Couture vs Henderson

[Local Plata]

Randy was better in every way. Luckily for Dan he had that TRT resurgence, so his resume looks better if you just take all of his bullshit decision wins at face value, so most likely people will just compare wikipedia and proclaim Dan superior, especially as time goes on.

 

[Sweater of AV]

Randy was better in every way. Luckily for Dan he had that TRT resurgence, so his resume looks better if you just take all of his bullshit decision wins at face value, so most likely people will just compare wikipedia and proclaim Dan superior, especially as time goes on.

I don’t even know where to begin with this...I’m guessing you’re dumb enough to take “The Natural” at face value.

 

[Dr. Rose]

But to be fair, Hendo's two Pride wins as a champ were Vitor and Wand. Randy also beat Vitor twice and lost once due to a fluke. And I'd pick Randy to beat Wand just like Tito did....as Randy was a slightly better version of Tito for the most part who could probably keep Wand grounded most of the time.

If Hendo beat guys like Rampage (lost to him later in the UFC), Arona, Shogun, etc. in their Pride glory days and cleaned out that weight class, I'd agree with you, though.

I love Hendo, but he never defended either of his PRIDE belts. Vitor was before he won the belt from Wand.

 

[HHJ]

Couture's career is abnormal,and thus difficult to compare to other people. He def is more decorated.

 

[7 others]

Henderson of course. Though he had some controversial decision wins but bagging victories against Edgar, Cerrone, Masvidal, Thompson and Melendez are insane

 

[NoSmilez]

It’s probably Randy. They both had a lot of undeserved title shots but Randy made it work for him. Randy is also fun to watch because he had to outwork his opponents. Hendo spammed inside low kick and overhand right all day.

 

[mkt]

Disregarding much of that which is nonsense, no it’s not that close.

Fedor, Big Nog, Shogun x2, Wandy, Vitor, Newton, Bisping, Franklin, Busta x2, Misaki, Yvel, Babalu x2, Feijao, Palhares, Ninja, Renzo...

That alone is 19 wins...equaling Randy’s entire career, with a much higher quality.

Nah, you just asserted a bunch of bunk and said "muh, quality!"

Randy's wins over Vitor (first fighter to beat him), Smith (just beaten Coleman for the belt), Rizzo (twice) and others early in his career were up with anything Hendo did. That's not counting his wins against Liddell (first fight), Tito, HW title win and defense in his 40s, etc. He doesn't have as many wins (or losses) as Hendo because he didn't have nearly as many fights.

 

[HaulParris]

Hendo

 

[dildos]

Hendo for sure.

 

[markantony20]

I’d say Randy all together. Hendo’s PRIDE run was legendary though.

Randy just had that Dawg in him, I saw some people over on Twitter newer fans or at least new fans that didn’t brush up on their MMA history ragging on Randy because of his record…records don’t always tell the full story of a fighter’s accomplishments.

Both are legendary and Hall of Famers.

 

[markantony20]

Couture, He reached UFC Gold in multiple weight classes.

Not bad for an old man

 

[Richard Fannin]

I love Hendo, but he never defended either of his PRIDE belts. Vitor was before he won the belt from Wand.

Yeah, I almost corrected him as well, before I realized that he didn't say it was a title fight/defense, or specified which belt he meant when he said "wins as a champ"...
Hendo was PRIDE WW champ when he beat Vitor, so it does check out.

Hendo was the First Simultaneous Two Division Champ in the UFC to ever do it

thats gotta count for something

It wasn't simultaneous though, he had lost the HW belt to Barnett, who then pissed hot, so Randy & Ricco had a fight for the vacant HW title, and Suave made The Natural tap to strikes...
It was only after that that Couture beat Chuck for the interim LHW strap, and then Tito for the real deal.

But yeah, it does count for something.
Newer fans of the sport consider Tim Sylvia a joke, and Gonzaga a can with one random good win over Cro Cop, but they don't realize how insane it was when Couture came back from retirement to beat them both back-to-back.

The Maine-iac was 11 years younger, much bigger, had a much longer reach (longest in the UFC IIRC?) and the best HW boxer in the UFC.
Fans disliked him, but he was the favorite for a reason... he had only lost twice, a quick submission to Frank Mir, and another sub to Arlovski, that he avenged twice.

