John Danaher invented the inverted kata gatame strangle (a.k.a. D'arce Choke)

[Concrete Whale]

ask the guy(s) who are tapping you out about it after class. They'd know better than anyone what you're doing wrong

Yeah I wanted to just smoothly counter it next time lol but that is the most logical answer.

 

[mataleaos]

Guys I was going to make a thread about this I am getting consistently darced in bottom half guard (no gi) I have my underhook and am coming up to my knees/feet but end up getting d'arced is there anything in particular I should watch out for? Be less predictable?

The darce changed the game when it hit the scene because it works when the other person does the right thing. So your under-hooking gives them the darce opportunity, but if you imrpove your underhook, your posture, and you go into your sweeps quickly then you should get darce choked less. Also unless someone has very long arms or is a darce specialist then they may not be able to choke through a good underhook. Most of the best darcers will clear the underhook before actually trying to finish the submission. I would suggest trying to keep your half guard at their knee or higher so that you can shift their base as they're attacking the choke. A good darcer will be able to choke you top or bottom so be careful with letting someone lock it up, thinking you'll be fine if you just sweep them. That can often make the choke tighter. A solid half guard with a good underhook and strong posture will stop most darce chokers.

 

[trustdoesntrust]

Guys I was going to make a thread about this I am getting consistently darced in bottom half guard (no gi) I have my underhook and am coming up to my knees/feet but end up getting d'arced is there anything in particular I should watch out for? Be less predictable?

The darce is weird because it can seem undefendable from that position when you're a blue belt and below, but then can seem unfinishable from purple belt and above. Aside from pre-emptive actions like using your offhand to block the crossface, and making sure there's minimal space between your head and opponent's legs/hip, you should understand the mechanics for finishing the darce. The choke works by forcing your own arm into your carotid, similar to an arm-triangle. So if your in-choke bicep is away from your neck, either with arm extended or elbows tightly framed, then you cannot really be choked. Your opponent also needs a certain angle to force your arm into the choke, and I feel like lower belts often relinquish this angle because they feel the darce being threatened and then freeze up. Watch here how Garry Tonon eliminates the threat of Keenan Cornelius' darce by going into deep half guard:

 

[HtomSirveaux]

There are some good darce guys where even when I get a strong underhook, have good head position etc, they can somehow blast thru all that and get me anyway. So it may not be the best answer, but for them I just make a mental note to use frames instead under hooks.

 

[mataleaos]

The darce is weird because it can seem undefendable from that position when you're a blue belt and below, but then can seem unfinishable from purple belt and above. Aside from pre-emptive actions like using your offhand to block the crossface, and making sure there's minimal space between your head and opponent's legs/hip, you should understand the mechanics for finishing the darce. The choke works by forcing your own arm into your carotid, similar to an arm-triangle. So if your in-choke bicep is away from your neck, either with arm extended or elbows tightly framed, then you cannot really be choked. Your opponent also needs a certain angle to force your arm into the choke, and I feel like lower belts often relinquish this angle because they feel the darce being threatened and then freeze up. Watch here how Garry Tonon eliminates the threat of Keenan Cornelius' darce by going into deep half guard:

That's a great video example and Keenan's darce at the end of the match seemed to be a bit tighter.

For the one that you tagged I sort of like when people try to go under because it helps give me the momentum to roll over and onto my right hip (if were in Keenan's position) for more leverage and because they already have the legs tied up, they can't shrimp away to escape.

Tonon himself actually pulls a similar move here but he does it proactively instead of letting them get under him first.

 

[JoelThomas]

"Our senseis are probably the single biggest influence on the directions we go in the sport."

"Renzo's primary concern was always combat effectiveness."

Cue Cummings and Ryan sitting on their asses

 

[ThePainFactory]

Not the first time he mentioned it.

Another anecdote is reading the Carlson Gracie book and watch picture of him teaching the jello guard. Which look very similar to the guard made popular by his student de LA riva.​

I attended a siminar at 4 season in lexington kentycky back in the middle 90s where he went over aspects of jello guard. I can assure you de la Riva is based on jello guard

 

[Pixelated Porn]

and before everyone and their mother jumps on me for not gobbling his nuts,.

lol, do you know where the fuck you are? if you didn't fucking whine about everything danaher did or said everyone would jump on you....so you are safe

 

[Idonotbelieveit]

No He didn't . He made it popular

 

[Concrete Whale]

Thanks that was very helpful. Yes the person doing it is a lanky build with long thin arms whereas I am more stocky. And as someone mentioned once they get it locked up you have to escape the choke specifically it doesn't help much to get out from under them or even come on top.

 

[NSchoke]

"Our senseis are probably the single biggest influence on the directions we go in the sport."

"Renzo's primary concern was always combat effectiveness."

Cue Cummings and Ryan sitting on their asses

And running thru almost they face in competition.

Cummings and Ryan are perfect examples of Renzo encouraging what works regardless of tradition.

 

[mattemate]

Dickson said they weren't doing that in the 80s. Inventing a technique is one thing, developing and refining setups is another that I think Danaher can take credit for.

 

[mattemate]

Dickson said they weren't doing that in the 80s. Inventing a technique is one thing, developing and refining setups is another that I think Danaher can take credit for.

I was gonna edit this after I saw Dickson bit it think I like it that way

 

[dmwalking]

Someone won't be getting a handshake anytime soon...

I'm sure it's childish of me, but I actually let out a genuine belly laugh at this. Perfect comedic timing. Well done.

Some are smart, some aren't. The whole thing about jiu-jitsu being about dynamically solving a problem that's trying to solve you (or something like that) sounds smarty and fancy, but it also applies to... most sports. You do the same in badminton

I love Danaher. I've been on his wave for a good 5 years or more. I believed the hype. But honestly, not one of his essays has made a difference in my jiu jitsu in a practical way. In the early stages, I appreciated his philosophy, but I already know it. I get it. I appreciate it. I adopted it. At this point, it's a bit superfluous. He should just link everyone to old comments he's made in that past. But I'll admit that I'm cynical. I'm just over it. He should just live through his students at this point and spare us his psyche masturbation. But that's my asshole opinion. Like I said, I am over it. Me. It's up to you to decide how you feel. But I'm bored of it. I get it. I adopted it. And in the end, I still have a long ass way to go in jiu jitsu and reading his long ass essays aren't helping.

Pardon the drunk rant.

 

[TheGZA]

I was gonna edit this after I saw Dickson bit it think I like it that way

Dickson by armbar.

 

[rmongler]

Dickson by armbar.

Dickson by third hook.

 

[Rico]

"Our senseis are probably the single biggest influence on the directions we go in the sport."

"Renzo's primary concern was always combat effectiveness."

Cue Cummings and Ryan sitting on their asses

And yet oddly Gordon got the better of Keenan on the feet when he chose to engage there.

 

[rmongler]

And yet oddly Gordon got the better of Keenan on the feet when he chose to engage there.

That's not how I remember it; Keenan's best moments (aside from an abortive triangle attempt) in that slog in fact were his takedowns directly to side-control.

 

[Rico]

That's not how I remember it; Keenan's best moments (aside from an abortive triangle attempt) in that slog in fact were his takedowns directly to side-control.

Keenan got dumped by foot sweeps a few times. I can't be arsed to watch that whole thing again but from what remember, Gordon did quite well on the feet.

 

[rmongler]

Keenan got dumped by foot sweeps a few times. I can't be arsed to watch that whole thing again but from what remember, Gordon did quite well on the feet.

But on balance? I'd say Keenan had more successes on the feet.