Law Is there a way to shift the tax burden away from the lower and middle class?

[BreatheSherBro]

I do not hate the rich. I do not want to tax them more just for the sake of wealth redistribution. I want to tax them more because there is a certain amount of tax revenue that is needed and they are more in a position to pay it than the lower and middle class. Our current tax system increases inequality and keeps the lower and middle classes divided and in opposition to each other even though the lower and middle class share more common interests with each other than they do with the rich.

Income taxes and sales taxes do not shift the tax burden away from the lower and middle class. The wealthiest people do not get their wealth from selling their labor the way the lower and middle class do. Most of their wealth is tied into stocks and other investments. I think income and sales taxes should both be lowered since they are paid disproportionately by the lower and middle class.

Current laws make it difficult to tax the wealthy. You do not want to discourage investment or hurt the economy. You also do not want to tax the wealthy in such a way that makes it to where they can recoup their money by raising prices for the goods and services they control.

Is it possible to shift the tax burden away from the lower and middle class and more towards the wealthy? If so, how could it be done?

I'm interested in your suggestions. Since it seems difficult to tax the wealth tied to investments, I thought it might be possible to tax their property at a high rate. A very high rate of taxation on property like mansions when their total amount of property equals more than 20 million or something like that. I think it would be harder for them to shield property from taxation than wealth tied up in stock. It would also have the added benefit of discouraging them from buying up all available property. There is probably some reason this would be difficult though. What kind of ideas do you have?

 

[avenue94]

Depends how much less of a burden you want them to carry since most income tax comes from higher earners, even if lower earners will pay a higher overall tax rate. The obvious loopholes to close if you're trying to increase revenue at higher income, things like making sure the SALT deduction doesn't come back, doing away with Prop 13-esque measures, increasing estate taxes, eliminating the Social Security phase out, tax non-primary homes more.

 

[Rygu]

How will the upper class be able to upgrade their yachts every year, if you tax them more they might only be able to upgrade every 2 years, or even worse every THREE years?

I'm confident you've seen the error of your ways.

 

[Possum Jenkins]

 

[fedoriswar37]

Sure. But what they'll just do is continue to tax the shit out of us as well as tax the "rich" more too.

 

[Limeade]

Tax capital gains as ordinary income

 

[BreatheSherBro]

Sure. But what they'll just do is continue to tax the shit out of us as well as tax the "rich" more too.

I wouldn't doubt it. Neither party does much to lower taxes on the lower and middle class.

I don't think it has to be that way though, it's just what happens because neither party really represents us.

 

[mixmastermo]

I believe we need to start looking at large companies and make sure they pay their fair share. If you didn't already know, you'd be shocked at how little companies like Amazon, GM, and ExxonMobil pay

It's all right here.

These 19 Fortune 100 Companies Paid Next to Nothing—or Nothing at All—in Taxes in 2021

Analysis shows that during a year of high corporate profits, many of the biggest corporations in America either paid minimal or no federal income taxes.

www.americanprogress.org

 

[BreatheSherBro]

I believe we need to start looking at large companies and make sure they pay their fair share. If you didn't already know, you'd be shocked at how little companies like Amazon, GM, and ExxonMobil pay

It's all right here.

These 19 Fortune 100 Companies Paid Next to Nothing—or Nothing at All—in Taxes in 2021

Analysis shows that during a year of high corporate profits, many of the biggest corporations in America either paid minimal or no federal income taxes.

www.americanprogress.org

Corporations get all kinds of tax breaks. The problem with trying to tax them though is they pass it back to consumers. If you tax Exxon they will surely raise gas prices since gas is a necessity.

 

[Andy Capp]

I do not hate the rich. I do not want to tax them more just for the sake of wealth redistribution. I want to tax them more because there is a certain amount of tax revenue that is needed and they are more in a position to pay it than the lower and middle class. Our current tax system increases inequality and keeps the lower and middle classes divided and in opposition to each other even though the lower and middle class share more common interests with each other than they do with the rich.

