Media Figueiredo wants PPV points..

It was a dumb bootlicking UFC comment. You don't have to buy PPVs to criticize UFC for fighter pay.
You don’t think it’s a bit ironic that a bunch of posters who don’t pay for ppv, who keep his ppv #’s below thresholds, complain that he’s not getting a % of ppv sales?

It’s fair play to criticize pay, that’s fine. But most posters who don’t pay for ppv justify it by saying it doesn’t go to the fighters anyway.
 
The ESPN deal killed the last negotiation tool fighters had with the UFC as they take th. Now all they have left is not to fight. Honestly they all need to stop taking fights. Dana and the UFC are basically funneling all of the profits, even more than before, to WME as it's the only company that's keeping them from going out of business and being able to pay back the multi-billion dollar loans.

That's where the leverage is.

But you are more likely to get Congress to agree to give people health care during a pandemic than to convince fighters with compromised management teams that are in bed with the UFC to ever strike.
How did the ESPN deal kill negotiation?

Funneling profits to the company that owns them?
 
It’s completely made up though and is based primarily on the benavidez 1 reported payout, before he became champ. It assumed his base went up 10% to $110k after winning the belt. Benavidez made $150k base as a challenger.
Benavidez has been there longer so his pay makes sense and fig wasn't the champ he missed weight in their first fight. I know it's an estimate based how how most contracts work and increase in pay. Like I said it's not 100% but it's better than just saying numbered based off of pure speculation.
 
He probably is getting them, but since they don't kick in until 200k buys maybe it didn't activate?

Even interim champs get PPV (6:45)

@Rizz watch this video as Dana states champs get ppv points even interim champs so where are you getting that fig had a choice and chose a higher pay instead which what would his pay have been if he didn't?
 
@Rizz watch this video as Dana states champs get ppv points even interim champs so where are you getting that fig had a choice and chose a higher pay instead which what would his pay have been if he didn't?
I posted earlier that MM chose a higher base pay instead of getting ppv points. He wanted the guaranteed money instead of making a bet. He knew he wasn’t a draw of the other major stars.
 
Benavidez has been there longer so his pay makes sense and fig wasn't the champ he missed weight in their first fight. I know it's an estimate based how how most contracts work and increase in pay. Like I said it's not 100% but it's better than just saying numbered based off of pure speculation.
Agreed it makes sense that’s benavidez made more for that particular fight. But not that fig would only get a small bump when he became champ, still making less than benavidez.

Sites like that can only make estimates, so they do. It doesn’t make them good estimates (and they don’t have to care if they are good estimates or not, they get the traffic, and they get quoted), particularly for fighters who haven’t had a disclosed payout for a while, or fighters with major changes in circumstances or new contracts.
 
I posted earlier that MM chose a higher base pay instead of getting ppv points. He wanted the guaranteed money instead of making a bet. He knew he wasn’t a draw of the other major stars.
What is Rizz your account too? Weird. How do you know he chose that? Do you have a link to an article?
 
How did the ESPN deal kill negotiation?

Funneling profits to the company that owns them?
The ESPN deal guarantees the UFC money. In return for that guarantee ESPN takes the lion's share of the PPV money. The only thing extra the UFC gets and can offer fighters is whatever they sell over that and fighters only get a few pennies per PPV sold. The UFC has no incentive to share.

Because of that guarantee the UFC doesn't need to negotiate anymore with fighters over pay as that leverage is gone.
 
What is Rizz your account too? Weird. How do you know he chose that? Do you have a link to an article?
Weird that you have an issue with me pointing out a fact to help the conversation. I posted the quote earlier in this thread.

https://mmajunkie.usatoday.com/2014...cracked-up-to-be-for-champ-demetrious-johnson
“I’ve talked to fighters in the past who’ve had pay-per-view points, and they’ll fight on pay-per-view, and they won’t reach their goal, so they won’t get the pay-per-view points,” Johnson (19-2-1 MMA, 7-1-1 UFC) told MMAjunkie Radio. “I know I’m not a big name like Anderson Silva or [Georges St-Pierre]. That’s why there are only a few guys that have that kind of thing.

“I’d rather take the money up front than wager a bet.”
 
The ESPN deal guarantees the UFC money. In return for that guarantee ESPN takes the lion's share of the PPV money. The only thing extra the UFC gets and can offer fighters is whatever they sell over that and fighters only get a few pennies per PPV sold. The UFC has no incentive to share.

Because of that guarantee the UFC doesn't need to negotiate anymore with fighters over pay as that leverage is gone.
The ufc has tv deals in territories all over the world. Russia deal expires this year. And the ufc is working towards their next deals. They can’t just underdeliver and say fuck it our money is guaranteed. Their franchise value is based on WAY more than just the current ESPN deal (they are 40% complete on a $1.5B deal).

