Gary Tonon is the future featherweight GOAT

[Do The Evolution]

Lol no

Why the need to post that, though? As far as I know you're the only one saying that, bud.

 

[GaryEric]

A serial killer dog gynaecologist.
Sounds like something netflex would make a documentary of. their cat killer bs was very hyped.

You’re pretty simple eh?
Take a puff yourself.
i already said that above. Plagiarising my pulitzer level literature! I’ll report u as well!

these forums need a new gaurdian *capes up*

Oh i get it now , you're a dork. Carry on.

 

[GordoBarraBJJ]

Isn't he kind of old to be getting started, though?

Hence why he is crushing cans in Asia.

 

[Dog Gynecologist]

Why the need to post that, though? As far as I know you're the only one saying that, bud.

Since i was joking, the fact is nobody is saying that.

 

[CI]

Yeah, I was aware he had a hand full of fights, but if he wants to be the GOAT, he's going to have to come over to the UFC where he's going to be put up against very strong wrestlers and strikers immediately.
His lack of a striking background and starting at 29 (I did forget that he was so young,) and going up against seasoned well rounded possibly top 10-20 ranked types of fighters is going to be tough for a sport bjj guy.

While I don't follow him as much as I used to, I am a fan (the fat ass comment was tongue and cheek.) I wouldn't mind seeing him take a run at the title. I'm just dubious about it unless he switches camps and really focuses on his standup.

I think he will do just fine with some of the strikers there. just need enough standup to get it to the ground. Ryan Hall is older than Tonon, and I would still give tonon the nod over him. Hall is up there in rankings too and a grappler.

Its good hes building some experience in mma. would like to see him hop over sometime.

 

[Do The Evolution]

Since i was joking, the fact is nobody is saying that.

OK

 

[jitzmonkey]

Uhh... Koyomi Matsushima is a strong wrestler.

Uhh.. switch camps? whats wrong with Renzo's?
Firas has brought in dunaher to help gsp with strikes once. he is a an MMA coach as well with many striking coaches to contact.
Renzo academy is not just the death squad or the blue basement they have a bunch of mma fighters in multiple orgs...

Garyy actually insisted he only fights stand up in his mma debut and ended up winning by punches and elbows. dunaher was against that but he let him bang.

Anyway, Kron was his main rival in grappling and he fought Cub to a decision in his 6th fight at the end of last year. the fight was closer than people reacted after(though cub clearly won)

Cejudo fought the flyweight goat at his 10th fight at age 30, rematched him and won 2 years later.

Anything is possible in the cage or ring.
In my eyes Bernard Hopkins is an international treasure for winning a world boxing championship at age 50.

Valid arguments, Renzo's is a great gym. they don't produce the best strikers, though. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to do so in the future, but it's just not the case now.
GSP was already a very proficient striker when he arrived, so a guy like that can benefit from one or two things that someone might specialize in. They're not creating world class MMA strikers over there. I mean, even Joe Rogan helped GSP with his spin kicks (because Joe's deadly with those but you don't see fighters flocking to him to help them with their stand up.
Again, don't get me wrong, I know that they're studs. I just think that he's going to benefit more from a Rafael Cordeiro, Javier Mendez, or even a pure boxing coach.

Cub's a great and wiley veteran, but he's having trouble with the younger guys.
I'm not saying that Tonon doesn't have the ability; just that it'd be an up hill climb.

Re Renzo's: They're killers, and Renzo was always very gracious when he passed by our MMA/BJJ school when I was there. Very friendly and supportive! A good handful of their guys would come over to do private lessons with my coach probably just to get a different look.

 

[Dog Gynecologist]

OK

You say "OK" but your heart say "Moron....", and it hurts :'(

 

[jitzmonkey]

I think he will do just fine with some of the strikers there. just need enough standup to get it to the ground. Ryan Hall is older than Tonon, and I would still give tonon the nod over him. Hall is up there in rankings too and a grappler.

Its good hes building some experience in mma. would like to see him hop over sometime.

You're probably right.

Re Hall: No one wants to take him serious. Due to his image, a fight with him is too much risk to reward. I don't really know much about him other than his Imanari rolls and heel hooks. I hope he's got something else going; because so many people are ducking him.

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

Valid arguments, Renzo's is a great gym. they don't produce the best strikers, though. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to do so in the future, but it's just not the case now.
GSP was already a very proficient striker when he arrived, so a guy like that can benefit from one or two things that someone might specialize in. They're not creating world class MMA strikers over there. I mean, even Joe Rogan helped GSP with his spin kicks (because Joe's deadly with those but you don't see fighters flocking to him to help them with their stand up.
Again, don't get me wrong, I know that they're studs. I just think that he's going to benefit more from a Rafael Cordeiro, Javier Mendez, or even a pure boxing coach.

