International Hamas launches surprise attack on Israel; Israel has declared a state of war. Vol. VII

[Anewt]

Hamas has already proven they will commit the most heinous war crimes there are. So I don’t really see how Israel could cause a further escalation.

Your response isn’t really a moral one either. You’re saying you think it might be a bad play. I disagree though. I don’t believe in this unlimited reserve of human resistance.

Oh no wasnt trying to use morals to make the claim.

Obviously wed all like em to be more moral. Itd mean it never got started if hamas was heh .

But if hamas had waged it under the standards set by genova they probably wouldnt have suffered such a delibating outcome. Probably recieving more global aid etc and far better outcomes for its people

I worry that the same will occur to israel. Its been one of my concdrns since day 1. That they may be creating enemies and fighters fadter than they are removing them.

Now this long into the conflict with the world making its opinions known and the us stance is known.. seems a far more risky track than it did a year ago personally. I think youre going to see a lot more international pressure back on israel very soon as the recent round of geopolotics heats up.

Morally? Israel is clearly the more powerful and its not particulary a war anymore. Restricting the civilian population from aid has had no bearing on hamas since the beginning. Hamas doesnt care. Never has.

To me its a bit revengey and collective punishment.. yet still understandable.


If morallity mattered none of this show would ever have occurrd.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

Umm. There were children and some really really old people killed and taken hostage

Innocents were definetely killed by hamas... theres literal footage of it.

Pretending they didnt get any innocents is like pretending israel hasnt killed any innocents. Just not based in reality

Prisoners of War are perfectly acceptable in a conflict. The Israeli's have been kidnapping children for decades now.


Please provide evidence of children and old people being killed.

 

[Blayt7hh]

I probably missed a few posts, can I get a TLDR. Are you saying that the US' justification of ignoring the Geneva Convection during Vietnam worked from a domestic support angle? Or that the gloves off approach actually worked in pacifying Vietnam.

Legally. I’m saying that the legal justification was established during Vietnam. Some of the war crimes we committed were justified because of the way the Vietcong fought the war. They weren’t fighting under Geneva, an FCC it was successfully argued that much of Genevas protections didn’t apply because of it.

 

[Blayt7hh]

Why on earth couldn't you arrest them?

Because they are armed and hiding among the populace. They’re a damned army. Bro, really. What are suggesting here?

 

[Anewt]

Prisoners of War are perfectly acceptable in a conflict. The Israeli's have been kidnapping children for decades now.


Please provide evidence of children and old people being killed.

Sigh...

i really dont wish to review attrocities again mate. Ive done the rabbit holes and seen and double checked claims morr than enough to not wish to rehash it..

Its really not hard to find.

Youre honestly delusional or have seen extremely selectove footage if you think no innocents were harmed

 

[avenue94]

Legally. I’m saying that the legal justification was established during Vietnam. Some of the war crimes we committed were justified because of the way the Vietcong fought the war. They weren’t fighting under Geneva, an FCC it was successfully argued that much of Genevas protections didn’t apply because of it.

Do you have a link or specific incident you're referring to? This all sounds rather vague.

 

[Brendon Katz]

In all seriousness, why do you think Israel should be held to Genevas standards? I’m not advocating for total war here nor am I defending this particular choice, but I think it’s a bit foolish if you tie your own hands. The enemy they’re fighting is literally using the laws of war as a shield, which they’re not intended to be used as. IMO, if one side isn’t abiding by the laws of war then the whole thing goes out the window

If one side’s breach of the laws of war results in civilian casualties caused by the other side, the side that breached the laws is the side that bears responsibility for those civilian casualties.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

Sigh...

i really dont wish to review attrocities again mate. Ive done the rabbit holes and seen and double checked claims morr than enough to not wish to rehash it..

Its really not hard to find.

Youre honestly delusional or have seen extremely selectove footage if you think no innocents were harmed

Sigh - you have no proof you mean, just "trust me bro" testimony.

Depends on your definition of "innocent" I guess.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

If one side’s breach of the laws of war results in civilian casualties caused by the other side, the side that breached the laws is the side that bears responsibility for those civilian casualties.

Which is exactly why Oct 7th was fully justified by International Law.

 

[Rholk]

Which is exactly why Oct 7th was fully justified by International Law.

Is this something you actualy believe to be true?

And i'm not talking about you cheering it on from a moral POV,
but that it would be okay according to international law?

 

[kflo]

Which is exactly why Oct 7th was fully justified by International Law.

lol.

 

[Anewt]

Sigh - you have no proof you mean, just "trust me bro" testimony.

Depends on your definition of "innocent" I guess.

Do a little research its not hard it all. Or use common sense and understand shooting into fleeing vehichles with assault rifles makes it literally impossible that they knew who they were shooting at or that no innocents were shot.

So yeah. Trust me. Or go view the footage. Or use common sense. Upto you honestly

 

[avenue94]

If one side’s breach of the laws of war results in civilian casualties caused by the other side, the side that breached the laws is the side that bears responsibility for those civilian casualties.

This not true. Proportionality is very important in these discussions and laws.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

Do a little research its not hard it all. Or use common sense and understand shooting into fleeing vehichles with assault rifles makes it literally impossible that they knew who they were shooting at or that no innocents were shot.

So yeah. Trust me. Or go view the footage. Or use common sense. Upto you honestly

Every citizen in Israel (with few exemptions) serves in the IDF which is a terrorist entity (formed from the proscribed terrorist groups Ergun, Lehi and Haganah) and they've contributed to the oppression and illegal occupation of Palestinians therefore making them combatants, not civilians.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

Is this something you actualy believe to be true?

And i'm not talking about you cheering it on from a moral POV,
but that it would be okay according to international law?

Yes....UNGA 37/43.

 

[kflo]

Every citizen in Israel (with few exemptions) serves in the IDF which is a terrorist entity (formed from the proscribed terrorist groups Ergun, Lehi and Haganah) and they've contributed to the oppression and illegal occupation of Palestinians therefore making them combatants, not civilians.

everyone justifies their actions and you're still stuck with gaza in ruins and no palestinian state. try a new playbook. i think your viewpoint is demented but in the end, it doesn't change the reality. and it's time to deal with reality.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

everyone justifies their actions and you're still stuck with gaza in ruins and no palestinian state. try a new playbook. i think your viewpoint is demented but in the end, it doesn't change the reality. and it's time to deal with reality.

Well the world has turned against the illegal settler colonial entity. A Palestinian state will be forthcoming. Gaza will be rebuilt.

The Israeli aura of invincibility will never return though and it's only a matter of time before the Arabs wake from their slumber and remove the trash from the region.

 

[kflo]

Well the world has turned against the illegal settler colonial entity. A Palestinian state will be forthcoming. Gaza will be rebuilt.

The Israeli aura of invincibility will never return though and it's only a matter of time before the Arabs wake from their slumber and remove the trash from the region.

lol. again, your true colors show.

it's hilarious when people look at the ME and single out israel (and we know what you really mean there) as the "trash".