It doesn't matter if Robbie Lawler was out or not!

[BBMN]

So people pass out from a bulldog? LOL.

 

[BlackDanaWhite]

No it shows that Robbie only woke up because herb touched him. Like I said, Robbie was getting subbed anyway.

Again, it's irrelevant. When Herb observed the potentially limp arm of Robbie he did not stop the fight. Herb proceeded to test Robbies arm to see if it really is limp. Herb then fails to observe the results of his limp arm test and makes an incorrect call by stopping the fight.
You clearly don't know what you're talking about if you think that head lock is a fight ending move. It's far more likely Robbie was going to get out moments later and continue embarrassing Askren.

 

[GSP_37]

New saying: "Don't leave it in the hands of the ref."

Robbie should have done some pop dancing while in the choke so the ref knew he was conscious. Problem solved.

 

[zippo88]

Here is my question: do you think ref should have stopped a fight earlier when Ben was down and Lawler was throwing punches on him? I’ve seen so many fights when ref would stop a fight in similar situations but in this case he gave a chance to Askren.

 

[Wicked_1]

It's a fact that he WASN'T out when Herb stopped the fight so it remains a shit stoppage and a robbery no matter how you try to spin it. Also there's no way for us to know for sure whether or not he was out at one point. An arm that appears to be limp for a fraction of a second isn't enough to tell for sure. All we know for sure is that he was awake when Herb stopped it which means Robbie was robbed.

If robbie was robbed as u say, it was his own fault for not giving a more readable thumbs up for a longer time. His arm never stopped moving during what people are calling a thumbs up. Robbie has been around a long time, and should know to hold the thumb up for a longer period. There was no reason for him to flash it like that and return his hand to the mat. It wasn't for balance or anything so... 8 can't blame herb for calling it, everyone there cageside and watching on TV thought he was out when his arm initially fell.

 

[Fatality]

The only thing that matters is that Robbie was in a position that forced the ref to make a judgement call. Whether that was the right call or not is irrelevant. The ref did his job and acted in the way he thought was best for Robbie's health.

 

[BlackDanaWhite]

It matters because these tiny details are significant in critical decision making for a ref.

Here's two things I personally believed happened;
1, Robbie appeared to go limp for a very brief time.
2, Robbie was in full control of the situation at the point herb intervened.

There's no point in everyone arguing about it.
The decision was questionable at the point of intervention but also Robbies arm hit the canvas in a limp fashion beforehand.
In MMA decisions sometimes frustrate us but at the end of the day the refs primary concern is fighter safety.

Here's hoping a rematch ends with a ruthless KO

Herb observed Robbies arm go limp and tested to see if the arm was really limp by doing an arm drop test. Herb then failed to see the results by looking away for a moment. This is 100% on herb because Robbie clearly responded to the arm drop test by keeping his hand up and giving a thumbs up.

 

[revoltub]

Again, it's irrelevant. When Herb observed the potentially limp arm of Robbie he did not stop the fight. Herb proceeded to test Robbies arm to see if it really is limp. Herb then fails to observe the results of his limp arm test and makes an incorrect call by stopping the fight.
You clearly don't know what you're talking about if you think that head lock is a fight ending move. It's far more likely Robbie was going to get out moments later and continue embarrassing Askren.

Its a bulldog choke, and it has ended plenty fights.

 

[scottmushroom]

Agreed.

Herb had a terrible angle of view (due to the cage blocking where he needed to be), saw Robbie’s arms go limp, Robbie wasn’t responding verbally and he made the call.

In hindsight, we know it was the wrong call. But in the moment he errored on the side of protecting Robbie.
I’m okay with it.

I wish more people would realize this. I thought he went out watching the live broadcast as well, but then replays showed me otherwise. I'd prefer an early stoppage to a late one as well, if he had been out and Herb let it keep going, there would have been a lot more than disappointment happening.

 

[BlackDanaWhite]

The only thing that matters is that Robbie was in a position that forced the ref to make a judgement call. Whether that was the right call or not is irrelevant. The ref did his job and acted in the way he thought was best for Robbie's health.

And herb made a huge mistake. Herb picked up Robbies arm to see if it was limp and Robbies arm wasn't limp. Herb failed to observe this so it's herbs fault.

 

[BlackDanaWhite]

Its a bulldog choke, and it has ended plenty fights.

Not when applied like that. It's a very low percentage choke and it usually ends up with bad positioning. That's why it's not very common and is usually more of a desperation attempt.

 

[revoltub]

Not when applied like that. It's a very low percentage choke and it usually ends up with bad positioning. That's why it's not very common and is usually more of a desperation attempt.

It was locked.

 

[Greco_Wiz]

Askren finishes a former UFC champ in the first. He’s proven to be a legitimate contender to the title.

 

[Get these Hands]

he did stop the fight after checking the limp arm lol

It wasn't limp when he checked it. You know there's video right?

 

[StayCranked]

It wasn't limp when he checked it. You know there's video right?

yeah looked limp to me

 

[maartenjackie]

It matters because these tiny details are significant in critical decision making for a ref.

Here's two things I personally believed happened;
1, Robbie appeared to go limp for a very brief time.
2, Robbie was in full control of the situation at the point herb intervened.

There's no point in everyone arguing about it.
The decision was questionable at the point of intervention but also Robbies arm hit the canvas in a limp fashion beforehand.
In MMA decisions sometimes frustrate us but at the end of the day the refs primary concern is fighter safety.

Here's hoping a rematch ends with a ruthless KO

Full control lmfao

 

[Get these Hands]

yeah looked limp to me

Fair enough.

 

[Amygdala]

Simple fact: when a situation like that is unclear, a ref HAS TO err on the side of caution.

Being able to say it was a bad stoppage is preferable to having a guy unconscious for too long.

So: it was a bad stoppage. We know that because the ref did what he was supposed to do. And that’s ok.

 

[Xaero]

Wait, so after going to sleep on a choke, people just stand up?

What kind of McDojo do you guys train from?

 

[mkess101]

Not saying it wasn't. Doesn't mean it wasn't a robbery though. The fact remains that Robbie was fully conscious when the fight got stopped.



Robbie wasn't out though when he stopped it or was he?. That's exactly my point

When things are happening that quickly, the human brain sometimes takes a couple seconds to process all the information it's receiving and act on it. Herb is looking at it, sees Robbie's arm go limp and drop, then steps in to check a second later. By that time Robbie isn't out, but Herb's brain is still processing seeing him go limp. It's all happening within a couple seconds.

I definitely understand what you are saying, and Herb should have stepped in immediately when Robbie's arm went limp and dropped the way it did. Because Herb waited, we have a controversial stoppage.