER being informed he had tested positive)



no, again, it was a post weigh-in, pre fight test




And your point is (apart from demonstrating you know nothing about the case or anti doping )?

[/QUOTE]
I think he's trying to persuade us that Jones is innocent lol

 

[myjohnson9]

Jones gets two years minimum from USADA

 

[Money509]

Jon Jones was fined $205,000, and stripped of his CSAC license on Feb 26.
The facts of the case:
1) Jones passes two pre-fight drug tests on July 6, and 7.
2) Jones tests positive for the anabolic steroid Turinabol in a post-fight drug test, July 28.
3) Jones tests clean in a post-fight drug test July 29 (though apparently he wasn't tested for Turinabol at that time, which makes zero sense).
4) Jones tests clean on Oct. 11, in an out-of-competition test.
5) Sometime after, it is revealed Jones' A-sample from his first post-fight test contained Turinabol metabolites.

A few questions:
Why the fuck would anybody take a 'dinosaur' steroid like Turinabol, which has a long half-life (anywhere from 3-6 weeks), and little potential to yield any ergogenic benefit 3-weeks from the fight?
Given that the blood concentration of T-bol metabolites was so minute, is it possible Jones accidentally ingested the compound via a tainted supplement, or perhaps stomped down cocaine (yes, this is a theory posed by his defense team)?
Notwithstanding his errant behavior in the past, Jones is a smart guy. Knowing full well that the heat was already on him, and this was potentially his last chance with the organization, why take the risk? Remember, should this case be a straightforward one, Jones started a short and relatively ineffective T-bol cycle 3-weeks prior to the fight. Bones might have impulse control issues, but he's fully aware of the life-ruining repercussions of a positive test.


http://mmajunkie.com/2018/02/califo...5000-revokes-license-failed-ufc-214-drug-test

He didnt take turinabol on purpose. His other PEDS were contaminated with it or he got framed.

 

[Daniel Rosenke]

Actually, it sort of does.
What generally happens is that in the course of testing a sample, certain PED 'boxes' are checked off, representing the category of drug that will be tested for. Because the testing procedure is the same for all anabolic compounds (except synthetic testosterone), if they're testing for one, they're testing for all of them. The same goes for stimulants, beta-blockers, pain-killers, EPO agents etc.
T-bol would never be omitted from that list... My guess is, if they did not in fact test for it in his post-fight screening, there was no anabolic steroid analysis period.

People act like there's some universal drug test they give guys. When you drug test someone, you look for a handful of drugs. It also depends on if you test blood or urine on what you can detect.

It may simply be a case that they checked for turinabal in one test and not the other. It would be a waste of time, money and resources to test for every single possible PED out there. That's not how drug testing works.

 

[21 Savage]

THE ABSOLUTE STATE OF SHERDOG WHEN JONATHAN GETS CLEARED LMAO

 

[Money509]

That's certainly a theory, but what exactly do you mean? Testing assays used by USADA and WADA are designed to detect molecules similar to testosterone, ie. any anabolic steroids, pro-hormones, unknown compounds. It's possible Jones did attempt this without knowledge of the testing measures in place.
This also begs the question: what "designer drugs"? There has yet to be any evidence supporting this idea, that there are 50 different BALCO-like anabolic compounds out there, and if they were, there would be 'red-flags' in the GS-MC tests.

Listen to what Conte said. He said jones was most likely micro dosing TRT and it flew under the radar. The problem was that wherever he got the TRT from it got tainted in the same lab by turnibol which stays in your system longer and is probably easier to catch on the tests.

 

[dim_]

That's certainly a theory, but what exactly do you mean? Testing assays used by USADA and WADA are designed to detect molecules similar to testosterone, ie. any anabolic steroids, pro-hormones, unknown compounds. It's possible Jones did attempt this without knowledge of the testing measures in place.
This also begs the question: what "designer drugs"? There has yet to be any evidence supporting this idea, that there are 50 different BALCO-like anabolic compounds out there, and if they were, there would be 'red-flags' in the GS-MC tests.

its really simple

he was tested three weeks out from the fight

he (rightfully) concluded he wouldnt be tested again till fight week

so he ran a quick cycle of something with a short detection window (exogenous test suspension for instance)

that "something" was contaminated with something with a longer detection window (turinabol)

Bingo.. the intended ped is long since gone from his system, the contaminant remains and was detected

case closed

 

[Daniel Rosenke]

I agree... the bulk of the evidence supports this anyway.
Who knows what actually happened, but the totality of the evidence suggests he probably didn't knowingly take the drug in question.

He didnt take turinabol on purpose. His other PEDS were contaminated with it or he got framed.

 

[dim_]

Actually, it sort of does.
What generally happens is that in the course of testing a sample, certain PED 'boxes' are checked off, representing the category of drug that will be tested for. Because the testing procedure is the same for all anabolic compounds (except synthetic testosterone), if they're testing for one, they're testing for all of them. The same goes for stimulants, beta-blockers, pain-killers, EPO agents etc.
T-bol would never be omitted from that list..

again, this is not true.

the turinabol metabolites test is a dedicated test and not the same test as looking for say, stanozolol.



the standard turinabol test, yes, that has things in common with other testosterone derived steroid tests.

but this is NOT a test for turinabol, its a test for a specific metabolite

ps. the test for epo is not the same as te test for beta-blockers...

T-bol would never be omitted from that list... My guess is, if they did not in fact test for it in his post-fight screening, there was no anabolic steroid analysis period.

and again, as already explained HIS POST FIGHT TEST WAS A BLOOD TEST - THE TURINABOL METABOLITES TEST IS A URINE TEST

Yes, his blood sample may well have been analysed for steroids, BUT NOT FOR THE TURINABOL METABOLITE M3!!!! It could not be analysed for the metabolite M3 as already explained.