Is a China vs US (and other allied nations) war a possibility?

I would file it under anythings possible.
 
Yes. Why wouldn't it be? Wars have occurred for smaller reasons than why our two nations might duke it out. Anything is possible and laugh at those who say it isnt.
 
Notice how china is not investing hundreds of billions of dollars into creating a nuclear stockpile on par with the US?

Brings up some interesting questions on China's long term strategy, and what technologies China believes are going to be dominate in the coming century.
 
Oedad said:
Notice how china is not investing hundreds of billions of dollars into creating a nuclear stockpile on par with the US?

Brings up some interesting questions on China's long term strategy, and what technologies China believes are going to be dominate in the coming century.
Click to expand...

Who's to say what China's nuclear capabilities are? Not as big as the US, but in a war it would be a total mess because the US is an open society with millions of Chinese, many of which will be connected to the Chinese government and can operate freely. The US also has many in the Oligarchy who aren't loyal to its interests, and the US is not homogeneous and ethnic conflict can be fomented internally. So really, the US could be torn apart from the inside.
 
IDL said:
Who's to say what China's nuclear capabilities are? Not as big as the US, but in a war it would be a total mess because the US is an open society with millions of Chinese, many of which will be connected to the Chinese government and can operate freely. The US also has many in the Oligarchy who aren't loyal to its interests, and the US is not homogeneous and ethnic conflict can be fomented internally. So really, the US could be torn apart from the inside.
Click to expand...

Its not hard to estimate how many physical ICBM's the Chinese have. (its a good bit less than 100 while the US has 450)

We know the Chinese have no hope of ever launching a bomber based attack on the continental US.

And we know what kind of submarines the Chinese have, and we know those submarines are very much so inferior to their US and Russian counterparts in both detect-ability, and in their much less robust launch capabilities.

Also we can estimate how many warheads they can maintain based on the amount of rare materials they produce and import that are used in the construction of these devices.

Its just not "as big as the US" their whole nuclear philosophy is different they don't even store their warheads with their launch systems.

China clearly does not believe they are in danger of engaging in a massive nuclear conflict with Russia or the US.

I'm not saying the Chinese don't have a plan to strike at the US i'm just saying it doesn't involve launch 50 ICBMs when they know they would be hit back will 1000 + warheads from all three major launch systems.

I just think they know when push comes to shove we would willingly abandon most of our Pacific interests without a conflict and they will just naturally gain dominance in the region over time. They wouldn't push Japan or Australia too hard, but we are not going to war over the Philippines or Vietnam.
 
Too economically dependent on each other to be worried about a war right now
 
Oedad said:
Its not hard to estimate how many physical ICBM's the Chinese have. (its a good bit less than 100 while the US has 450)

We know the Chinese have no hope of ever launching a bomber based attack on the continental US.

And we know what kind of submarines the Chinese have, and we know those submarines are very much so inferior to their US and Russian counterparts in both detect-ability, and in their much less robust launch capabilities.

Also we can estimate how many warheads they can maintain based on the amount of rare materials they produce and import that are used in the construction of these devices.

Its just not "as big as the US" their whole nuclear philosophy is different they don't even store their warheads with their launch systems.

China clearly does not believe they are in danger of engaging in a massive nuclear conflict with Russia or the US.

I'm not saying the Chinese don't have a plan to strike at the US i'm just saying it doesn't involve launch 50 ICBMs when they know they would be hit back will 1000 + warheads from all three major launch systems.

I just think they know when push comes to shove we would willingly abandon most of our Pacific interests without a conflict and they will just naturally gain dominance in the region over time. They wouldn't push Japan or Australia too hard, but we are not going to war over the Philippines or Vietnam.
Click to expand...

I agree and it would be bad strategy to try to match the US head on any way you slice it. There are many other ways of waging war than direct blow for blow.
 
No. Confrontation like that is just not China's way, is say one with Ruskis is way more likely giver their issues.

Trying to bring the evil empire down through economic manipulation and buying out the emerging marlets is a much safer way to war then an actual war.
 
IDL said:
Who's to say what China's nuclear capabilities are? Not as big as the US, but in a war it would be a total mess because the US is an open society with millions of Chinese, many of which will be connected to the Chinese government and can operate freely. The US also has many in the Oligarchy who aren't loyal to its interests, and the US is not homogeneous and ethnic conflict can be fomented internally. So really, the US could be torn apart from the inside.
Click to expand...

All true. But I just have this feel that China will fall before the U.S. does. There is something special about America's power and how it developed it. The history alone is amazing.
 
I believe the West will go to war with China. China's leader has said on more than one occasion that China isn't interested in empire building, he's lying of course. They've been in Africa for a while now doing 'nice' things for the poor people, building good will, and at some time they will want payment. I imagine they'll want military bases on that continent.

Of course they want an empire, thats what a world power does! They have wealth they couldn't of dreamt of not that long ago and they're building up their military. They are only doing so because of the rapidly crumbling West, who else are they gonna go to war with?
They have something to prove and they've been waiting a very long time, the West are war-weary and too trusting imo.
Also i wouldn't be surprized if a number of Western countries abandon America and go to the other side.
I see on the tv that America's military equipment has aged quite a bit and lots of cash is needed to bring it up to date, and that will take time.

