How good really was Rickson Gracie in MMA?

[chamcham]

Rickson choked Chuck Norris.
That makes him all-time GOAT.

 

[Bobby Fischer]

Thanks for your reply. However, I'm confused. First you said:

"Hickson kept denying in the 1990s that Rei Zulu was his toughest fight and that he was about to quit on his stool.
Then,a few years ago, in an interview, he finally acknowledged it."

I asked for a link to the interview and you replied:

Hickson Gracie Interview 1999s:
Brazilian O Lutador magazine:

Q: Is it true that in your first fight against Zulu, you wanted to give up but Helio said that if you gave up, you had to fight the whole family?

HICKSON: "What a load of bullshit!"

Which doesn't sound like Rickson acknowledging it.

Also, the video you posted is in Portuguese. Do you have the interview in English? If not it's okay. I'm just generally curious and would like to read/watch it.

I expected this to be easier to find. Now I know why it wasn't.

 

[gono btw]

Thanks for your reply. However, I'm confused. First you said:


I asked for a link to the interview and you replied:


Which doesn't sound like Rickson acknowledging it.

Also, the video you posted is in Portuguese. Do you have the interview in English? If not it's okay. I'm just generally curious and would like to read/watch it.

I expected this to be easier to find. Now I know why it wasn't.

That´s the point, mate. I gave you the written interview where he was kindah denyin´it, then the newer one where he finally acknowledged it.

In that recent interview, he´s sayin´ (1st sentence @ 0mn10s):

"I would say that it was by far the toughest fight of my career"

Then:

"When Zulu entered backstage, everybody from my [BJJ] crew looked at him, shocked & deeply preoccupied..."
"He was a real giant, like a SuperMan"

 

[TRYHARD 2001]

Just to be clear, the Rei Zulu discussed as Rickson's toughest fight was Casemiro Nascimento Martins.

https://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Casemiro-Nascimento-Martins-1234

Don't necessarily be fooled by the shoddy record; his fights with Rickson were in the early 80's and with one exception he didn't fight again till the mid-90's. Something to consider...

 

[Prelimtapper]

Saku would have beaten him

 

[gono btw]

Just to be clear, the Rei Zulu discussed as Rickson's toughest fight was Casemiro Nascimento Martins.

https://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Casemiro-Nascimento-Martins-1234

Don't necessarily be fooled by the shoddy record; his fights with Rickson were in the early 80's and with one exception he didn't fight again till the mid-90's. Something to consider...

ah...one cant expect a North American website to really know about the Brazilian Vale Tudo scene, tho...
He obviously didnt stop between 1984 & 1995... Anyway, that was way past his physical prime.

Fightin´was his life, he was literally in the ring several times per month (even week)... but he was from North Brazil, and the media would only care about the Rio de Janeiro/São Paulo scenes...

 

[pankrat]

Thanks for your reply. However, I'm confused. First you said:


I asked for a link to the interview and you replied:


Which doesn't sound like Rickson acknowledging it.

Also, the video you posted is in Portuguese. Do you have the interview in English? If not it's okay. I'm just generally curious and would like to read/watch it.

I expected this to be easier to find. Now I know why it wasn't.

That´s the point, mate. I gave you the written interview where he was kindah denyin´it, then the newer one where he finally acknowledged it.

In that recent interview, he´s sayin´ (1st sentence @ 0mn10s):

"I would say that it was by far the toughest fight of my career"

Then:

"When Zulu entered backstage, everybody from my [BJJ] crew looked at him, shocked & deeply preoccupied..."
"He was a real giant, like a SuperMan"

yea he basically admits he was willing to quit

Firstly he sais all his crew was worried about the size of Zulu, but Rickson prefered to not even look until the fight started lol

"he weighted at the time 98 kgs, I was in 74kgs.."
he says that Zulu was "realmente un cavalho" ("a real horse")

Then describes the first round, in which he made Zulu blood out of his mouth and lose a teeth but had to carry Zulu's weight on top for pretty much the whole round. When he goes back to his stool, he sais:

"Father, I won't take on this, Im very tired, I don't got enough on me to come back"
His father replied that Zulu was actually more tired than him and Rickson insisted:
""No, I cant resist, I can barely even get up, Im really bad"

At that point his brother Rolls took a cube full of cold water and throw it all over his head, and while he was still trying to recover his breath from it they threw him back inside the ring again.

