International "Everything is fine" propaganda speech interrupted twice due to power outages

[ebe9]

Which countries have offered Maduro asylum?

Sanders and AOC I heard have offered to let him stay at their homes.

 

[ebe9]

Blows my mind that there are still people in 1st world countries that don't think socialism is a giant pile of shit.

Oh like some people in these forums lmao.

 

[Chest Rockwell]

Blows my mind that there are still people in 1st world countries that don't think socialism is a giant pile of shit.

Except for the fact that 9 of the 10 countries with the highest quality of life, are, well, socialist.
We can stop comparing third world shithole banana socialism to first world socialism any time.

 

[MilesAbove]

Except for the fact that 9 of the 10 countries with the highest quality of life, are, well, socialist.
We can stop comparing third world shithole banana socialism to first world socialism any time.

That's not fair because we haven't figured out how to arm revolutionaries and start a CIA coupe in those 9 countries We'll get'm sooner or later. Corporations have deep pockets.

 

[Rod1]

Except for the fact that 9 of the 10 countries with the highest quality of life, are, well, socialist.
We can stop comparing third world shithole banana socialism to first world socialism any time.

There is no such thing as first world socialism dont be silly.

 

[MilesAbove]

There is no such thing as first world socialism dont be silly.

You do realize that "first-world" came from the separation of powers via the Cold War. First is Capitalism and Second is Communism. Third was everyone outside of that.

So technically you're correct. But you're also using an old propagandist concept that has worked wonders on society. It would literally be impossible for a socialist country to be first-world. But a hybrid socialist state with capitalist principles..... plenty of those are "first world".

 

[Rematch]

Except for the fact that 9 of the 10 countries with the highest quality of life, are, well, socialist.
We can stop comparing third world shithole banana socialism to first world socialism any time.

What are these 9 countries where the state controls the means of production? Oh, they merely have a lot of social programs but the means of production is private. Well then, that doesn't make them socialist countries, now does it?

 

[Rematch]

You do realize that "first-world" came from the separation of powers via the Cold War. First is Capitalism and Second is Communism. Third was everyone outside of that.

So technically you're correct. But you're also using an old propagandist concept that has worked wonders on society. It would literally be impossible for a socialist country to be first-world. But a hybrid socialist state with capitalist principles..... plenty of those are "first world".

Which of those countries that you are claiming to be socialist has it where the means of production is owned by the state? Not one. Therefore, not real socialism.

 

[Rod1]

You do realize that "first-world" came from the separation of powers via the Cold War. First is Capitalism and Second is Communism. Third was everyone outside of that.

So technically you're correct. But you're also using an old propagandist concept that has worked wonders on society. It would literally be impossible for a socialist country to be first-world. But a hybrid socialist state with capitalist principles..... plenty of those are "first world".

Such as?

 

[MilesAbove]

Such as?

Denmark, New Zealand, Norway, Finland etc...

Now I know what you're about to say: "Those aren't socialist, you big dummy!" and to that I would say: Then why every time we talk about implementing items like their welfare systems and free education/health, the response is "We are not a socialist country"? You can't have it both ways. Either they are states with socialist ideals that hold some capitalist features, or we should talk about implementing some of their systems.

I'm cool with either. So your choice. (6am here so we'll just have to pick this up tomorrow)

 

[Rod1]

Denmark, New Zealand, Norway, Finland etc...

Now I know what you're about to say: "Those aren't socialist, you big dummy!" and to that I would say: Then why every time we talk about implementing items like their welfare systems and free education/health, the response is "We are not a socialist country"? You can't have it both ways. Either they are states with socialist ideals that hold some capitalist features, or we should talk about implementing some of their systems.

I'm cool with either. So your choice. (6am here so we'll just have to pick this up tomorrow)

Maybe you are confusing me with other people, welfare paid via taxes isn't socialism.

Socialism as defined by the Oxford dictionary is

A political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Since these countries you mentioned allow for the accumulation of capital, private property, the exchange of goods and services with rates set up by market forces and the free movement of capital (and labor in the case of single market EU countries), these cant be said to be socialist.

Socialism is a command economy in which the ownership is collective (or at least nominally collective).

 

[Cuzcatlan]

Well the CIA missed him on the assassination attempt.

They are keeping up the pressure. Our country shouldn't apply sanctions that make the daily lives of regular people miserable. It's a bitch move. Immoral. Evil. Wrong.

