Fedor strengths and weaknesses and his skillset in the UFC today (Long Thread)

[dnmb]

Fedors grappling would work beautifully against guys like Lewis,Tuivasa,Volkov and Gane. None of these guys are great grapplers. Lewis got judo tossed to the moon by Blogoi who was fedors opponent in Sambo. Tuivasa got Lay and prayed by Spivak. Gane got lay and prayed by Ngannou. It's crazy to think Fedors grappling would be irrelevant against such opponents.

Indeed. Would be interesting to see how he would do against Velasquez or Cormier though

 

[The Last King]

Indeed. Would be interesting to see how he would do against Velasquez or Cormier though

I personally think Velasquez and Cormier would be tougher tests than anyone in the UFC today.

Fedor would have to knock them out IMO. Winning a decision over them or submitting them would be tough. Esp under UFC rules set.

 

[BFoe]

You keep using the same shitty examples, and keep insinuating that fighters can't lose in their prime. JDS and Cain were both top 10 and relevant until age 37. That doesn't help your argument whatsoever, little buddy.

I've been telling you all that individual peak performance is different than physical prime. This is at least twice that you've agreed with that. Thank you again for admitting you were wrong and that you're just being a defiant and delusional fanboi. Was easy.

Cain wasn’t ranked at age 37. He only had one fight at that age, and that was against Ngannou. Cain had been inactive for 3 years, it’s hard to even call him relevant. Maybe in name value and a “let’s see if this old, injury-ridden dude has anything at all left in the tank” sort of way.

JDS’s ranking says more about the UFC’s shitty rankings than anything else. They had him holding the #9 spot even after the Gane fight—when JDS had lost 4 straight, all by stoppage. Not that being ranked is necessarily an indicator of prime anyway—fuckin Aleksey Oleinik was ranked until 2020 FFS, when he was 43 years old. Fedor is top 5 in Bellator right now. We don’t think those guys are in their prime at that age, do we?

 

[BFoe]

I've just stated pure facts : there's not a single great fighter, no matter his sport losing in these conditions at the same time :

- Against a smaller fighter coming from a lower weight class
- Against a much older fighter
- Against a fighter that is not supposed to fight anymore due to his advanced age

If it's nonsense, then name me a single great fighter with a loss that meets these 3 criteria at the same time.

You won't find any

But but but GOAT

Hello. This right here is a guy named Tim Sylvia.

At UFC 68, he lost his UFC title to Randy Couture.

• Couture was coming up from LHW
• Couture was outweighed by 40.5 lbs
• Couture was 43 years old.

ROFL at

You won't find any

It took me like 12 seconds to think of an example.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

I personally think Velasquez and Cormier would be tougher tests than anyone in the UFC today.

Fedor would have to knock them out IMO. Winning a decision over them or submitting them would be tough. Esp under UFC rules set.

Yeah I think that does open up something of an unknown in terms of how the grappling might go, with someone like Gane I would eb fairly confident thats well in Fedor's favour but with Cain and DC its hard to say, I could see them taking him down but how do they deal with subs? not really something we saw tested a massive amount.

Francis does I think have an "upset" factor in his favour, I think even if Fedor matched up technically really well with him there would be more of a chance of an upset KO or maybe just ending up ontop for a short time and unloading with GnP.

 

[Fioretti]

You're so desperate and delusional that you've resorted to claiming Cain and JDS were still in their prime just because they were still "relevant" smh I didn't know being relevant still means an athlete is in their prime. I guess Jose Aldo and Stipe are still in their prime according to your delusional logic.

Incredible.

Clown world.

I said they were relevant until 37. JDS's losing streak started at 35. Cain didn't have a losing streak. Losing 1 or 2 fights doesn't mean you're out of prime.