Rei Zulu was indeed very tired, he says, and 3 minuts inside the round managed to take his back and finished the fight

 

[mirko>anyone]

You know a guy who would have a well researched opinion on this? @gono btw

That guy is delusional and inarticulate most the time. Bullitt68 or people that actually watched mma in the late 90s can give you an honest answer without the revisionist history.

 

[gono btw]

That guy is delusional and inarticulate most the time. Bullitt68 or people that actually watched mma in the late 90s can give you an honest answer without the revisionist history.

Spoiler

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...-with-royce-gracie-matt-hughes-quote.3959447/

Spoiler: tho...

 

[gono btw]

At that point his brother Royce took a cube full of cold water and throw it all over his head,

was actually his brother Holls, not Hoyce.

 

[pankrat]

was actually his brother Holls, not Hoyce.

Ah may be, both sound almost the same lol

 

[knight]

Paulo Filho on Rickson Gracie. Keep in mind that Filho was undefeated at the time of the interview.
https://www.google.nl/amp/s/www.mix...Ground/Paulo-Filho-comment-on-Rickson:1357595

“Bomb!! Paulo Filho, Brazilian Top Team’s undefeated MMA champion, is training with Rickson Gracie.

He confessed to GRACIEMAG.com to be astonished with the experience. Filho reveals that he has never seen anyone with the technical knowledge of the great Jiu-Jitsu myth. “I have trained with the toughest guys formed by Carlson Gracie. They were all great and I for sure don’t want to diminish anybody, but I have to say that no one ever did to me what Rickson Gracie has done during training these last days,” confesses last Pride Bushido star.”

 

[gono btw]

Ah may be, both sound almost the same lol

yeah, Hoyce was only 14 yrs old at the time, tho...

 

[lukeuidswords]

its a shame his best opponent was a smaller half blind Yuki Nakai
F. Shamrock, Bas, Sakuraba were all fights that the other guys wanted to happen but Rickson did not

 

[cyrusthevyrus]

Rickson choked Chuck Norris.
That makes him all-time GOAT.

we all know chuck wanted to make a demonstration . he is too good for hickson.

 

[Coconutwater]

I love Hickson Grace, he is several things:

1) Gifted amongst talented black belts.
2) Innovative, combined gynastica naturale with his Vale Tudo conditioning.
3) Employed yoga as part of his training program when it wasn’t popular.
4) Had exposure to the concepts of wrestling via Rolls and even competed in wrestling at a minor level.
5) Has an aggressive style of BJJ which Kron picked up.
6) Legitimately labeled as one of the top BJJ practitioners of all time when taking into consideration their era. He’s arguable TOP 5 ever. (Simply based on reputation)

But... as far as fighting, his Vale Tudo/MMA was lacking as he prepared for the available talent at the time, which wasn’t that deep. One need only look at his striking and more importantly, his antiquated takedowns to know he was very weak in those areas.

Even against his competition, he wasn’t a great grappler, he has trouble closing the distance against many people and rushes in with mummy-takedowns. He’s been slammed, HARD by Rigan and Ron Tripp. His judo basically sucks like many Brazilians who have “Black Belts” in Judo. They didn’t receive these belts from the more refined and stricter Japanese instructors.

The saving grace for Rickson is once he’s already on the ground, he’s pretty crafty and will push the pace.

The last year of his prime IMO was 1995.

MMA competition was already pretty versed at takedown defense and BJJ strategy to give him fits or beat him outright by 1996ish.