Lol. CIA would have killed him with a missile from a predator drone.
I won't be surprised if he set it up himself. So he can go with it's all a CIA plan to get him out and the protest are CIA control. They where so far away to make sure he was safe from any real danger.

 

[ebe9]

I hate socialism and all it’s lies.

 

[SRN]

The American imperialists and the Brazilian fascists are doing everything they can to make Maduro look bad, it's not working. Democracy will prevail! Viva la Republica Bolivariana de Venezuela! Viva Maduro's gold. Viva!

 

[loyalyolayal]

All ideological positions aside, this sort of situation is frustratingly amateurish. Small, impoverished, rural communities in Northern Canada are able to put forward more competent efforts than this.

Ideology here is important. Communism fosters laziness.

 

[MilesAbove]

Ideology here is important. Communism fosters laziness.

Lazy people foster laziness. There are lazy people no matter what you do outside of dictatorship, and even then the upper-class becomes lazy. Look at every possible system and you will find lazy people, as it sits outside the purview of social structure.

I hate socialism and all it’s lies.

See, a lazy person. He surely knows it's "its" but didn't take the time to check.

Maybe you are confusing me with other people, welfare paid via taxes isn't socialism.

Socialism as defined by the Oxford dictionary is

A political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

Since these countries you mentioned allow for the accumulation of capital, private property, the exchange of goods and services with rates set up by market forces and the free movement of capital (and labor in the case of single market EU countries), these cant be said to be socialist.

Socialism is a command economy in which the ownership is collective (or at least nominally collective).

And literally is defined by the dictionary as being either literal or not literal. We didn't move forward in the discussion. Socialist principles and Capitalist principles lie within each nation. Which is the earlier point, that socialism is no worse than capitalist, and both should be implemented in systems.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Except for the fact that 9 of the 10 countries with the highest quality of life, are, well, socialist.
We can stop comparing third world shithole banana socialism to first world socialism any time.

Which country has a socialist economy out of those your mentioned? I will give you q clue, none.

Socialist my ass, one thing is to be called social democrat, which Pregonas a strong state presence in some areas, like health and education, but it’s economy is based on free market.

 

[Cuauhtemoc]

Denmark, New Zealand, Norway, Finland etc...

Now I know what you're about to say: "Those aren't socialist, you big dummy!" and to that I would say: Then why every time we talk about implementing items like their welfare systems and free education/health, the response is "We are not a socialist country"? You can't have it both ways. Either they are states with socialist ideals that hold some capitalist features, or we should talk about implementing some of their systems.

I'm cool with either. So your choice. (6am here so we'll just have to pick this up tomorrow)

He is talking about Marxist socialism, not european social-democracy, which can also be called socialism but is something different. The basis of marxist socialism is the abolition of private property, not high taxes to pay for welfare.
However, I want to add something. It seems that deep down many people in the liberal western left, although they're not marxist socialists still harbor some sympathy for them. They would never want to live in Cuba, Venezuela, or the former Soviet Union, but they think that they are doing something noble.
You see it a lot with American leftists that support Castro's Cuba vs actual Cubans that fled Cuba and hate Castro.

 

[Rod1]

Lazy people foster laziness. There are lazy people no matter what you do outside of dictatorship, and even then the upper-class becomes lazy. Look at every possible system and you will find lazy people, as it sits outside the purview of social structure.

There is no such thing as laziness, only lack of motivation.

If there is something that you wouldn't do on your own, but you would if someone gave you 1 million dollars, then you aren't lazy, you are simply unmotivated.

And literally is defined by the dictionary as being either literal or not literal. We didn't move forward in the discussion. Socialist principles and Capitalist principles lie within each nation. Which is the earlier point, that socialism is no worse than capitalist, and both should be implemented in systems.

We are talking about economy, so we are clearly going to use the economic model definition of the world.

All first world nations are market economies, period.

 

[Rod1]

He is talking about Marxist socialism, not european social-democracy, which can also be called socialism but is something different. The basis of marxist socialism is the abolition of private property, not high taxes to pay for welfare.
However, I want to add something. It seems that deep down many people in the liberal western left, although they're not marxist socialists still harbor some sympathy for them. They would never want to live in Cuba, Venezuela, or the former Soviet Union, but they think that they are doing something noble.
You see it a lot with American leftists that support Castro's Cuba vs actual Cubans that fled Cuba and hate Castro.

Kind of how people give far better diets to their dogs than to themselves, people who think Castro's Cuba is good are probably racist deep down, they simply see Latinos as not real humans like them.