Forgotten MMA fighters....
- Thread starter Lionheart7167
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Steve Cantwell was a lot of fun...until he wasn't. But this was maybe 20 years ago. I don't see him talked about but he was a mid-career WEC transplant. Very hot-cold and bad temperament. Bounced around MW-LHW. Had these rangy, drilling punches with pop and virtually no setup almost like a Superman but obviously not Rush level.
Another guy I used to love was Joey Villaseñor. Older guys here might remember him too. Fought in King of the Cage and EliteXC, that I can remember. Had these beautiful shoulder strikes when tied up that are crazy underutilised in present-day MMA. Natural fighter, IMO.
Another guy I used to love was Joey Villaseñor. Older guys here might remember him too. Fought in King of the Cage and EliteXC, that I can remember. Had these beautiful shoulder strikes when tied up that are crazy underutilised in present-day MMA. Natural fighter, IMO.
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Cool. Thats even more awesome.
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Good ol' "Smokin" Joey,
(my older brothers were JMMA veterans from the late 90s/early2000s, so I had great luck when it came to meet fighters and go to live events, since 2 of them had pro-fights and trained with fighters who would later stay in contact with them)
when he defended his KOTC MW title for the 6th time for the main event of King Of The Cage: Prime Time, against another forgotten veteran, Jorge "The Sandman" Santiago
(who would then end up in the UFC, then Strikeforce, after that he was a fixture at early Sengoku events in which he became the MW champion, and his rivalry with Kazuo "The Grabaka Hitman" Mizaki entertained many sheroggers; Santiago finished his career with a second UFC and third UFC run, with a couple wins at Titan FC in between, and his last fight was a loss to TUF 7 & UFC veteran Gerald "Hurricane" Harris at WSOF: Tyrone Spong vs Angel DeAnda)
That KOTC: Prime Time event was so cool, I got to see many of my favorite guys fight live, from:
- Charles "Krazy Horse/Kid Khaos/Felony" Bennett vs Victor "Joe Boxer" Valenzuela (their fight went to a draw but they had a rematch 2 years later in Strikeforce in which Victor KO'd Krazy Horse in the first round)
- future Bellator long-lasting LHW champion Emanuel Newton vs UFC vet Hector Ramirez
- future TUF 12 & UFC superstar + Pancrase FW champ Nam Phan vs some guy
- Thomas "The Wildman" Dennis vs some dude
- my man Shannon "The Cannon" Ritch vs Canadian vet John "The Natural" Alessio (he was the WW KOTC champ at the time, but would later become famous for his stints in the WEC, UFC & Bellator)
- "Razor" Rob McCullough (future WEC LW champion + DREAM & Bellator vet) vs some cat
- Future WEC & UFC fan favorite Cub Swanson vs some bro
- Future UFC & Bellator vet Mike "The Joker" Guymon (who was the KOTC WW champ, damn it was a rather prestigious event looking back on it, lots of champions there) vs some chum
- Pancrase vet & Future PRIDE & UFC vet James Lee (who would capture the KOTC title a couple events later by beating James Te Huna in the first round) vs some fella
- Many "The Mangler" Tapia (he was the KOTC BW champ at the time, but veterans Sherdoggers probably remember him best as one of Miguel Torres' last WEC title defenses before the big plunge
) vs some bloke-Ernie "The Piranah" Perea vs someone with a very negative record.
Perea quickly sub'd him, and later retired after going 7-0 (all in KOTC since he was very involved in the org at every level, matchmaker, cornerman, trainer, promoter, etc etc... and he also fought hand-picked subpar competition, but what the hell, let the guy have his fun. He was also a cop on the side IIRC, but his main passion was grappling and MMA, and he did a lot for the sport his level).
When we bought our tickets, Urijah Faber vs Russ "The Submission Magician" Miura was on the card
but sadly it fizzled out by the time we made it there... Miura did well for himself afterward, going 9-1 in MMA before retiring to become a full-time BJJ/wrestling coach and then opened his own dojo, he seems to be doing OK and organizes local tournaments on the regular .Sadly, I'm pretty sure that the only fight I've seen out of him is his one loss, to Japanese forgotten badass and 8x Pancrase Flyweight & Strawweight champion + RIZIN vet Mitsuhisa Sunabe.