And where did you see how much ESPN gets vs the UFC from PPV? I haven’t seen anything that details how much the ufc gets from PPV or subscriptions and what incentives they may have. Just that they get a license fee.

Ppv points are not pennies per ppv....
 
The ufc has tv deals in territories all over the world. Russia deal expires this year. And the ufc is working towards their next deals. They can’t just underdeliver and say fuck it our money is guaranteed. Their franchise value is based on WAY more than just the current ESPN deal (they are 40% complete on a $1.5B deal).

And where did you see how much ESPN gets vs the UFC from PPV? I haven’t seen anything that details how much the ufc gets from PPV or subscriptions and what incentives they may have. Just that they get a license fee.

Ppv points are not pennies per ppv....
The only fighters we have any numbers for were some of the most successful ones and the most well paid of their peers the company ever had. They made in the neighborhood of $1.5 to $2+ per PPV and it scaled up based on the #s sold. This was also from a time when fighters at the top were paid the most in the company history and had the most leverage. It seems unlikely that this practice continued when the fighters lost their leverage.

We know the UFC at the time shared somewhere around 18-22% of their take with fighters. By the time USADA came in this has gone down to around 18%. Roughly 2% is USADA and facilities making it 16% of actual money paid to fighters. That number appears to have shrunk to as low as 15% more recently for PPVs.

While it's technically possible some champions fighting under bigger named champions got some PPV points we don't really know how much. It seems unlikely they got the deals the bigger named ones did especially when we know some champs didn't get anything at all and we know the UFC always plays hardball. They have repeatedly had fighters under bid each other for title shots and supposedly that magic number is around 50k. I don't know how true that is though.

As for the ESPN deal that's public information. ESPN exclusively control the UFC's PPV.
 
The only fighters we have any numbers for were some of the most successful ones and the most well paid of their peers the company ever had. They made in the neighborhood of $1.5 to $2+ per PPV and it scaled up based on the #s sold. This was also from a time when fighters at the top were paid the most in the company history and had the most leverage. It seems unlikely that this practice continued when the fighters lost their leverage.

We know the UFC at the time shared somewhere around 18-22% of their take with fighters. By the time USADA came in this has gone down to around 18%. Roughly 2% is USADA and facilities making it 16% of actual money paid to fighters. That number appears to have shrunk to as low as 15% more recently for PPVs.

While it's technically possible some champions fighting under bigger named champions got some PPV points we don't really know how much. It seems unlikely they got the deals the bigger named ones did especially when we know some champs didn't get anything at all and we know the UFC always plays hardball. They have repeatedly had fighters under bid each other for title shots and supposedly that magic number is around 50k. I don't know how true that is though.

As for the ESPN deal that's public information. ESPN exclusively control the UFC's PPV.
Bigger names make more because they sell more ppv, not just because their $ per ppv is much higher. And some of the #’s we are aware of were alvarez and overeem. Not exactly ufc superstars.

I have never seen a magic # as you suggest. Recent disclosed payouts for title challengers:
Spencer - 125k against nunes
Gaethje - 350k against ferg for interim
Ferg - 500k against gaethje for interim
Romero - 350k against izzy
Colby - 500k vs usman
Thiago - 350k vs jones
Smith - 350k vs jones
Usman - 350k vs woodley
Gus- 500k vs jones
Even Yana Kunitskaya made 100k vs cyborg.
So what you heard doesn’t seem to possibly be correct.

What is public? There are no details of how the ufc shares on ppv or subscription revenue that I am aware of.
 
And where did you see how much ESPN gets vs the UFC from PPV? I haven’t seen anything that details how much the ufc gets from PPV or subscriptions and what incentives they may have. Just that they get a license fee.

Ppv points are not pennies per ppv....
The exact figures aren't known... but when the ESPN+ deal first came out, @FrankieNYC uncovered that
  • ESPN pays the UFC an average of 7 - 10 million per fight night. :eek:

  • the UFC would get a bulk payment for every UFC PPV.
  • ESPN could keep all PPV money UP TO A CERTAIN THREASHOLD.
  • Then after that threshold... ESPN & the UFC would then split the remainder of the PPV buys past that threshold.
What we don't know is neither what their guaranteed money is for PPV... or what that threshold is where they start sharing the PPV buys.

Having kept up with the PPV numbers through the years prior to ESPN, I recogniz that a moderately popular card will sell around tree fiddy. Very few stretch above that, & only a very very small number ever approach or pass a mill. So my educated guess is that tree fiddy is the point where they start splitting the PPV take. I couldn't imagine it being lower... but I also don't know what their baseline is either, so it's really all just guess work. We do know the things in the bullets above though for sure.

