GSP messed up

[Franklin U.]

the Hendo fight was more of a gift for Hendo than Bisping. after that fight Bisping would've fought someone legit if GSP didn't chum the water with his talks of wanting to fight Bisping.

once the GSP fight was a possibility Bisping did everything he could to stall the division. i fully admit that, but my point is the only reason he did it is because of GSP. he wanted a money fight before retiring and that was as good as it was gonna get.

This is all true but bottom line - ON MERIT- ......- DECLINING AT LEAST 3 TOP CONTENDERS - he turned the lights out on division. Again ( Dana even said it at the time.....and not happy about it) You cant make someone fight someone. That whole timeline is the epitome of that sad situation. This is supposed to be a sport? No ?
Dan Henderson is not even a reasonable option at that time . In the history of the UFC - OF ANY DIVISION, when was the #15 ranked fighter given a title shot ( and the 15 was a gift to at least have a number next to his name ).
Gsp was also someone that bisping thought he could genuinely beat ( besides the money). The whole period was a joke and the real talent of the 185 division was pissed on.

 

[oldschoolmmafan]

This is all true but bottom line - ON MERIT- ......- DECLINING AT LEAST 3 TOP CONTENDERS - he turned the lights out on division. Again ( Dana even said it at the time.....and not happy about it) You cant make someone fight someone. That whole timeline is the epitome of that sad situation. This is supposed to be a sport? No ?
Dan Henderson is not even a reasonable option at that time . In the history of the UFC - OF ANY DIVISION, when was the #15 ranked fighter given a title shot ( and the 15 was a gift to at least have a number next to his name ).
Gsp was also someone that bisping thought he could genuinely beat ( besides the money). The whole period was a joke and the real talent of the 185 division was pissed on.

Dana White is so full of shit, he might as well be the tail of the human centipede.

 

[Hypetrainofthemonth]

This is all true but bottom line - ON MERIT- ......- DECLINING AT LEAST 3 TOP CONTENDERS - he turned the lights out on division. Again ( Dana even said it at the time.....and not happy about it) You cant make someone fight someone. That whole timeline is the epitome of that sad situation. This is supposed to be a sport? No ?
Dan Henderson is not even a reasonable option at that time . In the history of the UFC - OF ANY DIVISION, when was the #15 ranked fighter given a title shot ( and the 15 was a gift to at least have a number next to his name ).
Gsp was also someone that bisping thought he could genuinely beat ( besides the money). The whole period was a joke and the real talent of the 185 division was pissed on.

Didn't Joe Soto fight TJ for the belt during his debut/2nd fight or something?

 

[Franklin U.]

Didn't Joe Soto fight TJ for the belt during his debut/2nd fight or something?

Yeah.... and probably still ranked in a weight class that was as thin as a piece of paper . They had to find a defense for TJ. Thank you for demonstrating the " black and white" difference.
We call this apples & oranges. When Luke dropped the ball , I wonder why the pingers havent posted the rankings at the time. They probably thank God that Franklin U doesnt - I dont have to . I know what took place and my version ( the factual truth) is what went down.

 

[Franklin U.]

“Never want to get it.”

lol. What are you gonna do? You’ve never won a pissing contest on here and always come across inferior when you try. Always getting the last reply doesn’t negate that. People give up because you’re too prideful to admit when you’re outgunned (often - like nearly every time you try a battle of semantics). This self adulation and heightened sense of self worth is hilariously misguided. That’s why nobody agrees with you and you routinely don’t get any likes for your pompous replies. “Calls it like I sees it”, but you have shit for brains and don’t know what you’re looking at 9/10 times.

See- 3 gsp fans who I already own and like swarthy - you got it backwards- . They want no part of me . The shit is priceless. Thunderstruck is the only guy I wont exchange any dialogue with cause it's not a fair fight. You wouldnt understand my moral compass which even extends here( so I really shouldnt egg him on - mea culpa ).
Pissing contests.... losing ???
Anytime friend....anytime .

 

[Richard Fannin]

GSP is the fucking goat. Sounds like he did pretty well for himself.

