Deconstructing MMA Myths... [Part 24] - Carlson´s 'Silence'...

[gono btw]

This was good.


Where are the other parts?

The Decons threads:

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...-groovy-paradox.3893619/page-3#post-148236621
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...-fights-start-from-standing-position.3808087/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-5-the-true-evolution-of-mma.3807975/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...tion-of-submission-defence-grappling.3803333/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-3-the-evolution-of-werdum´s-career.3831261/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-2-hunto´s-atomicbutt-drop.3735841/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-1-hoyce-his-gi-ufc-1.3734725/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...skill-set-mma-evolution-the-hws-case.3815393/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...hs-part-8-mma-cans-the-unsung-heroes.3822123/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...-part-9-bjj-during-the-vale-tudo-era.3826197/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-10-b4-after-usada.3826221/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-11-fighters´evolution.3827221/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...t-mma-evolution-the-lhw-golden-era-s.3828473/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-13-khabib´s-eastern-european-career.3830345/#post-144836697
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-14-mousasi-flukes.3836617/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...-the-anatomy-of-a-fighter-khabib-1-2.3844333/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...-the-anatomy-of-a-fighter-khabib-2-2.3844507/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-16-the-2-hw-goats.3851935/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-17-askren´s-undefeated-record.3855315/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-18-the-genesis-of-ufc-1´s-roster.3855847/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...-evolution-the-mw-transitional-era-s.3858851/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-20-judges-mma-ideology.3862173/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-21-the-disorganized-ww-div.3873877/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/d...part-22-the-avenged-losses-narrative.3874257/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-23-cross-training-in-mma´s-dark-ages.3874607/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-24-carlson´s-silence.3879035/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/deconstructing-mma-myths-part-25-the-wild-wild-west.3886295/


I have another series rollin´ in the Worldwide, about 'extraordinary' moments in NHB/Vale Tudo history:

http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-death-master-stormed-into-the-vale-tudo-scene.3882431/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-igor-showed-his-genuine-side.3821765/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-couture-got-played-by-ilyukhin.3866571/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/t...hook-hands-then-gave-ilyukhin-a-hand.3864713/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-yvel-bit-barkalaev-volk-han-slapped-the-ref.3863115/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/t...rbick-b4-coning-mayweather-this-week.3863593/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-tamura-forgot-to-shake-hands-with-yamamoto.3863509/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-marco-huas-went-full-babalu-toquinho.3852863/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-scary-side-of-the-russian-nhb-scene.3853211/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-paulson-got-kimo-ed-badly.3831975/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-paulson-had-to-tap-with-his-foot-on-ronin´s-head.3830825/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-rei-zulu-machida-ed-sergio-batarelli.3828423/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/20-years-ago.3816669/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/t...nga-tap-several-times.3871109/#post-146958711
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-oleg-forgot-about-the-special-rule.3853539/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-amar-suloev-mightymoused-oganov.3871769/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-pelé-settled-the-score-in-the-ring.3812249/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-sergei-akinin-launched-a-new-mma-gear.3872407/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-drago-was-happy-wand-wasnt-cornerin´-dipp.3873849/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-coleman-went-full-roid-rage-in-brazil.3874387/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-kurmanov-the-boxer-submitted-ahmedov-the-jj.3874565/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-saad-muhammad-promised-a-ko-against-tamura.3875713/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-leg-lock-master-met-manos-de-piedra.3876141/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/t...-katsumi-usuta-to-tap-against-wallid.3877671/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-little-volk-forgot-to-grapple-in-rings.3878575/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-tank-inspired-coleman.3879835/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-takeo-yano-george-gracie-both-went-lights-out.3881991/
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-nobody-knew-if-sauer-had-tapped-or-not.3886109/
https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/the-day-the-ref-gave-the-victory-to-bjj-fearing-a-riot.3894033/

 

[gono btw]

I remember reading on the UG and in a magazine that Vitor actually fractured both hands from punching the top of Saku’s head.
One fracture being severe, the other being mild.

He did the same buttscoot drop vs Jones as the fight progressed and his situation became hopeless.

He started both fights intensely, on a good day he could have possibly caught both of them.

Hard to believe tbh...

Back then, when people were mockin´his performance, he started spittin´ a bunch of excuses, said nuthin´ about the 2nd hand...

Now if ya look at the flurry, he only used his right hand 4 times (since SAKU G. was securin´ it during the kimura attempt, then holdin´it while he was still on his knees): 3 missed shots, and a weak one that barely landed...

 

[Ideanudge]

Eh, the footage speaks for itself what techniques and in what form they threw them. The amount of text doesn't equate with sound logical quality and proof.

 

[gono btw]

Eh, the footage speaks for itself what techniques and in what form they threw them. The amount of text doesn't equate with sound logical quality and proof.

Jus´avoid these Decons threads, you´re not really useful here.

 

[nhbfan8080]

Warning: TLDR here.

...................
Today :
Carlson´s 'Silence'...during the SAKU G. vs Vitor Gracie fight.

