Do you get mad when successive games nerf older enemy types?

[HHJ]

Like in DOOM 2016 the Hell Knights were a huge thorn in your side, totally relentless. You were in for a fucking battle whenever these giants burst onto the stage to take it to you.

But in DOOM ETERNAL they just dont got that same danger to them, they are much easier to dispatch, and they just made some of the newer enemies take their place on the totem pole.

Also the Hell Knights in DOOM ETERNAL aint got no eyes which.. i guess kinda makes em scarier.


Anyway im sure theres tons of other games that are like this, What are your thoughts?

 

[ssBaldy]

Like in DOOM 2016 the Hell Knights were a huge thorn in your side, totally relentless. You were in for a fucking battle whenever these giants burst onto the stage to take it to you.

But in DOOM ETERNAL they just dont got that same danger to them, they are much easier to dispatch, and they just made some of the newer enemies take their place on the totem pole.

Also the Hell Knights in DOOM ETERNAL aint got no eyes which.. i guess kinda makes em scarier.


Anyway im sure theres tons of other games that are like this, What are your thoughts?

I feel the Slayer became deadlier in Eternal more than anything else.

Not the exact nerf, but I had mixed feelings with ghoul evolution during the three Witcher games. I like the W3 ones the most yet I got used to them being bipedal in the first one.

 

[Valhoven]

This also doesn’t have to happen successively.

As a production shortcut, games of (usually smaller) developer teams flip an in-game boss as a later map/level underboss. Moveset and skin are same but with HP and DMG nerf, for example.

Team Ninja aren’t small but this technique was cornerstone in both Nioh titles.

From a player perspective, I hate it because it diminishes the pucker factor and iconicity of a boss’ singular instance in a game.

It’s cool to have memories, for example, of this one boss you couldn’t best for ages but then did and finally got to see whatever new land, level, treasure he was gatekeeping so heartily. If I see that same cat with half the health just freeroaming it a couple hours later, I know they did him dirty like…

 

[KaNesDeath]

Like in DOOM 2016 the Hell Knights were a huge thorn in your side, totally relentless. You were in for a fucking battle whenever these giants burst onto the stage to take it to you.

But in DOOM ETERNAL they just dont got that same danger to them, they are much easier to dispatch, and they just made some of the newer enemies take their place on the totem pole.

Problem is when you release something that is initially challenging the playerbase itself evolves over time. Only so much can be done to the original enemy until its a completely different. Why its best to introduce such mechanics to a new enemy type.

 

[HHJ]

Problem is when you release something that is initially challenging the playerbase itself evolves over time. Only so much can be done to the original enemy until its a completely different. Why its best to introduce such mechanics to a new enemy type.

Of course. Sometimes it happens naturally. The Merauder used to be super difficult in ETERNAL since it was an enemy that broke the rules of how the game was played and was really tough to deal with, especially when having to fight of hordes of others at the same time, but gamers "got gud" and figured out how to take him out pretty easy over time.

 

[TrueBias]

Like in DOOM 2016 the Hell Knights were a huge thorn in your side, totally relentless. You were in for a fucking battle whenever these giants burst onto the stage to take it to you.

But in DOOM ETERNAL they just dont got that same danger to them, they are much easier to dispatch, and they just made some of the newer enemies take their place on the totem pole.

Also the Hell Knights in DOOM ETERNAL aint got no eyes which.. i guess kinda makes em scarier.


Anyway im sure theres tons of other games that are like this, What are your thoughts?

I forget the guy, but hes in Doom Eternal, moves fast, and has an axe that I think shoots red shit at you.

It was not fun whatsoever fighting him.

Plaything thru again a year ago, i got to him, and prepared to break things again. Then noticed it was too easy.

I didnt love that.

 

[HHJ]

I forget the guy, but hes in Doom Eternal, moves fast, and has an axe that I think shoots red shit at you.

It was not fun whatsoever fighting him.

