Throwback GSP vs Nick Diaz

[MDoza]

He threatened with subs in almost every round against Hardy.

I saw it more as he couldn’t finish subs against Hardy. It exposed his poor BJJ skills.

He had two fully locked in submissions in that fight and lacked the technique to actually finish them.

He had to ask his coach in the back after the fight how to do the submissions properly.

 

[italiamusica]

The fight where GSP refused drug testing and poisoned Nick Diaz

Classic.

Wasn't this the fight where GSP technically missed weight by 1⁄3 of a pound or something, but they allowed it to go on anyway?

 

[Bullitt68]

No doubt Nick was bad matchup fo George but still beat him.

Yeah, a clean sweep after a 25-minute drubbing, what a "bad matchup" for GSP

lets face it he is a tiny WW

He wasn't a tiny WW. He fought at MW.

guys today would be way too much for him.

I saw it more as he couldn’t finish subs against Hardy. It exposed his poor BJJ skills.

Not being able to get a tough guy who refuses to submit to tap to joint locks isn't evidence of "poor BJJ skills." In the first round, Hardy's thumb escape was a last-ditch effort but a well-executed last-ditch effort. GSP should've hugged the wrist to his chest instead of pulling it down with his hands, but still a near finish. And he did everything a person could've done with that kimura late in the fight, Hardy just refused to tap. Ken Shamrock fucked up Don Frye's legs so bad he was purple and howling in agony with icebags on his ankles in the locker room after and ended up getting addicted to painkillers...but he refused to tap and he won their fight. Would you say that Ken lacked the skills to finish the subs?

 

[Preston broadus]

Enjoyed the bit of success Nick had on the feet in rd 4. Sent GSP right back to shooting TDs.

(EDIT: it was rd 3)

But with all the soccer mom yelling, toxic airplane water, poison IV, and crooked weigh in shenanigans, the deck was stacked against poor Nick.

Beat part of the fight.

Gsp's jab was quick.

Nick would have been one of the goats if he had td defense. His ability to take a shot in the face probably lead to him losing the fight as well. Gsp took a few shots from Nick and said fuck this and went back to wrestling.

If gsp fought Anderson Silva, im pretty sure he would have gotten knocked out. He hit Nick ALOT and didn't slow him down. The few punches Nick landed in the 3rd hurt him. If Anderson tagged him, he's going out before he hits the ground

 

[pick999]

Nick never should of got this fight

 

[chinarice]

No doubt Nick was bad matchup fo George but still beat him. I thought Bisping was going to beat him but Geroge won, he never seizes to impress but lets face it he is a tiny WW and guys today would be way too much for him.

The fact people still run with this narrative that GSP couldn't beat JDM, Belal or Leon Edwards is some of the most hilarious shit I'll read on Sherdog.

Prime GSP would 50-45 the current champ

 

[BFoe]

Nick never should of got this fight

It wasn’t that egregious. Nick had been booked to fight GSP already but that was scrapped due to GSP’s injury, and the interim fight he lost to Condit was a pretty controversial decision. The biggest problem with the fight was the year layoff between a Nick’s Condit and GSP fights due to NSAC stupidity.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

Nick caught GSP with like a minute left when GSP looked up at the clock. GSP let his guard down, Nick caught him, and then he followed up with a couple of shots one of which cut GSP's nose and one of which popped his mouthguard out. He had like 15 seconds of sunlight and then GSP took him down and that was that. And at no point was GSP wobbled. He swung wild on a hook and was out of position. Meanwhile, for the other four and a half minutes of that round, GSP was jabbing Nick like crazy, hitting him with inside and outside low kicks, front kicks to the body, and firing off head kicks.



You could say that the only success Nick had was a 15-second window with a few punches after catching GSP looking up at the clock and stopping a handful of TDs. Anything beyond that is embellishing Nick's "achievements" in that fight.

Regardless of whether GSP waz looking at teh clock, Nick's package or a fooking alien he saw hovering over teh octagon... he got clipped with the hardest punch of the fight & wobbled.

After you quoted me, I went ahead & watched teh whole round.... while keeping up with what I considered to be impactful strikes through the first 4 minutes, I came up with GSP ahead by 8... which included a handful of good leg kicks that didn't seem to slow Nick down.

I then watched the entire last minute in slow motion, & Diaz made up for 5 (out of an 8 deficit) with the back n forth, but it was mostly Diaz.

It's worth noting if you don't think GSP waz stunned, that is the most Diaz was able to rally the entire fight. That's extremely big evidence that GSP waz stunned. You saying he overswung made me rewind & rewatch that sequence (still in slow mo) several times, & I concluded that is not what happened.

Watching that innitial strike in slow mo... there's an uppercut the camera didn't see because the camera is looking at Diaz' back & teh strike happened on the other side, but you can clearly see GSP's head react to the heavy strike. Then if you want to say GSP looked at something... it doesn't matter, because that's when he got heavy heat right behind teh ear (TEH SWEET SPOT) with a big hook from Diaz. I'm 100% calling that wobbled. I'm also calling it the most significant strike of teh fight. If you want more evidence that GSP waz wobbled... Diaz was landing more than ever after that... it was profound how much he was catching teh stunned GSP... but eventually GSP began recovering enough to take it down.

At the point where GSP took him down the TOTAL impactful strikes I counted for each, left GSP still ahead by 3.

GSP then did fook all with his TD. I'm not counting those light body shots, but GSP got in 2 impactful strikes in teh whole sequence... & so here we have GSP ahead by 5 impactful strikes across the whole round.