Aaaaaanyway, Joey Villaseñor. What a guy. I'm ashamed to admit that I rooted against him with all my might when he fought my man Murilo"Ninja" Rua for the Strikeforce/EliteXC MW belt at the legendary Strikeforce event "Frank Shamrock vs Phil Baroni"
... and it worked!
But that was pretty much the one time I wasn't rooting for Joey, I mean I couldn't cheer for him when he KO'd Phil "NYBA" Baroni, since no matter what I'd never cheer against a Hammer House veteran, but in light of what Baroni later did with his life,I'm glad Joy smashed him
Can't believe he and his fellow scumbag pal War Machine flew the Hammer House© flag, fook'em both.
I was also on the fence when Joey fought Riki Fukuda right after the Ninja loss, I wanted Fukuda to do good but if Joey lost again after Ninja, it would diminish the value of Murilo's win, ya know? Plus, I liked Joey. They ended up fighting basically to a draw, and Riki lost a split decision, so it was a pretty good outcome from where I was sitting.
I ain't proud of having rooted against him, but with Ninja's little brother Mauricio "Shogun" Rua having just gotten into the UFC and primed to make his debut a few months later (since he had to get surgeries on both his knees, it took a bit of time before his catastrophic debut against Griffin... but hey, he later avenged it, so it could be worse)
and with me being a fan of both brothers equally, I liked the idea of Shogun taking over the UFC while Ninja was taking care of business and raking belts in other orgs, and hopefully their 3rd brother Marcus "Shaolin" Rua would soon make his pro-debut and take over the family business...
Sadly Marcos would just have a few amateur muay thai bouts, and then decided it wasn't for him. Ha, the number of casuals who thought that Vitor "Shaolin" Ribeiro was Shogun & Ninja's brother, because they both hyped him up a lot in interviews when Ribeiro was at his peak, and there weren't many "Shaolins" running around, sooo...
Which reminds me, you can throw Shaolin on the semi-forgotten MMA badasses pile, he never fought in the UFC so I guess lots of casuals don't know him, but he was one of the top fighters of his weight-class/generation, being an ADCC veteran and having fought a lot of big names in Shooto, K1 Heroes, DREAM and Strikeforce...
Finshing his career at 20-5 (with 4 of these losses taking place during his last 5 MMA bouts before retiring) was very respectable, and after that it's been nice to see him grapple at Sakuraba's Quintet in recent years (2018?? damn... looks like he also grappled in 2024 against BJJ elite Adriano Silva, I haven't seen that one), it was fun watching him compete against a beast like Gordon Ryan
and a debuting PJ Barch
(that I would later see accumulate wins at many Polaris events in which he won a prestigious WW Grand Prix, and a couple UFC Fight Pass Invitational).
Good times.
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Jean "White Bear" Silva is all I can think about when the youngguns talk about the new UFC Jean Silva. I never even see people in "Jean Silva threads" reference the OG anymore
He was one of my favorite little dudes at the Chute Boxe Academy, and I was so pumped when he got a title shot against Takanori Gomi in PRIDE to avenge his teammates Luiz Azeredo & Jadyson Costa.
I was always wondering why they called this small dude "White Bear", a nickname more befitting someone like Jeff Monson or Sergei Kharitonov than Jean.
But then I learned that it was a remnant from his capoeira days, in which the masters give the most random nicknames to their students, and you have to be in on the joke to get it.
T'was back when he was a long-reigning Cage Rage champion (he would train at London Shootfighters when he stayed in England) with acrobatic capoeira kicks and candid interviews in broken engrish that endeared him to UK fans.
He put up a good one against "the Fireball Kid", taking Gomi to a decision while fighting almost in the same way Luiz Azeredo did (and Luiz/Gomi 2 was pretty darn close), but sadly PRIDE never called back.
After that, the loss that stung me the most out of his entire career, when he blundered during a Cage Rage title fight and after a promising start full of action on both sides (perfect mix of stand-up and ground game) tried a leglock against Masakazu "Ashikan Judan" Imanari, one of the biggest leglock monsters of that time alongside Rousimar Palhares.
