Head and Arm Guillotine

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Trickster***, May 28, 2008.

  1. Trickster***

    Trickster*** Banned Banned

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    Does anyone else have a hard time finishing the guillotine with the arm inside?

    If you are good at it, I'd like to hear whatever pointers you have....bc I'm being told what to do but I can't seem to get it.

    There was a really good series of instructionals for the guillotine choke on some website (broken down into like 4-5 lessons) but I had that website saved on my old computer (it was originally posted in a thread on this forum but I cant find it in the archives) so if anyone knows the website Im talking about that would be MINT!
     
  2. J Storm**

    J Storm** Banned Banned

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    get your full grip established before you fall back.

    don't just squeeze (well yea, u have to squeeze) but also bridge up onto your shoulders to really get that torque.
     
  3. SFinclined

    SFinclined Purple Belt

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    I get it all the time. I think alot of people have problems with the leg across the belly, it has to be stiff so the opponent does roll over, it's much harder for me to finish the head and arm guillotine in mount.
     
  4. Smash_BJJ

    Smash_BJJ White Belt

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    You have to do sort of a side crunch, it's not like a regular guillotine where you squeeze and arch.
     
  5. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Tips:

    You have to do a side crunch is most important part.

    Get out to the side more than you would in regular guillotine. It's almost a half-guard type finish.

    If you are having trouble, consider a ten-finger grip or peruvian necktie finish. Both will make the submission more aggressive.
     
  6. Trickster***

    Trickster*** Banned Banned

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    Ok here is what I was told but Im having trouble finishing it...

    Lets say for this example that my right hand is the one reaching under the his neck and my left is the one around his arm...

    Here is what I know:
    Dont try to reach your right wrist all the way around the other carotid artery, you actually use your right wrist to cut off the near carotid artery
    You use your shoulder to pinch his head down
    You squeeze his shoulder to his other carotid artery

    Is that right? Im frustrated bc I know what Im supposed to do but I cant quite finish it. Maybe I just have to work on the squeeze.
     
  7. TheGambler13

    TheGambler13 Green Belt

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    Your choking motion is not backwards its more to the side in order to pressure on the carotid arteries
     
  8. Sherdog_Mutt

    Sherdog_Mutt Purple Belt

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    <object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/YWP_DmfrKXI&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/YWP_DmfrKXI&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>
     
  9. Trickster***

    Trickster*** Banned Banned

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    ^^^ Isn't that more of a peruvian neck tie? That video helps but that won't work from more or a closed guard scenario. Ya know how Joe Stevenson can wrap up a head and arm guillotine from just about anywhere (full guard, half guard, sprawl etc) and he can get the tap? Thats what Im talking about

    Thank you though!
     
  10. SFinclined

    SFinclined Purple Belt

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    Isn't that a guillotine with an arm in? I do the head and arm guillotine like Marcelo teaches it, like i'm going for an anaconda but instead of grabbing my other arms bicep, I grab around the arm at the armpit and take his head and trapped arm together to the opposite side and throw a leg over their back and other leg across the belly.
     
  11. SFinclined

    SFinclined Purple Belt

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  12. Trickster***

    Trickster*** Banned Banned

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    Im watching the hand positioning and there seems to be a few different ways of putting your hands to finish the head and arm. Some seem like more of a neck crank, like the pressure from your neck being cranked down helps the choke.

    This sub is a total mystery to me lol - I absolutely suck at D'arce chokes, head and arm, anaconda's etc

    I appreciate all your help though
     
  13. Old_Fogey

    Old_Fogey Cornish Bumpkin

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    Standard guillotine - Elbow UP and pull.

    Arm-in guilotine - Elbow DOWN and pull.

    Basically.
     
  14. Mikey Triangles

    Mikey Triangles Bending Joints the Wrong Way Since 1985

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    that's a different submission.



    Trickster,

    The biggest detail for me was to PINCH the guys head and arm with your elbows against your body.

    In a traditional guillotine you try to get it tight over his head, but with the arm in it works best when your elbow is almost on his ear pinching his head into your body when you crank. That was the biggest detail for me, and after I got that down the move finally made sense to me. hope this helps.
     
  15. Sub Dude

    Sub Dude Blue Belt

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    Also, make sure you get your hips out to the side of the arm that you have trapped...if you're hitting it from the bottom (guard) you want to pull the legs towards you, rather than pushing away like a standard guillotine.
     
  16. ToughLove

    ToughLove Liver Kick

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    ^^^ Mikey know his stuff listen well
     

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