Countering Pain Holds

[systema]

My boy, Ray Ray, recently locked me up in move standing, from my back, where he forced both his arms under my armpits (underhooks?) and then palm-to-palm pushed his hands to the back of my head while simultaneously rotating his arms up so that mine were straight up in the air. He explained that this "ghetto hold" as he called it would open up my body to knees and overall upper-extremity control, and he was right! Not being grappling savvy made me look like an idiot for defending the efficacy for BJJ in a real fight. I explained to him that even though I didn't know proper defense from that position that a good grappler would. So, if you gentleman and or ladies would provide me some competent instruction on how to escape or reverse that position -hopefully other than 'don't get there in the first place' or 'hit that dickhead with a steel chair'- I would appreciate it. It seems like BJJ and other grappling arts tend to teach the positions that one would be in a BJJ match against other competent practitioners, not common -and hilarious- pain holds that a really experienced grappler wouldn't be in the first place, but perhaps I'm wrong?

 

[KJGould]

* won't take bait *

 

[tdluxon]

Your so-called "ghetto hold" is actually a full nelson. It's illegal in amateur wrestling because it can lead to neck injuries, so it's no entirely just a "pain move"... you can actually injure someone pretty badly with it.

 

[systema]

* won't take bait *

Sorry dude, not trolling here I'm just a dumbass at grappling!

 

[systema]

Your so-called "ghetto hold" is actually a full nelson. It's illegal in amateur wrestling because it can lead to neck injuries, so it's no entirely just a "pain move"... you can actually injure someone pretty badly with it.

Interesting. I wonder if that's why I put a HUGE photo of a person performing a FULL NELSON on another person?

 

[TheMadHatter]

i actually dont know how to get out of a full nelson, it is illegal in wrestling i know that

 

[redwire]

Flip your foot up into his nads.

I'm assuming we're not using unified rules for this discussion?

 

[tdluxon]

Interesting. I wonder if that's why I put a HUGE photo of a person performing a FULL NELSON on another person?

You're the dumbass claiming you don't know what it is... Don't troll if you don't want the answer.

 

[redwire]

Also, I haven't been in a full nelson since I was, I dunno, 9, but I used to sit down quickly, and then push straight back.

This works great against nine-year-olds.

Your mileage may vary if 'Ray Ray' has hit puberty.

 

[LyotoM]

bend, put left foot around his right foot, fall back

idk

 

[lechien]

How to Escape a Full Nelson | eHow.com

YouTube - Self Defense - Against a full nelson

Self Defense - Against a Full Nelson - Video

 

[systema]

Also, I haven't been in a full nelson since I was, I dunno, 9, but I used to sit down quickly, and then push straight back.

This works great against nine-year-olds.

Your mileage may vary if 'Ray Ray' has hit puberty.

LOL, yep, unfortunately Raymond is considerably larger and stronger than myself, that's why I was kind of scratching my head like "I wonder if BJJ addresses this position". It's kind of fascinating to think that there are so many holes to fill in a grappling art that there are some left unanswered. Although I'm pretty sure BJ Penn won't find himself locked up in the Full Nelson anytime soon.

 

[Podgorny]

Ever hear of a 'victory throw' in Judo? Something similar to that.

 

[kimble09]

place both your hands on your forehead and use your strength to push your own head back, countering the strain on your neck...from there it's kind of a waiting game. he may try to take you down from there or let the hold go all together...

this is assuming he's not He-Man...the key is to not ever get into a position like that, and since it's now been done to you, i'm sure you'll be more aware next time and ninja your way outta there...

 

[akharon]

Push your arms down, head back, walk your feet out (so that you end up slowly putting your butt on the ground). Keep his arms pinned, switch your hips, walk into mount. It's really quite easy, and the standing FN is a stupid hold to get on someone that knows how to counter.

 

[SonOfZion**]

bas rutten showed the way out of that in his famous street fighting vid.


bend down, step to the side and a bit back, grab a leg a and pull him towards you, you will land on top of him and he wont be able to crank your neck at that angle or if you are really strong you can literally lift him up using his leg and jump so he lands on his head.


Standing full nelson you have no control over the guys hips, you need to get your feet behind his and he will be really off balance.


then tell him bjj rules (and like others said, if the guy is a beast he will hurt you bad in that spot, you cant let him crank at all)

 

[redaxe]

Y'know, they really should teach full nelson escapes in Self-defense BJJ classes.

 

[KJGould]

Most standing full nelsons aren't done correctly, and even then I've only ever used them to take someone down before submitting on the ground.

As for one of the suggestions, I wouldn't try to sit on the ground as that's helping me with a takedown and I can just step over so they're turtling before sliding my hooks in.

 

[Balto]

The full nelson is actually pretty tough to escape from if the guy is bigger than you. There are several counters to use posted earlier if you do find yourself in the position for some reason.

The biggest thing is just don't let people get you into a full nelson from behind. It's not really that easy to just slap one on someone before they can notice and react. The reason you don't see it very much in trained grappling is because if you really have that much control over the guy from behind, it's quicker and more efficient to just use an RNC or something.

 

[mrpopenfresh]

The nelsons are awesome for positionning.