How did werdum enter his prime at 33-36? Why did Jones at age 32 struggle against Dominick Reyes who's been KOd 3x in a row? Conor mcgregor started to lose fights when he turned 28

Werdum didn't "enter" his prime at 33-36. For fuck's sake, man. His individual peak performance just happened to align with the end of his physical prime. Regular exercise and supplements help with reversing the effects of aging. Jones didn't just get old at 32, he had a less than stellar night. Conor losing at 28 doesn't mean he got fucking old and knocked out of his prime. You're not this stupid, bro. What in the fuck? You're all over the place.

Cain wasn’t ranked at age 37. He only had one fight at that age, and that was against Ngannou. Cain had been inactive for 3 years, it’s hard to even call him relevant. Maybe in name value and a “let’s see if this old, injury-ridden dude has anything at all left in the tank” sort of way.

JDS’s ranking says more about the UFC’s shitty rankings than anything else. They had him holding the #9 spot even after the Gane fight—when JDS had lost 4 straight, all by stoppage. Not that being ranked is necessarily an indicator of prime anyway—fuckin Aleksey Oleinik was ranked until 2020 FFS, when he was 43 years old. Fedor is top 5 in Bellator right now. We don’t think those guys are in their prime at that age, do we?

Cain was relevant, just inactive. Is normal for him. JDS's losing streak started at 35. He was still relevant after 2 losses (37). Yes, the rankings don't necessarily tell the whole story, but the point is that neither guy got old and irrelevant at 33 as you all wish they did.

Stop pretending, boys. It's weird and creepy.

 

[BFoe]

I said they were relevant until 37. JDS's losing streak started at 35. Cain didn't have a losing streak. Losing 1 or 2 fights doesn't mean you're out of prime.



Werdum didn't "enter" his prime at 33-36. For fuck's sake, man. His individual peak performance just happened to align with the end of his physical prime. Regular exercise and supplements help with reversing the effects of aging. Jones didn't just get old at 32, he had a less than stellar night. Conor losing at 28 doesn't mean he got fucking old and knocked out of his prime. You're not this stupid, bro. What in the fuck? You're all over the place.



Cain was relevant, just inactive. Is normal for him. JDS's losing streak started at 35. He was still relevant after 2 losses (37). Yes, the rankings don't necessarily tell the whole story, but the point is that neither guy got old and irrelevant at 33 as you all wish they did.

Stop pretending, boys. It's weird and creepy.

Fabricio Werdum’s individual peak performance “just happened to align” with being busted for trenbolone.

What do you mean by “relevant”? I mean, we could say JDS was still “relevant” at age 33 because he got a TS against Stipe. But in reality, he was only on a 1-fight win streak, was 1-1 in his last 2 fights, 2-2 in his last 4, and 3-3 in his last 6. I can clearly recall being bummed that by the time we got to see Overeem vs JDS, both were on a decline (I’m a big fan of both, and had bought tickets to UFC 146 before Overeem pissed hot). And that was 2015, when JDS was 31 about to turn 32 I believe. Still fighting at a fairly high level, but certainly declining.

 

[Fioretti]

Fabricio Werdum’s individual peak performance “just happened to align” with being busted for trenbolone.

What do you mean by “relevant”? I mean, we could say JDS was still “relevant” at age 33 because he got a TS against Stipe. But in reality, he was only on a 1-fight win streak, was 1-1 in his last 2 fights, 2-2 in his last 4, and 3-3 in his last 6. I can clearly recall being bummed that by the time we got to see Overeem vs JDS, both were on a decline (I’m a big fan of both, and had bought tickets to UFC 146 before Overeem pissed hot). And that was 2015, when JDS was 31 about to turn 32 I believe. Still fighting at a fairly high level, but certainly declining.

Getting a title shot is still being relevant. Fuck, man. He lost twice to the champ he already beat, and once to Overeem. He went on a 3 fight win streak after losing his title shot to Stipe, and was still relevant at 35 (top 5) when he lost to Francis. Losing every other fight to the champ and an all time great doesn't mean he was declining physically. It means he was facing top competition in the HW division. That's why Fedro went 3-3 at age 33 too. Not because they started physically declining in their physical prime.

