I can't finish the D'arce Choke

[tbonejackson]

I have gotten what I think is the proper positioning several times with this move but I can't seem to finish it. I have tried both rotation my body towards my opponents head as well as rotating my body towards their feet. I try to get it in as deep as I can and apply the pressure properly by lifting my elbow and pushing my shoulder down at the same time. I try to make sure that the blade of my forearm is going into their throat as well. I have tried sprawling out and I have tried not sprawling out.I just can't seem to get it. I have referred to the following videos as well as Eddie Bravo's books:

YouTube - Side Control - Knee On Stomach Darce Choke

YouTube - Jason "Mayhem" Miller - "Canadian Darce Choke"

YouTube - D'arce Choke

YouTube - Aoki - Spinning Choke Pt. #1

I realize this might be a lot to ask from a forum post, but any advice anyone can give would be greatly appreciated.

Tbone

 

[LordarshynBJJ]

honestly I didn't watch your videos..

but a big problem I had for a while, and it helped add a TON of pressure, when you sprawl out, put your groin tot he ground and arch your back a bit.

If you're doing it from the position I have in my head that will help add a lot of pressure.

Though I may be thinking of the wrong choke, so i'll check those videos in a minute, lol.

edit:

Now that I watched them, he is doing what I was talking about in that canadian one.

 

[tbonejackson]

honestly I didn't watch your videos..

but a big problem I had for a while, and it helped add a TON of pressure, when you sprawl out, put your groin tot he ground and arch your back a bit.

If you're doing it from the position I have in my head that will help add a lot of pressure.

Though I may be thinking of the wrong choke, so i'll check those videos in a minute, lol.

I think you are thinking of the correct choke. I reviewed the technique a little more. Is it possible to stick your arm too far through on the person? I have a feeling that is what I may be doing.

Tbone

 

[EndoG]

This was just discussed recently.
See the bottom of the 1st page here:

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f12/bjj-experts-darce-brabo-related-782816/

for some great advice, with additional discussion on the following pages.


Below, Drew Foster's recommendation (I've been having the same problem):

Most people when they get the choke, sueeze down and in, like how you choke a RNC. If you have a right-handed darce, so your right arm is around the neck and grabbing the left crook of the bicep, make sure your right forearm is biting into their left carotid artery. Their left shoulder will be in the other side of their carotid (you obviously know this much.

Try dropping your left shoulder and raising your right shoulder while dropping your hips down. This will raise your right forearm into their artery and cause a choke rather than apressure crank, which rarely gets a tap.

YouTube - ***BONUS***

Skip to 2:18.

That saved my Darce/Brabo. Best advice I ever got on it.

 

[LordarshynBJJ]

I think you are thinking of the correct choke. I reviewed the technique a little more. Is it possible to stick your arm too far through on the person? I have a feeling that is what I may be doing.

Tbone

From the canadian one:

he seems to have his arm in pretty deep. Deeper than I usually go. I usually grab my bicep with my hand, he has his wrist on his bicep..usually the deeper the better, as long as you're hitting that artery.

Notice how when he sprawls his groin is on the ground...it doesn't seem like much but (for me atleast) that detail is a huge part of the choke.

 

[Mohawk79]

Does anyone know what Jason's belt ranking is? Or does he just do mostly practice no-gi?

 

[green_machine]

This was just discussed recently.
See the bottom of the 1st page here:

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f12/bjj-experts-darce-brabo-related-782816/

for some great advice, with additional discussion on the following pages.


Below, Drew Foster's recommendation (I've been having the same problem):

Good find. I only end up finishing the brabo about 50% of the time when I do get it locked in. I eventually started to rotate my body and walk toward my opponent's feet, which helped alot. Looks like it's tightening it up the same manner as the tip in Drew's recommended video.

 

[monkey roll]

i do it how miller does it. I'm going to try the ryan hall style finish.

 

[IChinaManI]

I think you are thinking of the correct choke. I reviewed the technique a little more. Is it possible to stick your arm too far through on the person? I have a feeling that is what I may be doing.

Tbone

you basically want your forearm parallel with the side of his neck/throat.

 

[Czyivn]

Here's the realization that enabled me to start finishing that choke a very high percentage of the time: It's a guillotine choke with a funny grip.

The key pressures to finishing it are:

1. Arm tight under his chin.

2. Bending his head over your arm.

Lifting your elbow and all that is nice, as it keeps your arm tight under his chin, but it isn't what finishes the choke. You finish the choke by bending his neck around your choking arm. The way I do that is by crunching his head in with my non-choking arm. I also walk my legs towards him until I can essentially get guard, like you would if you had a guillotine choke in that exact position. If you can wrap your top leg over the top of him and arch your back like with a guillotine, he's gonna tap, almost no matter what you do with your arms. That works from any position. Just walk your legs towards him, trying to get guard if you can.

The way that most of those videos are showing is a different pressure to finish, which also works if you do it right. For me, though, those methods haven't worked all that well, as I'm very skinny and light, and don't feel that I can get the appropriate squeezing pressure to get the finish. Finishing like a guillotine, though, works VERY well for me even against much larger and stronger opponents.

 

[beeble]

always remember when attempting the darce, as you put your arm under the neck and towards the shoulder,push the arm across and grip the shoulder as you position to make it as tight as possible... also people with shorter arms like me, make it a lot harder to finish

 

[Drew Foster]

glad you guys liked the clip. It's my favorite move because they follow proper BJJ laws if they're stuck in sidemount, halfguard, etc. and still get caught in the choke! Here's a clip of the exact Darce setup that Drysdale used to beat Marcelo Garcia in ADCC 2007 to win the Absolute Division.


YouTube - Robert Drysdale Nth Dimension Jiu-Jitsu Nth Dimension Chokes

YouTube - ADCC 2007 part 2
Skip to 9:02 and you will see Drysdale use the above clips' setup to beat Marcelo for the ADCC championship with the Darce/Brabo choke!


Darce/Brabo (the forum member) really gave me a lot of good tips on it. Hr has some good info on the choke as well. Here:

To quote him:

"Surprised it took me this long to notice this thread. I find actually that the way Ryan describes it, cranks, more than chokes. In order to REALLY get a solid choke from the Darce (mind you, this is all of my non-adcc experience, lol), you have to understand 3 key pressures, and where they are coming from:

This example is assuming you have a right handed Darce

1st Pressure - Your forearm into their right Carotid Artery
2nd Pressure - Your chest driving their shoulder into their left Carotid Artery
3rd Pressure - You pulling their head into their chest with your left elbow (RNC Grip)

I found by doing it that way, the right should naturally raises on its own.

Finishing the Darce

As for finishing it, im not too found of sprawling my legs out, because you get some of those wormy, rubbery, lower back flexibility types, they will always somehow manage to re-guard, and start hitting Darce counters. The two ways that I've found that work really well to prevent that are by either:

A) Keeping your right foot (instep) flat to the mat, and using your knee to block his hips
B) Completely stepping your right leg over his torso, then applying the 3 pressures (this sucks balls, and can be a horrible crank if they try to resist)

Some really good sources for Darce study:

Bjorn Friedrich - Position Brabo
Soca - No Gi DVD
Subfighter.com membership
Shinya Aoki - Vol. 1+2
Robert Drysdale - Nth Dimension Jiu Jitsu

Hope that helps..."

 

[txfighter13]

That is a tough on to get. keep trying. the advice given above is good.