Cub's a great and wiley veteran, but he's having trouble with the younger guys.
I'm not saying that Tonon doesn't have the ability; just that it'd be an up hill climb.

Re Renzo's: They're killers, and Renzo was always very gracious when he passed by our MMA/BJJ school when I was there. Very friendly and supportive! A good handful of their guys would come over to do private lessons with my coach probably just to get a different look.

Actually, I highly disagree. the fact he has a strength, he should focus on that instead of trying to reinvent himself so late. However, if he wishes to evolve his striking he can easily ask Dunaher and he'll pull strings and get him training partners or trips to a boxing gym on schedule.

Also, no, GSP did not reach out to Rogan, nor did rogan offer. It was John Dunaher asking around for somebody with a high dan in tae kwan doe who also trained and competed in kickboxing, and he gambled a bit on rogan.

The man actually manipulated rogan into doing so, rogan only found out much later on his own podcast from one of the guys dunaher asked around about him. Rogan was like "no wonder he stood next to me that day and kept thinking out loud about it, he made me volunteer on my own holy fuck!" the reason was simple it was only for the spinning back kick to the mid-section as the famous video that starts with him wiping the floor from sweat shows only.

Also, and this is my old bitter self talking. GSP is the most previleged fighter ever in terms of training partners and coaches. dude has tools added to him from blackzillians, jackson-wink, a bunch of different gracie schools, tristar with firas, rolled with more adcc champions on regular basis than any mma fighter(including both estima brothers, gordon ryan, and others), did mitt work with Freddie Roach(pacman's trainer) a lot too, and the list goes on and on. Nobody will be able to replicate his inventory of connections. Still top 3 p4p ever on my list though.

 

[jitzmonkey]

Actually, I highly disagree. the fact he has a strength, he should focus on that instead of trying to reinvent himself so late. However, if he wishes to evolve his striking he can easily ask Dunaher and he'll pull strings and get him training partners or trips to a boxing gym on schedule.

Also, no, GSP did not reach out to Rogan, nor did rogan offer. It was John Dunaher asking around for somebody with a high dan in tae kwan doe who also trained and competed in kickboxing, and he gambled a bit on rogan.

The man actually manipulated rogan into doing so, rogan only found out much later on his own podcast from one of the guys dunaher asked around about him. Rogan was like "no wonder he stood next to me that day and kept thinking out loud about it, he made me volunteer on my own holy fuck!" the reason was simple it was only for the spinning back kick to the mid-section as the famous video that starts with him wiping the floor from sweat shows only.

Also, and this is my old bitter self talking. GSP is the most previleged fighter ever in terms of training partners and coaches. dude has tools added to him from blackzillians, jackson-wink, a bunch of different gracie schools, tristar with firas, rolled with more adcc champions on regular basis than any mma fighter(including both estima brothers, gordon ryan, and others), did mitt work with Freddie Roach(pacman's trainer) a lot too, and the list goes on and on. Nobody will be able to replicate his inventory of connections. Still top 3 p4p ever on my list though.

Tonon's BJJ is light years beyond anyone at LW. He doesn't really need more time with that. He needs to make people worried enough about his stand up game to not just be concerned about stopping the takedown or avoiding the clinch. Kind of like an earlier iteration of Khabib when he was able to catch people on the feet because they thought he was shooting. That's what made GSP such a tough fight or everyone. He was multifaceted.

Re Rogan and GSP: I wasn't aware of the particulars that you're speaking or around GSP and Rogan; but they only wanted Rogan to show help him with that one specific (arguably advanced) technique because GSP had arguably already mastered so many other aspects of the standup game. I couldn't see coaches reaching out for a guy like Tonon, or Chiesa(, or whoever else is not known for their standup) to just learn one technique when there's still so much work to do on the basics.

Re being privileged: He was known for working incredibly hard, being super athletic, and respectful. I doubt anyone needed their arm twisted (outside of Rogan?) to work with him.
Personally, those are the type of people that I want to be in business with (which are hard to find and why I run a 1 man operation<Lmaoo>)

Valid arguments, though!

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

Tonon's BJJ is light years beyond anyone at LW. He doesn't really need more time with that. He needs to make people worried enough about his stand up game to not just be concerned about stopping the takedown or avoiding the clinch. Kind of like an earlier iteration of Khabib when he was able to catch people on the feet because they thought he was shooting. That's what made GSP such a tough fight or everyone. He was multifaceted.

Romero 's wrestling credentials are better than Tonnon's bjj credentials.
He neglected it so much... could have easily been champ long ago if he utilized it more consistently.
Justin G, although not as a coomplished could have capitlized on it too, but he's been fighting to please the mans more than he cares about "winning anyway possible".