Income taxes and sales taxes do not shift the tax burden away from the lower and middle class. The wealthiest people do not get their wealth from selling their labor the way the lower and middle class do. Most of their wealth is tied into stocks and other investments. I think income and sales taxes should both be lowered since they are paid disproportionately by the lower and middle class.

Current laws make it difficult to tax the wealthy. You do not want to discourage investment or hurt the economy. You also do not want to tax the wealthy in such a way that makes it to where they can recoup their money by raising prices for the goods and services they control.

Is it possible to shift the tax burden away from the lower and middle class and more towards the wealthy? If so, how could it be done?

I'm interested in your suggestions. Since it seems difficult to tax the wealth tied to investments, I thought it might be possible to tax their property at a high rate. A very high rate of taxation on property like mansions when their total amount of property equals more than 20 million or something like that. I think it would be harder for them to shield property from taxation than wealth tied up in stock. It would also have the added benefit of discouraging them from buying up all available property. There is probably some reason this would be difficult though. What kind of ideas do you have?

I may get back to the rest of your post later but re: the bold text for now, how are those two not exactly the same? Wealth redistribution isn't about handouts. It's about making sure the roads in the poor areas are in just as good a shape as in the richer areas, for example. Ditto water quality, schools, etc.

 

[mixmastermo]

Corporations get all kinds of tax breaks. The problem with trying to tax them though is they pass it back to consumers. If you tax Exxon they will surely raise gas prices since gas is a necessity.

Look at the actual list. Direct competitors like ExxonMobil and chevron and Ford and GM have similar incomes but pay very different effective tax rates. At&t and Verizon are also in the same ballpark yet at&t pays negative taxes.

Something is wrong with that system.

 

[Strychnine]

Go back to the F.D.R. era tax rates on the rich and end the tax on Social Security that Reagan enabled.

 

[mixmastermo]

Go back to the F.D.R. era tax rates on the rich and end the tax on Social Security that Reagan enabled.

Overturn the Citizens United decision while we are at it

 

[Kassitus]

Generally speaking taxation isn't rocket science. As long as you are somewhere within the range of normal its fine. The economic pressure on low income people is mainly caused by factors that will put a dent in any economy, such as scarcity of resources and corruption.

 

[nostradumbass]

Not really sure how much more it can be shifted. The US already has the most progressive tax system in the world. The top tax rate kicks in way higher here than other countries, and the rates on middle and lower incomes are also lower than other countries. The top 20% of income earners pay 100% of the taxes after transfers. I think a lot of middle and lower middle income earners would be pretty bummed if we adopted the tax system of other countries.

The good/bad news is that spending hasn't been tied to tax revenue in a really long time anyway.

 

[terrapin]

as a christian I think there is every good reason to tax the rich more and no good reason not too. starting with the danger posed to their souls being rich while others starve or die because of a lack of medical care and food and water and shelter. you have to intentionally shrink the part of your brain responsible for compassion in order to not suffer guilt for being wealthy. you have to intentionally adopt and compromise what you really think naturally in order to justify it. you have to end up supporting an unjust system and pretending it is not unjust and that makes you into a liar and a hypocrite.

if we would just ensure a few basic elements of human dignity like guaranteed health and psychological care for everyone, free college/trade schools for the poor, and a livable minimum wage then the wealthy could still be wealthy and truly enjoy that wealth and deserve to enjoy it. as it is though? there is every reason for them so have a nagging guilty conscience.

it is in everyones best interest that the rich are taxed more heavily and that includes corporations etc.

 

[emefer]

Tax capital gains as ordinary income

Why is my labor taxed more than money made through capital gains? Shit should be the other way around.
It’s a war against the worker

 

[emefer]

Corporations get all kinds of tax breaks. The problem with trying to tax them though is they pass it back to consumers. If you tax Exxon they will surely raise gas prices since gas is a necessity.

Nationalize the fossil fuel industry.

 

[Nizam al-Mulk]

Rand Paul had a bill that wanted to go all 19th century on taxes.

 

[terrapin]

Nationalize the fossil fuel industry.

all mining ought to be nationalized in fact. and NO Profits for the people until ever single measure that can be taken to NOT off gas pollution to local communities is taken.