If you considered a MMA’s career in its entirety, Fedor and Silva cannot be in contention for GOAT

[HHJ]

I know im crazy for saying this but I believe Anderson never really wanted to win the fights he lost.

No one wants to lose fights and especially dont want to get knocked out. That showboating was a deception for his waning speed and cardio as he aged.

 

[CombatCyborg]

Show me footage of Fedor attempting a takedown post-Pride. I'd be shocked if there's even 2 minutes of footage of him fighting in the clinch and ground.

 

[BFoe]

Show me footage of Fedor attempting a takedown post-Pride. I'd be shocked if there's even 2 minutes of footage of him fighting in the clinch and ground.

He definitely grappled far less, but it did occur. He took down Rogers, Jaideep, and Mir. Fought on the ground with them, plus Sylvia (just choked Tim out quick), Werdum of course, Bigfoot (Im referring to when Fedor had top position on Bigfoot, not the other way around), Monson, and Chael.
He fought in the clinch with Arlovski, Rogers, Hendo, Maldonado (he used a Thai clinch and landed knees on a Maldonado), and very briefly with Tim Johnson.

 

[loisestrad]

Look, Fedor is my favorite fighter of all times, alongside Jones.

But I'm not blind to the fact that people oftentimes fail to recognize Fedor's weaknesses, and oftenimes very conveniently consider him out of his prime when he started losing.

Saying stuff such as "Fedor in his prime would beat anyone!" is just silly, if we're being objective. And not only cuz it's as hypothetical as the concept of GOAT or P4P.

It's an objective truth though, that no fighter has been considered the absolute best for a longer period than Fedor.

 

[No Skill Gap]

Damn, I feel like I haven’t seen you around in forever! Hope all is well.

Oh I'm good man, wish you the same

To be honest, just more of an adult now. Working 10 hours a day. I kind of lost a lot of interest in MMA and it doesn't help they put these events on at 10pm start EST when I'm on the east coast. Just busy, not worth losing sleep/time to watch most of these watered down ass cards

 

[Myrddin Wild]

Dear TS,

Fighting after your prime & losing, does ABSOLUTELY ZERO to erase the amount of top quality wins a fighter had in his prime.

The one most important variable in any GOAT discussion is: How many wins against top quality contenders did teh GOAT get. Add those oop as you see fit for everyone, & see who comes out on top. Fedor is right oop there with GSP, Aldo, Spider, Jones & the much over-looked Randy Couture... by my count. However, Fedor waz winning world Sambo championships during his reign in MMA & I think that breaks any tie. Fedor'z teh GOAT.

 

[HavokHarmon]

Tell me why Silva losing like 6 fights in a row didn’t tarnish his legacy? The reason is that he’s old so those losses don’t count?

Only fights that happened before he turned old counts toward his record?

You have to ignore many years of Silva’s career to consider him GOAT. Same with Fedor.

Because a legacy is established, it doesn’t go away later.

 

[ThaiSexPills]

This is just plain wrong and I can’t wrap my head around why you’d dismiss a career of greatness because they stuck around too long.

if Anderson and fedor aren’t somewhere on your top 5, I cannot take you seriously

 

[swarrrm]

Fedor isn't included because he lost a bunch of fights at the end of his career. Jones on the other hand, with his multiple PED failures, eyepokes, and retiring when there's a tough contender then un-retiring when there's a favorable match-up. That's your goat.

 

[Dr Guildo]

Fedor IS the goat. What are you trying? Khabib is goat? McGregor?

 

[cburm]

People who hold Silva and Fedor in high esteem only looks at the pinnacle of their careers and not in its entirety.

I think a career has to be judged on its whole, and staying around too long and how brutal of a downfall you have absolutely affects your standings.

Fedor got sonned bt Henderson and big foot Silva, despite this not being “prime” Fedor, he got beat and beat badly by them. His run in Bellator wasn’t great either.

You cannot pretend the later part of his career didn’t happen just because he was older or out of his prime.

The same with Anderson Silva, his post leg break after losing to Weidman, he lost to far too many mediocre fighters that tarnished his career.

GSP and Jones are in a different league because they had a long peak and never stuck around long enough for a horrible ending. Their records are far superior.

Khabib didn’t stick around long enough, and Fedor and Silva stuck around too long allowing a lot of journeyman fighters to beat them.

Do you agree? Do you have to evaluate a career in its whole, or do you only look at them at the peak in their careers?

For those that disagree, let me ask you, can you not tarnished your legacy by losing just because you are out of your prime?

Fedor never got sonned just because a guy loses doesn't mean he got dog walked.. look at gsp bisping... And Fedor was handling hendo it looked like he kod hendo and hando shocked everyone when he came back to life and got the finish.. bisping dog walked gsp for 5 rounds.. and got sparked in the end...