Plaything thru again a year ago, i got to him, and prepared to break things again. Then noticed it was too easy.

I didnt love that.

That is the Merauder. One of the most controversial enemies in gaming history hahahah

HERE IS WHERE ALL FUN ENDS, SLAYER

 

[TrueBias]

That is the Merauder. One of the most controversial enemies in gaming history hahahah

HERE IS WHERE ALL FUN ENDS, SLAYER

That's the jerkoff alright. You end up fighting other fuckers while he spawns in later. Cant remember if that happened in the first version.

The gun switching faster ability and some shotgun shit helped, but I hated wasting components for those upgrades.

In fact, doom, doom eternal, and the 2 god of wars end up having lousy upgrades. Kills replay value.

 

[HHJ]

That's the jerkoff alright. You end up fighting other fuckers while he spawns in later. Cant remember if that happened in the first version.

The gun switching faster ability and some shotgun shit helped, but I hated wasting components for those upgrades.

In fact, doom, doom eternal, and the 2 god of wars end up having lousy upgrades. Kills replay value.

You fight him alone, and later in the game he shows up from time to time while you have to fight twenty dudes. Even sometimes when an Arch Vile is around. That's when he's hardest. Trying to deal with him and other enemies at the same time.

There's times where if you have the BFG you can just waste him if you dont wanna bother.

Those two DLC they added after, are much harder than the regular game. This game is also much harder than 2016. So its like Damn. You wonder what the new game is gonna be like.

I like how melee intensive it looks. The brutality looks like its going up a bit for sure. Hard to imagine lol

 

[NoSmilez]

I think they have to or else people will write reviews about how the game isn't improving.

 

[HHJ]

I think they have to or else people will write reviews about how the game isn't improving.

yeah but....this is really about a particular thing. Like, it makes sense, but you STILL dont have to like it, about this particular enemy.

 

[NoSmilez]

yeah but....this is really about a particular thing. Like, it makes sense, but you STILL dont have to like it, about this particular enemy.

They do this for a few series. It’s like the big boss becomes a minor inconvenience later on. It’s the same with yellow arrows

 

[mixmastermo]

To TS, yea that's dumb. What's even dumber, IMO is when you play the sequel to a game where you leveled up your character, only to find out you are starting from scratch in the sequel, even though you are playing AS THE SAME CHARACTER.

Metroid- Samus
GOW- Kratos
Horizon- Aloy
etc.

It's like your character didn't learn anything in the previous game, at all.

 

[HHJ]

To TS, yea that's dumb. What's even dumber, IMO is when you play the sequel to a game where you leveled up your character, only to find out you are starting from scratch in the sequel, even though you are playing AS THE SAME CHARACTER.

Metroid- Samus
GOW- Kratos
Horizon- Aloy
etc.

It's like your character didn't learn anything in the previous game, at all.

This is alot more common. Most times this is the case, so it doesnt stand out, really.

 

[ssBaldy]

This is alot more common. Most times this is the case, so it doesnt stand out, really.

Still dumb though.
I remember playing an indie RPG where your character is a hardened, experienced mercenary and the only 2 ways to upgrade him are better equipment and PEDs.

 

[The Clark]

On the topic of Doom, they sure nerfed the shield guys from Doom 2016 to Doom Eternal. That one made me sad.

 

[Bacco]

Not 100% related since is more lore wise, but hate the opposite, when SH is too conservative toward old enemies legacy

Street Fighter have huge problem with this, wish we can get new Final Bosses that bring new level challenges, but they've been stuck for years keeping Akuma/M.Bison as ultimate baddies

Every time new boss like figure is introduced they used old bosses to make him look like a bitch or they made it irrelevant

SF3 - Gill got pushed out of main events
SF4 - Seth got bitchslapped by Bison
SF5 - Necalli got bitchslapped by Bison
SF6 - JP declares himself inferior to Bison

Capcom is hostage of fanbase that will cry at anything new