Opinion California - Another 1.1% Income Tax increase for the Middle Class in 2024

[Broke Lester]

Sir realistically how many people have 9 that number seems very high ! most have like 1-3

and some have 4-6 or 8-9, the point was that 300k isn’t the same for every family.

 

[Mark Hunts FIST]

You don't use average income for calculating class because of skewing. This is basic stats. You should be using median income. Median individual income in California is under 40K, with household median under $80K.

A household with over $100K income is in the top 40 percentile of earners, so right at about $100K a household will fall in middle class (aka the middle third). But the majority of the 100K+ earners are absolutely not middle class unless we really stretch the bounds of the term.

I have not seen you mention income versus family members.
One person making 150,000 is not middle-class a family of four making 150,000 is middle-class

 

[avenue94]

I already said I don't know what is considered middle class in Cali. One size doesn't fit all though, if you're single and make 300K vs having 9 kids and making 300K, would the second guy be middle class or wealthy?

It's irrelevant that there are people making 300K with 9 kids because it's such a rarity. Do you base your worldview on the 0.0000001% exceptions and ignore the rest of the data?

In Southern California that means you can maybe afford a house at current market value

And as I've said before. The high cost of causing is a related, but separate issue. Whether the state raises income tax on people making $100K or more by 5% has no real bearing on the affordability of housing.

It’s going up for middle class. It’s just also going up for higher earners as well. I don’t think it was dishonest to simply give the full range that’s subject to the increase in the headline so that there’s a hard number detail.

I agree it's going up. But you can talk about the problem of rising cost of living and falling wages for middle class Californians without looping in people that clearly aren't middle class.

 

[avenue94]

I have not seen you mention income versus family members.
One person making 150,000 is not middle-class a family of four making 150,000 is middle-class

True, but having kids doesn't really factor in here given it's a choice for the most part. A household making $150K in California is making almost the median household income, and that's including high cost urban areas. Families also get access to tax incentives individuals don't.

 

[boingyman]

Do any of you live in a VHCOL city in California? Because it's easy to talk stats without looking at real world situations. Looking at median household income alone isn't enough and in many cases is not a good representative of "affordability" depending how that is interpreted.

 

[Scerpi]

True, but having kids doesn't really factor in here given it's a choice for the most part. A household making $150K in California is making almost the median household income, and that's including high cost urban areas. Families also get access to tax incentives individuals don't.

For fucks sake... Can it and stop derailing the thread. lol..

And you're fucking wrong as fuck....

"The average annual household income in Los Angeles County is $116,482, while the median household income sits at $80,372 per year."
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neig...ual household income,sits at $80,372 per year.

"The average annual household income in San Francisco County is $178,742, while the median household income sits at $126,187 per year."
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/San-Francisco-Demographics.html

The average annual household income in San Diego County is $119,746, while the median household income sits at $89,161 per year.
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/San-Diego-County-Demographics.html

More than half of California's population is in the three above Metro Areas

There you go dipshit and stop derailing a thread about California raising the tax rate "Across the Board".... Which means despite what you think "Middle Class" in California is... it's getting hit with yet another tax increase.

A tax increase that's in response to Shit Democrat Policies in California leading the a mass exodus of the middle class and higher.... Causing a huge dent in Tax Revenue while Democrats continue to increase spending.

California Sees $68 Billion Deficit on Revenue Plunge​

• Budget adviser released its fiscal outlook report on Thursday
• California deficit fueled by slowdown of income tax revenue

Gavin is a complete idiot...

No State or Municipal Income Tax in Texas or Florida...

lol

 

[RoastBeast]

Here is what looks to be a middle class house in San Jose vs. a similar middle class house in Ohio.