Randy was old, rusty, and his only path to victory was to submit Sylvia somehow, because he wasn't outstriking him, and he was too small to outwrestle him for 5 rounds

Gabriel Gonzaga was the new breed, a BJJ BB elite with a bunch of wins in ADCC, with some nasty power in his hands & feet, who had just outstruck the best HW striker of all times in a massive upset.

Napao is the man to beat Fedor, so what can poor ol' Randy do? He did good against Sylvia don't get me wrong, beautiful performance, but Gonzaga is the future and will dominate the division for a long, long time.
What can Couture do? He's not submitting him, not KOing him, and he's too small to outwrestle him for 5 rounds.

 

[Shilajit]

Randy was better in every way. Luckily for Dan he had that TRT resurgence, so his resume looks better if you just take all of his bullshit decision wins at face value, so most likely people will just compare wikipedia and proclaim Dan superior, especially as time goes on.

Yeah I could definitely see Randy going life and death with Shogun on the feet

 

[Cartiac]

Which do you value more multi division Pride Champ or multi division UFC Champ? After many great years of incredible fighting and accomplishments from both fighters, I score it a draw.

 

[HHJ]

Which do you value more multi division Pride Champ or multi division UFC Champ? After many great years of incredible fighting and accomplishments from both fighters, I score it a draw.

I mean it doesnt really matter,everyone is gonna have their own criteria. They are both legends,and should be respected.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

Didn't most people score Henderson vs Bisping II in favor of Hendo? That basically means his last fight he should have been MW champ in the UFC lol.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

Nah, you just asserted a bunch of bunk and said "muh, quality!"

Randy's wins over Vitor (first fighter to beat him), Smith (just beaten Coleman for the belt), Rizzo (twice) and others early in his career were up with anything Hendo did. That's not counting his wins against Liddell (first fight), Tito, HW title win and defense in his 40s, etc. He doesn't have as many wins (or losses) as Hendo because he didn't have nearly as many fights.

They're not a bunch of bunk.

As you alluded to Henderson fought a lot more and thus has a larger sample size. If we were to pretend their quality of wins and win/loss ratio were similar then there is more evidence Henderson was better. Sample size matters a ton in athletics.

Courture was more political and a better businessman, hence why he headlined so many PPVs. This is great for him because well, he fought a lot of legends.

But Hendo fought as many legends (through longevity and more activity) but also fought a lot of guys no one wanted to fight. So sure, in hindsight you could easily dismiss someone like Cavalcante or Palhares. They're not top 5 wins for either Hendo/Courture or any all time great, but they're relevant wins and they're fighters people didn't want to fight.

Henderson has both a long list of beating the HOFer type of guys as well as those upper-mid card type of guys. He was the type of fighter who would fight anyone. I'm having a hard time seeing how Courture tops him, Hendo kind of did what he did plus more.

I guess what I am trying to say that there are guys like Misaki who should count as a quality win, but certain people will look at him and say "pfft he ain't no GSP" and he may as well have been a tomato can.

Hendo getting a lot of wins against non top-tier but very good guys like Gono, Bisping, Busamante, Babalu should count for something. Not sure if I made my key point clear

 

[Rank Squatter]

...
It wasn't simultaneous though, he had lost the HW belt to Barnett, who then pissed hot, so Randy & Ricco had a fight for the vacant HW title, and Suave made The Natural tap to strikes...
It was only after that that Couture beat Chuck for the interim LHW strap, and then Tito for the real deal.

...

Nahh .. He was exactly what I said he was.. you have your facts wrong on this one

no big deal .. alot of people overlook this attribute of Hendo

 

[HHJ]

Courture was more political and a better businessman, hence why he headlined so many PPVs. This is great for him because well, he fought a lot of legends.

Tell me of his political manueverings! This should be good.

 

[Cartiac]

I mean it doesnt really matter,everyone is gonna have their own criteria. They are both legends,and should be respected.

Yep, as humans we sadly, instinctually want to create divisions to separate things into smaller groups. The meaningless debates are as old as time. Plato v Socrates, Ali v Frazier, Magic v Bird, Izzy v Pereira, etc, etc, but it is not a zero sum game. It is fun to discuss but we don't always have to put one over another. We can be happy accepting equal levels of greatness. Without Yang there is no Yin.