It didn't end well, and Silva's knee got badly injured in a reverse heel-hook
In another notable bout, "White Bear" would give an early loss to another Brazilian favorite of mine, Leonardo Santos, who at that point had also lost to Gomi in his first MMA bout ever (no shame in that), but he had also submitted GSP at ADCC which is a pretty cool feather in his cap.
Leo Santos then really impressed me during TUF Brazil 2 (which he won) in which he beat, among others, Thiago "Marreta" Santos who was like 2 or 3 weight classes bigger than him (Leo Santos spent his UFC career at LW, and Marreta's last fight at PFL was at HW were he weighed 265lbs of juiced muscle; he pissed hot in one of his latest fights so it's not fighter bashing, just Saiyan' )
Anyway, don't forget one of the unsung Chute Boxe heroes guyz, Jean Silvaaaaaaaaaaa
Leo Santos is a great mention, he had some serious skills, fought a lot of top guys in the global scene, had lots of submissions and KO's.
Seemed like he did not care about chasing promotional accolades, just wanted to the best he could on his own terms.
He was putting a clinic on Ben Askren when Askren was at his peak before the fight was stopped due to eye pokes.
ONE somehow scrubbed the fight from the internet for years afterwards.
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Rin Nakai is for purists....Gabi Garcia for casuals.Do people still remember Rin Nakai?
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If forgotten fighters and mma history is your kink, you should listen to the MMA History podcast. It used to be called Lyte’s out podcast when Chris Lytle was involved. A lot of deep dives on pioneers of the sport and the careers of guys mentioned in this thread telling their own stories
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Damn right about Leo Santos, one of Nova Uniao's best.... but there's a lil' mix-up here, Leo never competed against Ben Askren, you're thinking of Luis "Sapo" Santos, another Brazilian badass that we're lucky to have watched in ONE at the end of his career from 2014 to 2019 <3
edit: damn, I watched the fight after posting it, I had forgotten about how dominant Luis was during those 2m19s; he stuffed 4 or 5 takedowns from Ben, kicked him a bunch, and in one of his last tkd attempts he just got stuffed and thrown to the side like it was easy.
Adding to this that it was a Funky eyepoke fuckup, and his attitude during the entire ordeal was ridiculous. Luis took his 5 min to see if it would clear up if he waited a bit, Askren was saying stuff like "he doesn't wanna fight he doesn't wanna fight" like he wasn't getting lit up before the foul, and that the foul was 100% his fault (not on purpose, sure, but d)
They were supposed to have an immediate rematch after pulling a Gane-Tom© in the first round (champ supposed to crush the challenger, challenger does surprisingly well, then in round 1 an eyepoke put an end to the conflict and we just want MOAR).
ONE promoted it and all
fans wanted to watch it, but sadly "Sapo" didn't make weight ><
His record of 65-12-1 isn't just for show, he mainly lost to top guys and future top guys (if you look at his early losses, guys who beat him pretty much all ended up going places MMA-wise) and even if he crushes the occasional can (gotta pay for that Sherdog plat account somehow, 'tis the only way to remain competitive at the highest level), lots of his wins were against solid competition.
Yeeeaaah, someone else is hyping LytesOut on this here beautiful forum
It's definitely my favorite MMA related podcast out there, he and his regulars are friggin' historians, it's crazy how many old dusty MMA rumors/urban legends that have been confirmed or put to rest by the interested party themselves!
I semi-recently took to listening to Rampage's podcast more frequently, JAXXON's, because he gets cool guests and they clearly have fun there, but MMA-wise you can tell that Rampage doesn't spend nearly enough times in the tough streets of Sherdog, guy gets soooo much stuff wrong and just doesn't know very important moments from his guests careers it's kinda disrespectful in a way, but it adds to the entertainment value
All of this to say, LytesOut Podcast (aka MMA HISTORY PODCAST) for the real deal that gets my full attention, and JAXXON podcast when I need something fun as background noise.