WAY above & beyond GSP ending up with 5 more impactful strikes... there are 2 different criteria that Diaz met which are both of the highest calibur of scoring.

1. He Wobbled GSP
2. GSP waz bleeding all over Diaz

We could add popping teh mouthguard out too.

I initially called this tentatively for Diaz, but now that I've actually watched the fight with scoring in mind, including teh last minute in slow mo... I'm calling this definitely Diaz' round.

Those criteria I numbered are there for a very specific reason. It's proof of the highest level of impact which signal a potential end to the fight. Bleeding & wobbling both signal a potential end of a fight. We can go back n forth all day on who hit harder or whatever, but when someone starts to bleed, we know 100% for sure they got clocked hard & effectively. When someone gets wobbled, we know they got clocked even harder & more effectively than what could make someone bleed. These are the 2 highest of scoring criteria outside of an actual knock down for a very good reason.

R3 Diaz.


(teh other Diaz~ lol)
@BFoe

 

[MDoza]

Yeah, a clean sweep after a 25-minute drubbing, what a "bad matchup" for GSP



He wasn't a tiny WW. He fought at MW.

Not being able to get a tough guy who refuses to submit to tap to joint locks isn't evidence of "poor BJJ skills." In the first round, Hardy's thumb escape was a last-ditch effort but a well-executed last-ditch effort. GSP should've hugged the wrist to his chest instead of pulling it down with his hands, but still a near finish. And he did everything a person could've done with that kimura late in the fight, Hardy just refused to tap. Ken Shamrock fucked up Don Frye's legs so bad he was purple and howling in agony with icebags on his ankles in the locker room after and ended up getting addicted to painkillers...but he refused to tap and he won their fight. Would you say that Ken lacked the skills to finish the subs?

Wrong, GSP just didn’t know how to apply the leverage right for the Kimura. You can go watch the video of him asking what he was doing wrong. Danaher explains it to him. It was a poorly applied submission.

 

[MRT]

I saw it more as he couldn’t finish subs against Hardy. It exposed his poor BJJ skills.

He had two fully locked in submissions in that fight and lacked the technique to actually finish them.

He had to ask his coach in the back after the fight how to do the submissions properly.

Sure, but the question was not about GSP's BJJ skill level, it was whether GSP was boring and just laying on people. Generally speaking, sub attempts demonstrate an attempt to finish the fight.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

Sure, but the question was not about GSP's BJJ skill level, it was whether GSP was boring and just laying on people. Generally speaking, sub attempts demonstrate an attempt to finish the fight.

Agree - I'd add that when I compare this fight to Borz vs. DDP... we see GSP with a VERY ACTIVE top game... much more active than Borz. He wasn't just holding him down, he was moving & shifting position the whole time, even giving Diaz space to posture up only to be dragged back down. That space is something that Borz wasn't willing to do. (likely Borz doesn't yet have the cardio to work like that for 5 rounds)

The comparison between the 2 ground strategies is very profound, & clearly demonstrate that GSP wasnt just "holding people down." He was actively pursuing the finish. Nick was actually the one tying thingz up on the ground, & so GSP would scramble & reposition. For sure this fight could not be used as an example of GSP just "laying on someone." Not even close.

 

[don't ask]

Nick had a streak where he was one of the most exciting fighters to watch in MMA. His Strikeforce run has some of the most rewatchable fights in MMA.

 

[Bullitt68]

Regardless of whether GSP waz looking at teh clock, Nick's package or a fooking alien he saw hovering over teh octagon... he got clipped with the hardest punch of the fight & wobbled.

Okay, right off the bat this is silly because the straight right that GSP landed on Nick 20 seconds before this was INFINITELY harder than any of the pillow-fisted shots Nick threw at GSP.

After you quoted me, I went ahead & watched teh whole round [...] R3 Diaz.


(teh other Diaz~ lol)

If you honestly think that Nick should've won that round because of those 15 seconds of nothing, then I can't imagine anything fruitful coming of a conversation, so I'm just going to limit myself to saying that GSP wasn't wobbled from that glancing shot of Nick's. GSP was throwing a left hook while Nick was throwing a right, and Nick's shot hit GSP's shoulder and then his forearm pushed GSP's head as his momentum was already carrying him in that direction due to the hook he was throwing. Not wobbled and not even a hard (not even a clean) shot.

Wrong, GSP just didn’t know how to apply the leverage right for the Kimura. You can go watch the video of him asking what he was doing wrong. Danaher explains it to him. It was a poorly applied submission.

Don't make me do the work. Find and post the video and I'll be happy to watch it. But even if GSP had flawless technique, there still would've been the issue of Hardy refusing to tap. Sakuraba was twisting Gracie arms with kimuras left and right and they never tapped, and his kimuras weren't "poorly applied." At the end of the day, no matter what you're doing, if your opponent isn't going to tap, it really doesn't matter. That's why chokes are better when dealing with crazy tough guys: You can't tough your way out of unconsciousness

 

[Motivated BJ Penn]

Nick had a streak where he was one of the most exciting fighters to watch in MMA. His Strikeforce run has some of the most rewatchable fights in MMA.

His Strikeforce fights are what got me into mma. Just insane non stop boxing combos, the Daley, Cyborg, etc. fights were crazy.

Then in the UFC ppl learned they can just dance around him or wrestle him to a decision, but nobody could go toe to toe with Nick back then.

I wish he never came back vs Lawler rematch, now the new fans think hes a joke