What actually makes them goats is there consecutive title defence records... That's what makes goats and it's the only thing that counts... Fedor and Silva have more title defences in the UFC alone then alot of guys favorites today have even competed... Khabib getting 3 title wins and retiring after 14 or 13 UFC fights doesn't trump over bj Penn who has 4 defences already and a far more accomplished career neither does islam getting 4 defences and moving up to a. Different division... To be lw goat you need to get 5 defences ... A tie is just a tie... And Penn did it first.

 

[JoeBobbaLou2]

further proof that mma fans are some of the least informed

 

[cburm]

The problem is next gen kids who have no respect for what anyone has accomplished a hype job can show up and win 3 fights and he's you're next goat of all time best to ever do it.... Get 3 defences and disappear... Or fight once or twice a year and itle be justified. Silva and Fedor going undefeated for 6 and 9 years as champions fighting 3 times a year... Should be enough for you to just stfu...

 

[Richard Fannin]

. bisping dog walked gsp for 5 rounds.. and got sparked in the end...

GSP easily won the first round, outstriking Bisping with shocking ease, wobbling him and even taking him down toward the end, then the second round was more even, and Bisping got taken down 30 second in the 3rd, brutally knocked down and submitted.

You're probably thinking of the Bisping vs Anderoid fight, that was the one in which the Count dogwalked his heavier opponent for 5 rounds, except for that cheap shot while Herb Dean was talking to Bisping trying to give him his mouthguard while the round was ending (and Silvaseline couldn't even put him away lol).

Oops, wrong gif sorry

Dang it, just give me a sec


That's the one, shamefur dispray

 

[HavokHarmon]

GSP easily won the first round, outstriking Bisping with shocking ease, wobbling him and even taking him down toward the end, then the second round was more even, and Bisping got taken down 30 second in the 3rd, brutally knocked down and submitted.

You're probably thinking of the Bisping vs Anderoid fight, that was the one in which the Count dogwalked his heavier opponent for 5 rounds, except for that cheap shot while Herb Dean was talking to Bisping trying to give him his mouthguard while the round was ending (and Silvaseline couldn't even put him away lol).

Oops, wrong gif sorry

Dang it, just give me a sec


That's the one, shamefur dispray

This gif literally shows that herb wasnt trying to give Bisping his mouthpiece back; rather Bisping was trying to get herb to give him his mouthpiece and herb was telling him not yet. Just because you decide to stop and talk to the ref during a round doesn’t mean your opponent can’t hit you

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

People who hold Silva and Fedor in high esteem only looks at the pinnacle of their careers and not in its entirety.

I think a career has to be judged on its whole, and staying around too long and how brutal of a downfall you have absolutely affects your standings.

Fedor got sonned bt Henderson and big foot Silva, despite this not being “prime” Fedor, he got beat and beat badly by them. His run in Bellator wasn’t great either.

You cannot pretend the later part of his career didn’t happen just because he was older or out of his prime.

The same with Anderson Silva, his post leg break after losing to Weidman, he lost to far too many mediocre fighters that tarnished his career.

GSP and Jones are in a different league because they had a long peak and never stuck around long enough for a horrible ending. Their records are far superior.

Khabib didn’t stick around long enough, and Fedor and Silva stuck around too long allowing a lot of journeyman fighters to beat them.

Do you agree? Do you have to evaluate a career in its whole, or do you only look at them at the peak in their careers?

For those that disagree, let me ask you, can you not tarnished your legacy by losing just because you are out of your prime?

Wait what. I think I’m the only one who read your whole post here.
You gave all sides and gave a devil’s advocate for each.

What is your opinion exactly on the matter?

Is this just a matter of numbers on paper?
Cause that’ll just be an endless rabbit hole.

- silva had longest title reign
- but jones has more title defenses
- but jones was the youngest fighter to ever given a chance for a title fight (23)
- yeah, and he never fought past 38 and he rested long time in his multiple suspensions much like GSP’s long retirement before bisping (32)
- most ufc wins? Jim Miller is GOAT

Endless subjective opinions based on numbers.


Does Tyson’s loss to jake paul tarnish his legacy at age 60? (Assuming that shit was real) since it’s now listed as an official pro match.

 

[Aegon Spengler]

Michael Jordan’s career should be judged by his time on the wizards

 

[cws80us]

A lot of guys hang on too long, but they shouldn't be penalized for how they finish their careers. You have to look at the entirety of their career. The Jordan analogy was already given. He played a couple mediocre seasons for the Wizards, but that in no way takes away from what he did with the Bulls. Same for Silva and Fedor.

 

[Ghostoftheville]

Fedor's legacy still holds up pretty well. Besides the loss to Mitrione, nothing else is truly bad. Bader was a top contender for years. Henderson was a top fighter for over a decade that already had a win over Fedor's biggest rival. Bigfoot Silva was a top heavyweight before and after that fight, it just legitimized him.

Anderson on the other hand is more of a question mark for me. multiple losses throughout his career despite the massive run in the UFC. Obviously a great, but I don't see how GSP can be criticized for his two avenged loses and winning a questionable decision or Jones for winning questionable decisions but Silva seems to get a bigger pass for losses to Azeredo, Chonan and Takase.