Yeah, Werdum got busted. They're all on some shit. Which actually prolongs the decline. For fuck's sake, bro. A loss doesn't equate to decline in physicality.

 

[MartinGibson86]

This post is so stupid I didn't even realize it was an argument.

So being active = in prime?

JFC man some very creative trolling

No....being active TODAY means he wasnt past prime 12 fucking years ago...when he was younger than Figgy ffs

 

[MartinGibson86]

The UFC shills don't wanna admit JDS and Cain declined early 30s

JDS was 35 and beat Lewis and Tai.


Cain had multiple well documented surgeries and still only lost to GOAT candidates


Fedor hasnt had a qualiry win since AA

 

[MartinGibson86]

How did werdum enter his prime at 33-36? Why did Jones at age 32 struggle against Dominick Reyes who's been KOd 3x in a row? Conor mcgregor started to lose fights when he turned 28

Jones has fought exclusivelt in TITLE fights since he was 23.

Fedor debuted at 23...then fought 12 limited contact fights, Zulu. HMC, Lindland, Nagata, Ogawa, etc

 

[MartinGibson86]

Indeed. Would be interesting to see how he would do against Velasquez or Cormier though

He got sidemounted twice and nearly keylocked by Mark Hunt.


DC and Cain both fought Bigfoot for reference.

 

[Chillez]

Fedor is the one true GOAT of MMA. The most well rounded and complete fighter in history.

 

[MartinGibson86]

Fedor is the one true GOAT of MMA. The most well rounded and complete fighter in history.

who got sidemounted twiceby Mark Hunt

 

[MartinGibson86]

Hello. This right here is a guy named Tim Sylvia.
View attachment 956591
At UFC 68, he lost his UFC title to Randy Couture.

• Couture was coming up from LHW
• Couture was outweighed by 40.5 lbs
• Couture was 43 years old.

ROFL at

It took me like 12 seconds to think of an example.

Is Sylvia on anyone's ATG list?


Decent example tho

PrimeSylvia loseseveryone currently in the top 10.


Fedor cultists think he armbars Francis

 

[The Last King]

JDS was 35 and beat Lewis and Tai.

Cain had multiple well documented surgeries and still only lost to GOAT candidates

Fedor hasnt had a qualiry win since AA

Lewis and Tuivasa are bummy brawlers. Just because JDS beat them at 35 doesn't mean he was in his prime at the time you desperado shill lmaaooo

Jones has fought exclusivelt in TITLE fights since he was 23.

Fedor debuted at 23...then fought 12 limited contact fights, Zulu. HMC, Lindland, Nagata, Ogawa, etc

"Limited contact" where fighters punched and kicked eachother in the head at full contact and wrestled and grappled at full intensity. Couch dwellers don't know this, but such full contact fighting can cause injuries. You can break bones, get KOD and tear ligaments the same in those fights just like you can in UFC rules fights.

He got sidemounted twice and nearly keylocked by Mark Hunt.


DC and Cain both fought Bigfoot for reference.

GSP tapped to strikes to journeyman LW Matt Serra. Anderson got mopped up by sub .500 Takase. Ngannou lost to an unknown can.

These things happen in fights. Smh.

 

[MartinGibson86]

Lewis and Tuivasa are bummy brawlers. Just because JDS beat them at 35 doesn't mean he was in his prime at the time you desperado shill lmaaooo



"Limited contact" where fighters punched and kicked eachother in the head at full contact and wrestled and grappled at full intensity. Couch dwellers don't know this, but such full contact fighting can cause injuries. You can break bones, get KOD and tear ligaments the same in those fights just like you can in UFC rules fights.



GSP tapped to strikes to journeyman LW Matt Serra. Anderson got mopped up by sub .500 Takase. Ngannou lost to an unknown can.

These things happen in fights. I dont understand why couch dwelling saturated fat guzzling posters on sherdog don't understand this. Smh..