Re Rogan and GSP: I wasn't aware of the particulars that you're speaking or around GSP and Rogan; but they only wanted Rogan to show help him with that one specific (arguably advanced) technique because GSP had arguably already mastered so many other aspects of the standup game. I couldn't see coaches reaching out for a guy like Tonon, or Chiesa(, or whoever else is not known for their standup) to just learn one technique when there's still so much work to do on the basics.
!

The basics? there's boxing trainers and muay thai trainers at renzos... I'm sure he knows how to cut angles and jab cross hook 123. You don't need someone famous to learn the basics, he already won mma fights via strikes.

Re being privileged: He was known for working incredibly hard, being super athletic, and respectful. I doubt anyone needed their arm twisted (outside of Rogan?) to work with him.
Personally, those are the type of people that I want to be in business with (which are hard to find and why I run a 1 man operation<Lmaoo>)

Valid arguments, though!

I'm not exactly sure what you mean. You can say the same thing about many other fighters(being athletic and likeable). But nobody had the help that gsp did... Gordon ryan and braulio estima never needed him for anything for example. He was getting people from multiple opposing gyms somehow.

 

[fortheo]

Tonon's BJJ is light years beyond anyone at LW. He doesn't really need more time with that. He needs to make people worried enough about his stand up game to not just be concerned about stopping the takedown or avoiding the clinch. Kind of like an earlier iteration of Khabib when he was able to catch people on the feet because they thought he was shooting. That's what made GSP such a tough fight or everyone. He was multifaceted.

Re Rogan and GSP: I wasn't aware of the particulars that you're speaking or around GSP and Rogan; but they only wanted Rogan to show help him with that one specific (arguably advanced) technique because GSP had arguably already mastered so many other aspects of the standup game. I couldn't see coaches reaching out for a guy like Tonon, or Chiesa(, or whoever else is not known for their standup) to just learn one technique when there's still so much work to do on the basics.

Re being privileged: He was known for working incredibly hard, being super athletic, and respectful. I doubt anyone needed their arm twisted (outside of Rogan?) to work with him.
Personally, those are the type of people that I want to be in business with (which are hard to find and why I run a 1 man operation<Lmaoo>)

Valid arguments, though!

I've seen ferreira beat tonnon in BJJ, but I don't remember it well. Maybe tonnon wasn't at his best back then

 

[jitzmonkey]

Romero 's wrestling credentials are better than Tonnon's bjj credentials.
He neglected it so much... could have easily been champ long ago if he utilized it more consistently.
Justin G, although not as a coomplished could have capitlized on it too, but he's been fighting to please the mans more than he cares about "winning anyway possible".

The basics? there's boxing trainers and muay thai trainers at renzos... I'm sure he knows how to cut angles and jab cross hook 123. You don't need someone famous to learn the basics, he already won mma fights via strikes.


I'm not exactly sure what you mean. You can say the same thing about many other fighters(being athletic and likeable). But nobody had the help that gsp did... Gordon ryan and braulio estima never needed him for anything for example. He was getting people from multiple opposing gyms somehow.

I didn't say that he should ignore his BJJ.

I'm saying that if he brought in a high level boxing coach.

And there're very few as likable as GSP, plus I don't remember any MMA fighter who wasn't a wrestler being allowed to train at their Olympic training center. It's not like he was there to help them.
Re people wanting to train him: Frankly, if you're getting paid to work with someone, there are probably few better in the sport than GSP.

 

[BabyBlue_Bomber]

Tonon reminds me of Taun-Taun

 

[jitzmonkey]

I've seen ferreira beat tonnon in BJJ, but I don't remember it well. Maybe tonnon wasn't at his best back then

to clarify, I'm talking in MMA.

 

[Kryptt]

Tonon reminds me of Taun-Taun

That's a decent IN gif (clipped)!

 

[BloodBonesNButter]

 

[fortheo]

to clarify, I'm talking in MMA.

You said tonnon's bjj was light-years ahead of anyone in the LW division, but ferreira beat him in BJJ and ferreira is top ten in the UFC LW division.

You're saying tonnon adapted his bjj to mma better?

 

[jitzmonkey]

You said tonnon's bjj was light-years ahead of anyone in the LW division, but ferreira beat him in BJJ and ferreira is top ten in the UFC LW division.

You're saying tonnon adapted his bjj to mma better?

I think that his ability to scramble makes his BJJ more adaptable to MMA.
Kind of like (I'm gonna get boo'd here) Ben Askren.

I'm not saying that I think that he can beat Ferreira, who seems much more well rounded; but has also been around a lot longer and is 6 years older...


Edit: So I think he can afford to take time way from the mat, and start having standup heavy camps for a little while.