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Daniel Puder was a 6'3" HW, went 8-0 in MMA competing in Strikeforce and also won some prestigious WWE tournament. He could have been much, much bigger. His brother, David Puder, is a world renown psychiatrist who puts out a regular podcast I listen to.
TJ Grant ended his UFC career on a 5-fight win streak beating Evan Dunham, Watt Miman (KO) and Gray Maynard (KO) before retiring to work the potash mines in Saskatchewan
Also, I can't believe it's taken this long for Norifumi KID Yamamoto to be mentioned
Special shout out to Dokonjonosuke Mishima who had some crazy entrances (see his entrance vs Joe Stevenson--that was the most PRIDE I've ever seen the UFC). He had a very funny face-off vs Krazy Horse. And had this CRAZY submission, which I've never seen before or since.
TJ Grant ended his UFC career on a 5-fight win streak beating Evan Dunham, Watt Miman (KO) and Gray Maynard (KO) before retiring to work the potash mines in Saskatchewan
Also, I can't believe it's taken this long for Norifumi KID Yamamoto to be mentioned
Special shout out to Dokonjonosuke Mishima who had some crazy entrances (see his entrance vs Joe Stevenson--that was the most PRIDE I've ever seen the UFC). He had a very funny face-off vs Krazy Horse. And had this CRAZY submission, which I've never seen before or since.
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When it comes to KID, frankly I think he hasn't been mentioned because he isn't forgotten. He was a superstar and an elite fighter, it's not the same as forgetting some dude who had a few good wins at regional shows and kinda vanished.
Mishima's Cobra Lock was definitely nuts; I remember Takanori Gomi doing something similar in a grappling competition ages ago in Japan, a move that Gomi calls "The Serpent"
Dean Lister explained the submission in this video, it's the third technique he shows =>
I agree that the host, "Bear", isn't very interesting but he admits himself that he started to follow MMA because of the Conor craze, so I don't expect much from him questions wise (not that newer fans can't be interesting and have legitimate questions obviously, damn I tend to forget that Conor beat José Aldo 10 years ago; so "Conor n00bs" can also be vets and be interested in the history of the sport.... it's just that "Bear" doesn't give of that vibe at all)
What I enjoy is the relaxed conversations between Rampages and the guests, it's often pointless light-hearted banter about the good ol' days, and Bear is sometimes useful because Quinton has the shittiest memory (and claims to have stopped following MMA during the Conor era) so his co-host can correct him when he says some bullshit.
Like, I don't know if he was playing it up for laughs or what but when he received Luke Rockhold, Rampage didn't seem to realize that he and Bisping fought twice, and he never knows who's the current champ and who fought who in general.... but he's up-to-date with all the shenanigans that Bob Sapp gets up to in Japan these days
priorities, so it makes for fun stories to listen to while falling asleepOn the other end of the spectrum, Chris Lytle's LYTES OUT podcast is so interesting and focused that I have to give it my full attention to make sure I don't miss anything, especially since lots of guest join the podcast with their webcam and the sound isn't great, an even if my English is pretty good, some of these guys have some thick ass accents and I don't understand crucial parts.
Heck that's the whole reason I dropped the Dan and Don's Toxic Masculinity Podcast (Dan Severn & Don Frye)
The concept was fun but the heavy smoker's wheezing voices coupled with the constant barking in the background and the crappy mics plus the words slurring while Frye chain-smokes cigars made me drop it for good, I barely understood half of what was being said.But hey, I'm talking about the first few episodes, the quality has probably improved a lot if it's still alive, lemme check.
Oof, I'm still subscribed but there hasn't been an upload in more than a year.
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Adding a few more to my "Remembering Some Guys" list...