Yup.
Being a GSP nuthugger is sooooo god damn comfy

The only thing his haters can throw at us is his loss to Serra 15 years ago, which GSP proceeded to avenge in brutal fashion


Meanwhile, their boys Anderson & BJ Penn are neck to neck for the most losses in the row in the UFC, BJ got smashed by GSP twice (and their first bout wouldn't have been competitive without that brutal eyepoke from Penn), Silva got caught juicing, called out FW Conor McGregor, submitted verbally to a low kick, BJ Penn is a complete wreck getting smashed in street fight buy fat white guys, while Georges is living the good life as the consensus UFC GOAT

When he retired after winning his second belt, I knew GSP would forever live rent free in his haters head.
Georges knows he's too sick to defend the belt for a long time, so instead of holding the division hostage, he relinquishes the belt.
Had he kept it, the exact same haters would hate on him for "having poor character, showed by the fact that just wants to be champ and never fight, shameful display".


One day I shall convince Gono that GSP did have some great fights; watching his bouts against Sean Sherk, Matt Hughes 2&3, BJ Penn 2, Matt Serra 2, Michael Bisping, Carlos Condit, Jon Fitch and many others never fails to remind me why he's such a beloved figure of the sport.

(it's been years since I've watched the Mayhem fight, which was the very first GSP bout that I've watched live on TV, and I became an instant fan... should rewatch it to decide if it's worth including in his highlights; Mayhem's post fight phone call to his girlfriend while his broken noce has a bunch of gauze stuck in it, "I JUST GOT MY ASS WHOOPED"©)

WAR GSP
UFC GOAT FOREVER

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

The only diet that works with colitis is intermittent fasting. No way he can maintain a weight that would allow him to be competitive at MW with that kind of diet.

Actually its pretty easy to maintain weight while intermittent fasting (its more useful for fixing insulin resistance than weight loss). However, my main point is that if he was (as he claimed) fully recovered, to the extent that he could fight Khabib, then he was also healthy enough to fight at MW. He'd be a small MW, but then again Anderson's cage weight at MW reportedly was 192, and given that GSP was at Anderson's level of fighting (as I said, he along with Anderson, Jones and Fedor is one of the four GOATs) then it was doable, at least once to fulfill his promise.

My opinion of his not defending at MW changed dramatically when he started talking about a fight with Khabib. Not defending because of illness is being smart. But being healthy enough to fight a high paying fight against Khabib but not to fight a lower paying fight at MW is pretty cynical -- and it wouldn't have mattered at all except he promised to defend. His first fight after recovering from colitis should be at MW to fulfill that promise. Granted he hasn't fought since, but for him to talk of fighting Khabib next rather than at MW is pretty bad.

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

Yeah I think he was trying to be north of 200 though. At one point he was saying he needed to add something like 15 pounds lean mass at least to feel he could be comfortable at mw. He always said once he went up he was never going back down because he didn't like messing with his body that much so it always sounded like he planned to cut down like everyone else

That might well have been his plan. However, if the colitis was bad enough that even after full recovery (his statement) he wasn't healthy enough to fight at say 192 in the cage (what Anderson fought at in the cage) at least once (to fulfill his obligation), then it would have been bad enough to not allow him to fight Khabib as well. Its very odd to have a disease that can tell the difference between five or ten pounds.

Another possibility is that he was lying (or at least exaggerating) when he said he was fully recovered. In that scenario he would be aware that he was only at 90% -- basically not healthy enough to seriously beat either Khabib or a top MW, but the money for Khabib would be so big that he'd be willing to take that fight anyway. That's still dishonest (ie cheating the fans who'd pay to see a healthy GSP fight Khabib), but less so than promising to defend at MW but then declining to do so because he'd prefer a higher paying fight with Khabib.

 

[boss429]

By fighting Bisping and basically fucking up the division he has lost the chance to fight arguably the greatest MMA fighter of all time. Had he waited a bit longer fought Khabib, won. He could have blamed the weight cut for his vacating the belt and later moved up to middleweight for the third belt. Dana might have understood this. Georges didn't think this through.
View attachment 823830

Yeah, but the UFC is doing everything they can to try and get another belt around Conors waist they can strip him of for refusing to defend so did GSP really "fuck up" or does Dana just not like him ever since he called him out for stealing his belt and claiming he wouldn't be at the press conference because he had to e rushed to the hospital?

Also, you do realize GSP won and vacated the belt within months while Robert had a 30 something month Title reign that consisted of 1 fight.