How all that pertains to fighter's PPV take is a mystery, but due to the publicly shown "Eddie Alvarez scale" he didn't start collecting PPV points till 200k buys. Mouse's PPV buys were typically under that. (just for reference.)
 
I guess in rare cases, but I don't think Joanna is getting PPV points on a Conor card lol wtf.

Why not? If she’s defending a title she gets ppv points.
Woodley brought to light that the reason he wasn't defending his title on a McGregor card is because McGregor demanded that Mac and maybe his opponent are the only one's who get a piece of that. So Woodley would not have gotten any PPV points on a Mac card... where as he was getting PPV points on any other card.

I'm not sure why that is... but perhaps the scale gets split between all those who get PPV?
 
@kflo
Here'z the Alvarez scale... in case you're interested.

· Less than 200k = No money
· 200k – 400k = $1/buy = $200k
· 400K – 600k = $2/buy = $400k for this tier – (600k total)
· 600k + = $2.50/buy

We're not sure how the money goes from there... but DC lifted the curtain a bit on what they were giving him.

2018, Oct 1 – DC sayz the amount of PPV money you get between 800k & 1.1 mill is big. Every 100k over 800k is another level.


(I added in the PPV buys to give his figures some reference.)
  • He eludes that he made 3 million vs Jones in their first fight (800k buys @ $90,000 disclosed)
  • …the 2nd fight he made 3.5 – 4 million (860K buys with a flat million disclosed)
  • ...but would’ve made 6 million at UFC 200 if he would’ve fought Jones & got his PPV cut on that Brock Card.

He’s also using the figure of 1.1 million buys to say that he would’ve made 6 million… so that’s a nice dollar figure we can stamp on our PPV buy estimates.
 
@kflo
Here'z the Alvarez scale... in case you're interested.

· Less than 200k = No money
· 200k – 400k = $1/buy = $200k
· 400K – 600k = $2/buy = $400k for this tier – (600k total)
· 600k + = $2.50/buy

We're not sure how the money goes from there... but DC lifted the curtain a bit on what they were giving him.

2018, Oct 1 – DC sayz the amount of PPV money you get between 800k & 1.1 mill is big. Every 100k over 800k is another level.


(I added in the PPV buys to give his figures some reference.)
  • He eludes that he made 3 million vs Jones in their first fight (800k buys @ $90,000 disclosed)
  • …the 2nd fight he made 3.5 – 4 million (860K buys with a flat million disclosed)
  • ...but would’ve made 6 million at UFC 200 if he would’ve fought Jones & got his PPV cut on that Brock Card.

He’s also using the figure of 1.1 million buys to say that he would’ve made 6 million… so that’s a nice dollar figure we can stamp on our PPV buy estimates.

Thx. I’ve seen the Alvarez figures. I believe 600+ was the top bracket for him, which makes some sense because if he was drawing into the next bracket, it likely wasn’t because of him. It’s the established draws that can negotiate that next scale. Overeem’s top tier looks to have been $2/buy (9 years ago now). I don’t think we have details on anyone since (thx for the DC video and summary!)
 
Bigger names make more because they sell more ppv, not just because their $ per ppv is much higher. And some of the #’s we are aware of were alvarez and overeem. Not exactly ufc superstars.

I have never seen a magic # as you suggest. Recent disclosed payouts for title challengers:
Spencer - 125k against nunes
Gaethje - 350k against ferg for interim
Ferg - 500k against gaethje for interim
Romero - 350k against izzy
Colby - 500k vs usman
Thiago - 350k vs jones
Smith - 350k vs jones
Usman - 350k vs woodley
Gus- 500k vs jones
Even Yana Kunitskaya made 100k vs cyborg.
So what you heard doesn’t seem to possibly be correct.

What is public? There are no details of how the ufc shares on ppv or subscription revenue that I am aware of.
Nobody knows what fighters are paid outside of court cases where the contract and payouts are made public. Everything else is rumor and/or estimate or a guess.

Every number you just cited? Estimate/guess.

My 50k comment? Rumor coming out of several camps including the 2nd DJ fight for Cejudo. Apparently Dana promised him a big payday and it never materialized which is why he quit. Once he got the title shot others commented that it wasn't the first time a title shot was given to someone making 50k for the opportunity and it was apparently one of those deals the UFC had with one or more Managers.

Is it true? Maybe maybe not. It's plausible based on the UFC's strong arm tactics from the court case that's going on. Maybe in another 20 years we might get a case that will tell us.
 
Back
Top