Jordan Mein - UFC/Bellator/Strikeforce
Jason High - UFC/Affliction/DREAM/K-1/Strikeforce/WSoF/PFL
Luiz Firmino - M-1 Global/Shooto/PRIDE/DREAM/WSoF/PFL
Steven Siler - UFC/WSoF/PFL
"Baby" Joe Taimanglo - Bellator - Would have won BW title from Darrion Caldwell if not for missing weight
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Jason DeLucia
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Damn right about Leo Santos, one of Nova Uniao's best.... but there's a lil' mix-up here, Leo never competed against Ben Askren, you're thinking of Luis "Sapo" Santos, another Brazilian badass that we're lucky to have watched in ONE at the end of his career from 2014 to 2019 <3
edit: damn, I watched the fight after posting it, I had forgotten about how dominant Luis was during those 2m19s; he stuffed 4 or 5 takedowns from Ben, kicked him a bunch, and in one of his last tkd attempts he just got stuffed and thrown to the side like it was easy.
Adding to this that it was a Funky eyepoke fuckup, and his attitude during the entire ordeal was ridiculous. Luis took his 5 min to see if it would clear up if he waited a bit, Askren was saying stuff like "he doesn't wanna fight he doesn't wanna fight" like he wasn't getting lit up before the foul, and that the foul was 100% his fault (not on purpose, sure, but d)
They were supposed to have an immediate rematch after pulling a Gane-Tom© in the first round (champ supposed to crush the challenger, challenger does surprisingly well, then in round 1 an eyepoke put an end to the conflict and we just want MOAR).
ONE promoted it and all
fans wanted to watch it, but sadly "Sapo" didn't make weight ><
His record of 65-12-1 isn't just for show, he mainly lost to top guys and future top guys (if you look at his early losses, guys who beat him pretty much all ended up going places MMA-wise) and even if he crushes the occasional can (gotta pay for that Sherdog plat account somehow, 'tis the only way to remain competitive at the highest level), lots of his wins were against solid competition.
Yeeeaaah, someone else is hyping LytesOut on this here beautiful forum
It's definitely my favorite MMA related podcast out there, he and his regulars are friggin' historians, it's crazy how many old dusty MMA rumors/urban legends that have been confirmed or put to rest by the interested party themselves!
I semi-recently took to listening to Rampage's podcast more frequently, JAXXON's, because he gets cool guests and they clearly have fun there, but MMA-wise you can tell that Rampage doesn't spend nearly enough times in the tough streets of Sherdog, guy gets soooo much stuff wrong and just doesn't know very important moments from his guests careers it's kinda disrespectful in a way, but it adds to the entertainment value
All of this to say, LytesOut Podcast (aka MMA HISTORY PODCAST) for the real deal that gets my full attention, and JAXXON podcast when I need something fun as background noise.
LytesOut Podcast (aka MMA HISTORY PODCAST) has had some excellent episodes.
The interviews with Gerald Strebendt that also covered the Rafiel Torre murder case were most fascinating.
Semmy Schilt and Alistair Overeem gave some unique insights too.
The KID Yamamoto career deep dive with Enson Inoue was also a vibe.
And the one with Denis Kang was really raw, that guy has had unreal life experiences.
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Philipe Lins - Bellator/PFL/UFC
Josh Copeland - UFC/WSoF/PFL
Jared Rosholt - UFC/WSoF/PFL
Francimar Barroso - UFC/PFL
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Mork was really fun to watch, truly a kill or be killed fighter. (Maybe not the best wording here).
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I remember there was a lot of excitement when Tyrone Spong transitioned to MMA. He only fought a few times though, and didn't really impress like a lot of people thought he would. I think people were expecting a Manhoef
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Ya there was a ton of hype on Tyrone Spong even when he moved up to heavyweight from the more obscure weight classes in Muay Thai/K1.
Back in those days it was either 70kg or 95+ if you wanted to make a name for yourself and he was in between.
He did not have a lot of reputable opponents on his record, just really good numbers and ratio's, and he looked sharp as hell training under Lucien Carbine (then they split, just like Overeem and Ristie).
With his fight IQ it was surprising that he did not do as well in MMA or Boxing, also had some bad luck, and probably peaked too early.
Could have been a KO machine like Manhoef but with better defense and cardio.
People to this day still say he was such a scary striker, but cannot name a single world beater that he conquered.
Still seems to make a living in the combat industry on reputation alone, borne mostly through word of mouth rather than social media, which is impressive on its own.
NB: he did look absolutely amazing against Nathan Corbett up until NC switched to Southpaw.