I know this isn't about China but it's kind of connected.
I saw an interview with American naval personel recently who spoke about a Russian plane swooping back and forth over his ship about a dozen or so times. At some point everything on board went dead. They were defenceless and they couldn't even steer the boat.
The plane then went away and everything came online again. He is worried that the Russians have more than capable EMP weapons.
Apparently the Russians and the Chinese are well aware of the amount of relience America's weapons have on old computer systems, it's a very high percentage.
China set about changing their systems to a new one they came up with themselves

China have sent one or two satellites up into space and not informed America first, which they normally do. When they were asked about what type of satellites they were, the answers they gave didn't match what the Americans could see.
A NASA person mentioned they could quite easily be military satellites up there to destroy other countries satellites if needed, they just don't know. If the Chinese can do such a thing they would, i'm sure.

In the West i know Britain keeps downscaling their military so i expect some other European countries are doing the same.
 
IDL said:
Who's to say what China's nuclear capabilities are? Not as big as the US, but in a war it would be a total mess because the US is an open society with millions of Chinese, many of which will be connected to the Chinese government and can operate freely. The US also has many in the Oligarchy who aren't loyal to its interests, and the US is not homogeneous and ethnic conflict can be fomented internally. So really, the US could be torn apart from the inside.
Click to expand...

i say this to these Americans who are Russia paranoid in here that because these reasons China is a much bigger threat it also work on that cloning and bio weapons. US would be fucked against them unless the US got some secret powerful shit. Russia is not a western threat it just want it old soviet sphere it does not have the population or stuff china has going for it. Russia has the resources and wealth but not the population and unity and economic power china has.

but yeah for I think even in that scenario US would beat china but it would likely that US have key cities hit with some bio weapons and possible low powered nukes china has. But US missile defense is probably good enough to defeat chinese missiles and US has bases and weapons close to china shore that it can launch and destroy there military and command infastructruer. I predict just like in last two world war's Russia will not be against the west and will side with you all or sit out.
 
Oedad said:
We know the Chinese have no hope of ever launching a bomber based attack on the continental US.
Click to expand...

dem badgers though

h6.jpg
 
highly unlikely, we are too close economically. that is how superpowers confront each other.
 
Highly, highly unlikely for a lot of reasons. Economic interdependence is the best reason, followed closely by the fact that Chinese military testing has suggested that it would take them over a month to complete the activities that should be done within the first 72 hours as part of a force mobilization. They also aren't a battle-hardened military, so much of the institutional knowledge about how to fight and win wars is long gone. They'd be going against a military that has been fighting for almost 20 years with "Well, this is what we think will work against the Americans. Let's see!" Because that's how battles are lost.
 
Oedad said:
Its not hard to estimate how many physical ICBM's the Chinese have. (its a good bit less than 100 while the US has 450)

We know the Chinese have no hope of ever launching a bomber based attack on the continental US.

And we know what kind of submarines the Chinese have, and we know those submarines are very much so inferior to their US and Russian counterparts in both detect-ability, and in their much less robust launch capabilities.

Also we can estimate how many warheads they can maintain based on the amount of rare materials they produce and import that are used in the construction of these devices.

Its just not "as big as the US" their whole nuclear philosophy is different they don't even store their warheads with their launch systems.

China clearly does not believe they are in danger of engaging in a massive nuclear conflict with Russia or the US.

I'm not saying the Chinese don't have a plan to strike at the US i'm just saying it doesn't involve launch 50 ICBMs when they know they would be hit back will 1000 + warheads from all three major launch systems.

I just think they know when push comes to shove we would willingly abandon most of our Pacific interests without a conflict and they will just naturally gain dominance in the region over time. They wouldn't push Japan or Australia too hard, but we are not going to war over the Philippines or Vietnam.
Click to expand...

The US has thousands of nuclear capable and possibly armed Sea launched balistic missiles in there submarines and many like hundreds of nuclear armed cruise missiles that they 'admit' to. The thing is US has advantage of being able to use whatever hidden weapons they have and launch missiles from south korea, japan, guam, and the ocean against China. They can unload and destroy chinese military bases, infastrcture etc. I think US could take China in a nuclear war the chinese to public knowledge not have the or as many nukes and old tech that the Russians have from Soviet era. The USSR was not far behind US technology the US only recently has gotten new things. Weapons from 1980's soviet era can still be relevant today as US is still doing same. They could launch nuke armed cruise missiles from various ships or submarines and also launch ICBM from submarines
 
I would say a possibility but extremely unlikely. Generally the big players realize trying to get too much of the big pie from other players is counter productive. Mutually assured disaster.

I think essentially Orwell was prescient with his category of three powers. He had Oceania, Eurasia, Eastasia.

I kind of see it that way to, North American alliance (USA, Canada), European Alliance (EU type countries, maybe exluding the UK which may be in North American alliance) , and Russia/China alliance.

I suspect these will be the three clusters will be the powers for a very long time, and no major wars between them, just little proxy wars around in pockets.
 
Currently just in the currency war and trade war phase right now, but history has shown that usually an actual physical war usually follows soon after
 
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