2752 Longford Dr, San Jose, CA 95132 | Zillow

2752 Longford Dr, San Jose CA, is a Single Family home that contains 1938 sq ft and was built in 1964.It contains 4 bedrooms and 3 bathrooms.This home last sold for $1,700,000 in January 2024. The Zestimate for this Single Family is $1,497,100, which has increased by $4,307 in the last 30...

www.zillow.com

Estimated monthly payment: $9807

5536 Keith Dr, Dayton, OH 45449 | Zillow

5536 Keith Dr, Dayton OH, is a Single Family home that contains 1948 sq ft and was built in 1990.It contains 4 bedrooms and 3 bathrooms.This home last sold for $278,000 in February 2024. The Zestimate for this Single Family is $285,100, which has increased by $2,660 in the last 30 days.The...

www.zillow.com

Estimated monthly payment: $1930

 

[Belaya Smert]

I mean they had to pay to clean shit up for that one week right. China was coming

 

[boingyman]

For fucks sake... Can it and stop derailing the thread. lol..

And you're fucking wrong as fuck....

"The average annual household income in Los Angeles County is $116,482, while the median household income sits at $80,372 per year."
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/Los-Angeles-County-Demographics.html#:~:text=The average annual household income,sits at $80,372 per year.

"The average annual household income in San Francisco County is $178,742, while the median household income sits at $126,187 per year."
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/San-Francisco-Demographics.html

The average annual household income in San Diego County is $119,746, while the median household income sits at $89,161 per year.
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/San-Diego-County-Demographics.html

More than half of California's population is in the three above Metro Areas

There you go dipshit and stop derailing a thread about California raising the tax rate "Across the Board".... Which means despite what you think "Middle Class" in California is... it's getting hit with yet another tax increase.

A tax increase that's in response to Shit Democrat Policies in California leading the a mass exodus of the middle class and higher.... Causing a huge dent in Tax Revenue while Democrats continue to increase spending.

California Sees $68 Billion Deficit on Revenue Plunge​

• Budget adviser released its fiscal outlook report on Thursday
• California deficit fueled by slowdown of income tax revenue

Gavin is a complete idiot...

No State or Municipal Income Tax in Texas or Florida...

lol

Can you provide a better source that CA state income tax rates are increasing again in 2024? The table shown from the first tweet that show 2023 and 2024 rates are actually 2022 and 2023 rates...

 

[BIKES!]

Got to love the intellectual dishonesty of pretending that someone making $150K to $300K is middle class. I don't think these people understand what median income is.

I wouldn't call $150K even middle class in 90% of California areas that have public schools with ratings higher than 7/10.

 

[LeonardoBjj]

California seems like a great place to vacation, not live.

 

[avenue94]

"The average annual household income in Los Angeles County is $116,482, while the median household income sits at $80,372 per year."
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neig...ual household income,sits at $80,372 per year.

"The average annual household income in San Francisco County is $178,742, while the median household income sits at $126,187 per year."
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/San-Francisco-Demographics.html

The average annual household income in San Diego County is $119,746, while the median household income sits at $89,161 per year.
https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/San-Diego-County-Demographics.html

If you don't understand why you do not use averages for income calculations, you really should take a basic stats class. Use median income, and that's household, not individual.

There you go dipshit and stop derailing a thread about California raising the tax rate "Across the Board".... Which means despite what you think "Middle Class" in California is... it's getting hit with yet another tax increase.

A tax increase that's in response to Shit Democrat Policies in California leading the a mass exodus of the middle class and higher.... Causing a huge dent in Tax Revenue while Democrats continue to increase spending.

I don't think you understand how tax brackets work. I've explained already that that tax increase will impact some "middle class" Californians, but most that range is in the top 10 15 percentile of income in California. Are you trying to tell me that someone in the 90th percentile of income is middle class?

A tax increase that's in response to Shit Democrat Policies in California leading the a mass exodus of the middle class and higher.... Causing a huge dent in Tax Revenue while Democrats continue to increase spending.

Nah that dent in tax revenue is because California's tax base is disproportionately tied to stock market performance and very high earners. That's not to say that how California generates tax revenue can't be improved, but the idea that tax revenue is falling because of a middle class exodus is flat out wrong and unsupported by data.

No State or Municipal Income Tax in Texas or Florida...

Indeed, which leads to a much higher tax burden on lower-income Texans. Unless you think not having an income tax and over half of Texas' tax revenue is sales tax are unrelated. There are disadvantages and advantages to both states' approaches.