Every loss is covered...every win is elite

 

[BFoe]

Getting a title shot is still being relevant. Fuck, man. He lost twice to the champ he already beat, and once to Overeem. He went on a 3 fight win streak after losing his title shot to Stipe, and was still relevant at 35 (top 5) when he lost to Francis. Losing every other fight to the champ and an all time great doesn't mean he was declining physically. It means he was facing top competition in the HW division. That's why Fedro went 3-3 at age 33 too. Not because they started physically declining in their physical prime.

Yeah, Werdum got busted. They're all on some shit. Which actually prolongs the decline. For fuck's sake, bro. A loss doesn't equate to decline in physicality.

Dan Henderson got a title shot against Bisping, I certainly wouldn’t call him relevant at that time.
And JDS “faced top competition in the HW division” for years without alternating wins and losses every other fight. You know this. You bring it up all the time. A loss doesn’t equate to being out of prime, but declining out of prime certainly can be the cause of losses.

I’ve told you a gazillion times that your “Fedor lost because he fought good competition in a row” argument makes no sense. This 3-3 run you are referencing took place over a nearly 3 year period. In roughly the same period between 2002-2005, Fedor fought Schilt, Herring, Nog 3x, Coleman, Randleman, and Cro Cop, plus decent dudes like Fujita, Ogawa, Goodridge, and TK, plus not-so-good guys like Valavicius and Yuji Nagata— and he won all those fights (except for the accidental headbutt NC in the 2nd Nog fight). He was far more active, and fought more good opponents in the same period of time but somehow he lost in Strikeforce (which included two more PRIDE guys in Werdum and Hendo) because they were in a row??

That makes no sense. Isn’t it more likely that Fedor lost because he was older, accumulating injuries (he was injured after both the Sylvia fight and Rogers fight), and declining? Of course it is. You know it is.
I know you’re an Anderson Silva guy and Fedor’s Eternal GOATness makes you feel feelings you’re uncomfortable with, but you gotta come up with something better than that.

Is Sylvia on anyone's ATG list?


Decent example tho

PrimeSylvia loseseveryone currently in the top 10.


Fedor cultists think he armbars Francis

The dude asked for a “great fighter.” Sylvia is a 2-time UFC champ who set a record at the time for UFC HW title defenses. I certainly think he qualifies.
Although, the criteria that dude set up is goofy anyway—he characterized Hendo as someone “who should not be fighting anymore due to advanced age.” But Hendo was on TRT at the time and wasn’t fighting like someone at an advanced age at all. No one was calling on him to retire then. He had his legendary war with Shogun at UFC 139 in the very next fight. After that he lost a very close split to Lyoto, and then stopped TRT. And then he looked old.

I could see saying that Sylvia would struggle with the top 5 today, but the whole top 10? I think he handles Tai, Lewis, and Tybura, probably Volkov too just because of he style matchup. Maybe Rozenstruik too. A year ago when Daukaus and Abdurakhimov were in the top 10, he handles them too of course.

 

[Yellowcrab]

Hello. This right here is a guy named Tim Sylvia.
View attachment 956591
At UFC 68, he lost his UFC title to Randy Couture.

• Couture was coming up from LHW
• Couture was outweighed by 40.5 lbs
• Couture was 43 years old.

ROFL at

It took me like 12 seconds to think of an example.

I said a great fighter



Also he lost by decision and not by TKO in the first round

 

[Midget Boxer]

Werdum didn't "enter" his prime at 33-36. For fuck's sake, man. His individual peak performance just happened to align with the end of his physical prime

Then what did he enter? Those were his best years and won the title. "Physical prime" doesn't mean anything. Werdum striking and iq improved

Jones didn't just get old at 32, he had a less than stellar night. Conor losing at 28 doesn't mean he got fucking old and knocked out of his prime. You're not this stupid, bro

Conor was undefeated right up until 28. Then he started losing fights. Got finished by a guy twice he easily.beat in his younger years

Jones robbed Reyes, barely beat Santos and looked bad against Anthony Smith. He too forgot how to wrestle.

FFS glover made easy work of anthony Smith and Santos

So age isnt everything.