> Myth 1: This fight was a work.
> Myth 2: Vitor Gracie was 'well-rounded'.
> Myth 3: SAKU G. was one-dimensional and had no striking.
..................

No fukin way was that match a work. Vitor tried to KO Sakuraba early on and broke his hand. He underestimated Sakuraba and paid for it. I agree that Carlson liked Vitor alot, there were rumors about Vitor being adopted as a Gracie back then.

 

[HumanSandwich]

That wasn't long enough. Didn't read. I like my nut-busted myths to be dissertation length. So, in short: tsdr

 

[gono btw]

That wasn't long enough. Didn't read. I like my nut-busted myths to be dissertation length. So, in short: tsdr

 

[Goodfella86]

Excellent thread. That was a great read and very informative.

 

[HumanSandwich]

Dear ts,
I decided to read it. It's difficult for me to say much about it's accuracy since I don't know the fight or the context other than what you posted. But I enjoyed it. The only two issues I had we're 1: in busting myth one, you state that Vitor lost position because if mindset, not skill set. But later you undeine the credibility of his grappling credentials and even skills. While this doesn't damage the overall argumsnt that the fight was not a work, it is still a pretty big imternal contradoctoon. 2: I was confused by the names appearing as "saku g" and "Vitor Gracie" until well into the post

Worth the read fo sho

 

[Vil7]

 

[gono btw]

Dear ts,
I decided to read it. It's difficult for me to say much about it's accuracy since I don't know the fight or the context other than what you posted. But I enjoyed it. The only two issues I had we're 1: in busting myth one, you state that Vitor lost position because if mindset, not skill set. But later you undeine the credibility of his grappling credentials and even skills. While this doesn't damage the overall argumsnt that the fight was not a work, it is still a pretty big imternal contradoctoon. 2: I was confused by the names appearing as "saku g" and "Vitor Gracie" until well into the post

Worth the read fo sho

What he actually lost was the opportunity to capitalize on this dominant position and transition to a better one/potential threatenin´ sub... like @ Pride 13, 30 months later (after he split with Carlson, Vitor went to BTT and started to rebuild his game.), he got the same dominant position against Bobby Southworth, and the outcome was different this time (see the gif in the OP).

SAKU G. is SAKU GOAT.

 

[gono btw]

No fukin way was that match a work. Vitor tried to KO Sakuraba early on and broke his hand. He underestimated Sakuraba and paid for it. I agree that Carlson liked Vitor alot, there were rumors about Vitor being adopted as a Gracie back then.

Dear ts,
I decided to read it. It's difficult for me to say much about it's accuracy since I don't know the fight or the context other than what you posted. But I enjoyed it. The only two issues I had we're 1: in busting myth one, you state that Vitor lost position because if mindset, not skill set. But later you undeine the credibility of his grappling credentials and even skills. While this doesn't damage the overall argumsnt that the fight was not a work, it is still a pretty big imternal contradoctoon. 2: I was confused by the names appearing as "saku g" and "Vitor Gracie" until well into the post

Worth the read fo sho

Was an ol´comical situation back then...was jus´ b4 his 1st fight vs Hess, @ SuperBrawl 2, Carlson wanted to promote him as Vitor Gracie, but Helson (he had his BJJ base there in Hawaii) talked him out of it...

 

[gono btw]

Excellent thread. That was a great read and very informative.

 

[gono btw]

 

[Vil7]

I love these old school threads.

 

[gono btw]

I love these old school threads.

 

[gono btw]

@mods you should make a sticky with all of Gono's MMA story lessons. This is fucking gold, and it is drowned out in all the shit(Connor, Jones Doping, whatever). This is damn quality content.

Sadly, these Decons threads have many haters, especially in the Heavies...
A good 30% of the people here (No Rush fanbase) want Gono´s head...

It is what it is.

 

[Oddmonster]

View attachment 505043

Sadly, these Decons threads have many haters, especially in the Heavies...
A good 30% of the people here (No Rush fanbase) want Gono´s head...

It is what it is.

View attachment 505045

Of course - Casuals, Just bleeders, and in general casual fans apparently, have a hard time reading anything that is longer then a paragraph. And many of them act like girls do with the Kardashians - If there is no drama, there is no interest.

Just know you are appreciated.

 

[gono btw]

Of course - Casuals, Just bleeders, and in general casual fans apparently, have a hard time reading anything that is longer then a paragraph. And many of them act like girls do with the Kardashians - If there is no drama, there is no interest.

Just know you are appreciated.

Im lucky when they read at least the...title...
These threads are more welcomed in the Worlwide though...

 

[Oddmonster]

View attachment 505065


Im lucky when they read at least the...title...
These threads are more welcomed in the Worlwide though...

I guess because people, who also watch other MMA orgs, are MMA fans and not just fans of UFC.

 

[gono btw]

I guess because people, who also watch other MMA orgs, are MMA fans and not just fans of UFC.

More maturity, patience in the Worldwide..

Most haters who come here and dismiss these Decons, are basically Gono haters.