I wouldn't call $150K even middle class in 90% of California areas that have public schools with ratings higher than 7/10.

Again, which is a related quality of life issue that is separate from income. It makes no sense to decide whether an individual is middle class or not on their school district, by that logic, we should consider geographic access to hospitals or parks. Which is quite silly.

 

[Broke Lester]

It's irrelevant that there are people making 300K with 9 kids because it's such a rarity. Do you base your worldview on the 0.0000001% exceptions and ignore the rest of the data?

The rest of the data says you don't get to decide what is middle class or wealthy without knowing specific circumstances of families in Cali. Your entire argument is that you disagree with the figures given on what is middle class and what is wealthy.
So let's say for a second that you're right, how do you feel about a 1.1% increase for families with income from 67-120K?

 

[avenue94]

The rest of the data says you don't get to decide what is middle class or wealthy without knowing specific circumstances of families in Cali. Your entire argument is that you disagree with the figures given on what is middle class and what is wealthy.
So let's say for a second that you're right, how do you feel about a 1.1% increase for families with income from 67-120K?

Odd argument that you think when determining public policy you want carveouts for extreme outliers. I also have no idea why you're discussing a taxpayer who qualifies for head of household, if not married, when discussing individual rates. As for the tax increase and what an individual how much more an individual would owe from that 1.1% increase if we ignore credits, etc.
-70K: $3
-80K: $143
-90K: $253
-100K: $363
-110K: $473
-120K: $583

It's effectively a negligible increase for most of that income range you listed. I'm personally fine with breaking up the tax bracket into $70K to $150K for individuals and $150K to $300K or whatever since right now it's way too large.

 

[Darkgsp]

and some have 4-6 or 8-9, the point was that 300k isn’t the same for every family.

Yes 300k is different for each family depending on spending habits.

 

[Broke Lester]

Odd argument that you think when determining public policy you want carveouts for extreme outliers. I also have no idea why you're discussing a taxpayer who qualifies for head of household, if not married, when discussing individual rates. As for the tax increase and what an individual how much more an individual would owe from that 1.1% increase if we ignore credits, etc.
-70K: $3
-80K: $143
-90K: $253
-100K: $363
-110K: $473
-120K: $583

It's effectively a negligible increase for most of that income range you listed. I'm personally fine with breaking up the tax bracket into $70K to $150K for individuals and $150K to $300K or whatever since right now it's way too large.

so your math comes out to 1.1% of 70K is $3? Try $770.00

 

[Broke Lester]

Yes 300k is different for each family depending on spending habits.

Depending on number of kids, maybe elderly parents that are dependents.

 

[avenue94]

so your math comes out to 1.1% of 70K is $3? Try $770.00

Do you not understand how marginal tax rates and tax brackets work? That 1.1% increase only applies to income in that bracket. Tax rate for income below that is unaffected.

It's impressive that you're so confident talking about taxes without knowing how tax brackets work.

Depending on number of kids, maybe elderly parents that are dependents.

Lol how many people do think are making 300K, have 9 kids, and are filing as an individual. This tax increase doesn't apply to them. The equivalent head of household income bracket is $93K- almost half a million. Please do tell me how a household making almost half a million is to be considered middle class.

 

[Broke Lester]

Do you not understand how marginal tax rates and tax brackets work? That 1.1% increase only applies to income in that bracket. Tax rate for income below that is unaffected.

It's impressive that you're so confident talking about taxes without knowing how tax brackets work.

Lol how many people do think are making 300K, have 9 kids, and are filing as an individual. This tax increase doesn't apply to them. The equivalent head of household income bracket is $93K- almost half a million. Please do tell me how a household making almost half a million is to be considered middle class.

It's impressive that you think 1.1% of 70K is $3 and are still alive.

 

[Yorick]

or flee California, and then vote for the same shit the fled from.

idiots.

a buddy of mine moved to Idaho ffs to escape this Cali shit anndd...
former Cali residents are up there already doing the same shit.
smh, madness