So how exactly did GSP "fuck up the division" again?

 

[glavinator]

That might well have been his plan. However, if the colitis was bad enough that even after full recovery (his statement) he wasn't healthy enough to fight at say 192 in the cage (what Anderson fought at in the cage) at least once (to fulfill his obligation), then it would have been bad enough to not allow him to fight Khabib as well. Its very odd to have a disease that can tell the difference between five or ten pounds.

Another possibility is that he was lying (or at least exaggerating) when he said he was fully recovered. In that scenario he would be aware that he was only at 90% -- basically not healthy enough to seriously beat either Khabib or a top MW, but the money for Khabib would be so big that he'd be willing to take that fight anyway. That's still dishonest (ie cheating the fans who'd pay to see a healthy GSP fight Khabib), but less so than promising to defend at MW but then declining to do so because he'd prefer a higher paying fight with Khabib.

You have a source for Anderson in cage weight being 192? I thought it was stated he would cut down from 210 or 220. He's got a large and long frame, id be surprised if he only regained 7 ish pounds for his fights

Gsp walk around was 187 to 192, in phenomenal shape, nothing to cut but water. Idk if it was so much that his body could tell the difference in "5 or 10 lbs" as the extra stress on the guts of the amounts and types of food he had to eat to get to 205ish and still be in the same shape.

Some people gain weight easily others do not. I spent most of my life lifting heavy and eating wayyyy too much to try and get bigger. Eventually I had to give up cause fighting genetics was a losing battle. Id be eating 4k calories a day, stuffing myself, killing myself in the gym and making small gains at best. All while feeling like crap from too much food and too much work. Genetically, I'm a lean and in shape guy at 5'8 and 155lbs. For a short period I managed to get up to 165 but couldn't maintain it

Gsp ain't the type of fighter to compete in a compromised state if he doesn't have to, as we know, he's not your classic risk taker.

If he feels he can't be 100% and healthy at that weight I'm not surprised he opted to go back on his word. And He did fight once at whatever weight he was in the cage that night; He did what he had to to get through the bisping fight and came across theses problems during the camp then figured out what was going on as he got close to the fight. He said he didn't want to do it the second time

 

[glavinator]

That might well have been his plan. However, if the colitis was bad enough that even after full recovery (his statement) he wasn't healthy enough to fight at say 192 in the cage (what Anderson fought at in the cage) at least once (to fulfill his obligation), then it would have been bad enough to not allow him to fight Khabib as well. Its very odd to have a disease that can tell the difference between five or ten pounds.

Another possibility is that he was lying (or at least exaggerating) when he said he was fully recovered. In that scenario he would be aware that he was only at 90% -- basically not healthy enough to seriously beat either Khabib or a top MW, but the money for Khabib would be so big that he'd be willing to take that fight anyway. That's still dishonest (ie cheating the fans who'd pay to see a healthy GSP fight Khabib), but less so than promising to defend at MW but then declining to do so because he'd prefer a higher paying fight with Khabib.

I think the argument for khabib was that he could much easier cut the weight than add it. Firas said for years he would be far more likely to go to 155 than 185 as it would be the smartest choice for his body. He never had colitis issues while on the right diet apparently

 

[ThunderStruck]

You have a source for Anderson in cage weight being 192? I thought it was stated he would cut down from 210 or 220. He's got a large and long frame, id be surprised if he only regained 7 ish pounds for his fights

Gsp walk around was 187 to 192, in phenomenal shape, nothing to cut but water. Idk if it was so much that his body could tell the difference in "5 or 10 lbs" as the extra stress on the guts of the amounts and types of food he had to eat to get to 205ish and still be in the same shape.

Some people gain weight easily others do not. I spent most of my life lifting heavy and eating wayyyy too much to try and get bigger. Eventually I had to give up cause fighting genetics was a losing battle. Id be eating 4k calories a day, stuffing myself, killing myself in the gym and making small gains at best. All while feeling like crap from too much food and too much work. Genetically, I'm a lean and in shape guy at 5'8 and 155lbs. For a short period I managed to get up to 165 but couldn't maintain it

Gsp ain't the type of fighter to compete in a compromised state if he doesn't have to, as we know, he's not your classic risk taker.

