Bravo's Twister really just a wrestler's guillotine?

[armtriangle]

I saw this in another thread. I have never been a fan of Eddie Bravo's style and have never studied his moves with made up names... though ive heard of the twister many times, ive never seen what it actually is.

anyway I used to do this move in wrestling all the time, where im from we called it a guillotine, im sure it has many names. I would hear my opponent's backs popping all teh time, and i used to torchure underclassmen with it. ANyway, i would start with a leg in and a power half, then when they fell to the side, i would trap the far arm under my pit, hook the head, push away with my hips and pull teh neck/head toward me...

is this the same move, or is there something im missing from the pic?

<img src="http://www.grapplearts.com/Images/PhotoOfTheWeek/Twister-Spinelock.jpg">

 

[nefti]

yes it is. Eddie just figured out different setups for it and ways to use it to set up other submissions and to improve position using the twister. IT's called the twister because in bjj the guillotine is a choke.

 

[Rotaryengine]

Eddie didnt make up the name twister if you read his book juijitsu unleashed His trainer Joc (dont know how to spell) Machado ended up called it the twister becuase he didnt know what it was.

 

[armtriangle]

Eddie didnt make up the name twister if you read his book juijitsu unleashed His trainer Joc (dont know how to spell) Machado ended up called it the twister becuase he didnt know what it was.

I have never read his book, I just made the remark because he comes up with dumb names for everything... MISSION CONTROL!

 

[Kimuralex]

the way we finish the wrestling/freestyle guillotine is by having the 10 finger grip on the crown of the head, not on the neck(as seen in the picture). it makes it more effective like that.

And yes twister=wrestling guillotine

 

[FutureBxer]

as said above - eddie invented a setup for this move that is applicable in BJJ. Eddie would also have the lockdown in that position cuz imo the way that guy has the other guys legged trapped just by crossing is easy to escape. the lockdown keeps their leg trapped a lot better

 

[juanlawnmower]

Eddie didnt make up the name twister if you read his book juijitsu unleashed His trainer Joc (dont know how to spell) Machado ended up called it the twister becuase he didnt know what it was.

Jean Jacque Machado. Yung Joc didn't name the Twister.

It's definitely a legit move for competitions where spine cranks are legal, but (as far as I've seen/heard) those are far and few between.

 

[Foppa21]

As silly as the names are, it does make it easier to remember the positions.

As opposed to calling it the open, leg across the back with your foot grabbed and other leg on the hip....

 

[Mikey Triangles]

Eddie didnt make up the name twister if you read his book juijitsu unleashed His trainer Joc (dont know how to spell) Machado ended up called it the twister becuase he didnt know what it was.

you mean Jean Jacques Machado...

 

[Jimmy Cerra]

In wrestling, tons of schools have different nicknames for the same move. Why are people so arrogant to assume that their name is better than all others?

Besides, everyone knows I come up with the best names for moves.

 

[armtriangle]

In wrestling, tons of schools have different nicknames for the same move. Why are people so arrogant to assume that their name is better than all others?

Besides, everyone knows I come up with the best names for moves.

not about that... if a move has already been invented, has a name, why confuse the issue.... here it is different, because the guillotine is something else in sub grappling than wrestling. i head people talking about teh twister liek it was some amazing complicated move, then i saw what it was and was like wtf, its just a guillotine.

 

[Jimmy Cerra]

Eddie Bravo said in his first book that it was a wrestling guillotine, but that JJM called it "that twister thing you do", which eventually became Bravo's nickname too.

Just because you knew of a move doesn't mean it isn't amazing to others and vice versa. The first time I showed the armbar from turtle a wrestler friend was amazed. A judo friend thought the triangle from guard was the coolest thing even tho it is in judo too. And many BJJ friends are amazed by switches and granby rolls even tho they are in BJJ too.

What's in a name? A rose by any other name would smell as sweet. Would you rather everyone get confused with two moves called guillotines? I know of 3 different things called a keylock in BJJ, we don't need more ambiguity.

 

[Oktavius**]

Eddie also wraps the ops close arm around his neck first.

And although i know this is a wrestling move i dont understand. I though submissions were not allowed in wrestling, especialy hospitalising ones like this.

 

[juanlawnmower]

In wrestling it's not considered a submission, since it's used to gain nearfall (back exposure) points.

 

[ROTNROTT]

True dat

 

[jasond]

I have never read his book, I just made the remark because he comes up with dumb names for everything... MISSION CONTROL!

The names he comes up with make some of the complicated positions much easier to remember. Another thing about the names Eddie comes up with: it makes working with kids much easier. When my son was on the bottom of side control in a competition and I was coaching from the sides, it was much easier for him to understand when I yelled out "T-Rex" than if I would have said "get your arms in position to create space. elbows in. etc".

For a 12 year old, those "dumb names" (as you call them) are perfect because kids will associate the position with it more easily.

 

[Joey Burke]

I'd hate to shout "put him in retard control" to my 12 year old though.

 

[jasond]

I'd hate to shout "put him in retard control" to my 12 year old though.

Hahaha! Well, my son doesn't really play any rubber guard. He does use a few of the the hg sweeps Eddie teaches and I have no problem shouting "Old School" or "Plan B". Also, the biggest plus when it comes to kids is not so much the techniques, but the positional stuff. For instance, if he's getting pasted to hg and is too far to stop the pass, I can yell out "lockdown" and he'll tighten it up and switch from defending the pass to playing hg.

 

[KennyG]

I'm reviving this thread because I'm a high school wrestling coach and I got in an argument with another high school wrestling coach yesterday about the proper way to execute a wrestling guillotine. I'm I LW and he's a HW, so I'm pretty certain I'm right about this. I insist that you need to lock your legs before you trap the arm and grab your opponents head. The other coach was insisting that you could throw the move first without locking your legs and lock your legs afterwards if necessary. IMO this would be asking to be reversed with a guillotine as you are pulling your opponent on top of yourself. Does anyone know a link to a webpage that walks through the move step-by-step?

 

[Jimmy Cerra]

Why don't you wrestle and try it?