If he feels he can't be 100% and healthy at that weight I'm not surprised he opted to go back on his word. And He did fight once at whatever weight he was in the cage that night; He did what he had to to get through the bisping fight and came across theses problems during the camp then figured out what was going on as he got close to the fight. He said he didn't want to do it the second time

The only source of AS cage weight is that he once weighed in at 192 pounds, which is no indication that he weighed 192 in the cage. He just overcut. He lost mass towards the end of his career, but not that much mass. He was a big MW.

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

The only source of AS cage weight is that he once weighed in at 192 pounds, which is no indication that he weighed 192 in the cage. He just overcut. He lost mass towards the end of his career, but not that much mass. He was a big MW.

I was thinking of an interview he gave sometime in his first couple years in the UFC, where he was asked about his transition from Pride to the UFC -- at the time he claimed to be barely above the 185 pound limit. However, I can't find the interview now, so my memory isn't worth much. His weight clearly went in an arc (you can see this from pictures), from being a thin and light fighter in Pride to being heavy in the UFC, and he looked smaller in his first fights in the UFC than he did later on. He was a tall MW, but didn't seem to be particularly heavy (unless you mean he generally was doughy -- ie carried more fat than most MW's).

 

[ThunderStruck]

I was thinking of an interview he gave sometime in his first couple years in the UFC, where he was asked about his transition from Pride to the UFC -- at the time he claimed to be barely above the 185 pound limit. However, I can't find the interview now, so my memory isn't worth much. His weight clearly went in an arc (you can see this from pictures), from being a thin and light fighter in Pride to being heavy in the UFC, and he looked smaller in his first fights in the UFC than he did later on. He was a tall MW, but didn't seem to be particularly heavy (unless you mean he generally was doughy -- ie carried more fat than most MW's).

They clearly can't only be 5 lbs apart. This is a picture that was taken when both were at the peak of their reign :

 

[ineverpost]

GSP will not sign an exclusive deal and Vince if afraid that he will win the title and take it to WCW

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

They clearly can't only be 5 lbs apart. This is a picture that was taken when both were at the peak of their reign :

I agree, but that was taken after Silva had been in the UFC several years. The quote I remember but can't find the source was when he first came to the UFC from Pride.

He was thinner (and presumably lighter) then, but still became champ:

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/_k4dkTwn65pM/S_9C1ZpbkpI/AAAAAAAAAcM/ElFwz5MTP38/s1600/franklin-silva.jpg

I'm wondering about what you said about Anderson weighing in at 192 for a fight because he cut too much weight. That had to be for a 205 pound fight (otherwise he'd have been 7 pounds over if it was 185) -- which meant Anderson overcut 205 by 13 pounds. That''s very hard to believe, no one overcuts by that much. That 192 had to be pretty close to what he considered his fit weight.

In a way Anderson feeling more comfortable fighting lighter at MW than GSP makes sense, in that Anderson is primarily a striker, and weight makes less difference in striking once you get to the heavier weight divisions (when everyone had KO power). Anderson could be ten pounds lighter than the guys he fought and still knock them out. As a primary grappler GSP would be more sensitive to giving up weight to his opponents.

 

[ThunderStruck]

I agree, but that was taken after Silva had been in the UFC several years. The quote I remember but can't find the source was when he first came to the UFC from Pride.

He was thinner (and presumably lighter) then, but still became champ:

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/_k4dkTwn65pM/S_9C1ZpbkpI/AAAAAAAAAcM/ElFwz5MTP38/s1600/franklin-silva.jpg

I'm wondering about what you said about Anderson weighing in at 192 for a fight because he cut too much weight. That had to be for a 205 pound fight (otherwise he'd have been 7 pounds over if it was 185) -- which meant Anderson overcut 205 by 13 pounds. That''s very hard to believe, no one overcuts by that much. That 192 had to be pretty close to what he considered his fit weight.

In a way Anderson feeling more comfortable fighting lighter at MW than GSP makes sense, in that Anderson is primarily a striker, and weight makes less difference in striking once you get to the heavier weight divisions (when everyone had KO power). Anderson could be ten pounds lighter than the guys he fought and still knock them out. As a primary grappler GSP would be more sensitive to giving up weight to his opponents.

My bad, its was 182 pounds for a MW fight.

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

My bad, its was 182 pounds for a MW fight.

Thanks, that makes more sense.