Are you happy with where MMA is and going?

[Killer Kadoogan]

The Pride ruleset was better.

I can only like MMA so much with UFC and Dana White at the top.

It's big enough to be a real sport now. But it isn't. Sports are meritocracies where the best advance and their PPV sells are irrelevant.

I miss tournaments more than anything else.

this. in an era where champ champ super duper lame fights happen, where you can easily identify those who were gifted title shots, roads to the title, where they promote raul rosas jr for doing nothing other than being born, we need to GO BACK TO THE TOURNAMENTS. DO WHAT GOT THEM TO THE DANCE.

a modern 2024, ONE NIGHT TOURNAMENT, THE ULTIMATE ULTIMATE would be the way to go , bring back in viewers, bring back the grittiness of the old school type. that is how you would get viewers, pay homage to MMA, all of that shit. one proper night tournament. do different weight classes. only for those that want to do it. guaranteed you would have new stars, you could market them as the tournament champions, etc.

 

[JustOnce]

Agree with many of your observations and takes. I will say this. It is time to branch out and realize what the UFC is. Like you have pointed out, they weed out those jon fitches, okami types who have derailed the more "exciting" fighter. you know the UFC is now in it to give favorable matchups to those who they want to win, want as champion. they protect their "stars." it is time to branch out and just realize the UFC is what it is now, an entertainment league, with actual very few that would qualify as truly "elite" or "championship material." most of the roster is played out. It's time to dial it back, and fall in love with the other aspects of MMA. I would suggest getting into kickboxing / muay thai. GLORY, K1 Rebirth, Rise are all fire stand up organizations. ONE obviously with their muay thai / kickboxing in the MMA gloves. If you want that old school taste of the JMMA, consider subscribing to DEEP / Pancrase on youtube, pretty cheap, entertaining for what it is. For pancrase english commentary, subscribe on youtube, change VPN to Japan, bam. Rizin is another one worth watching in the modern era. They have built up legitimate fighters, know how to acquire good talent, good matchmaking, good shows as of late. Jiri / Manel Kape, former Rizin fighters. They've got a good thing going, and it feels more stable/successful than DREAM. There was only one event in 2023 of Rizin, a "Landmark" one that failed to meet expectations, the rest have all been pretty good.

i think for striking arts, there are definitely good orgs like there, but mma not any more. Rizin did a good job with some guys who became world class fighters, but i think that dried up long ago unfortunately...the only world class fighter from Rizin in my opinion is their sw wmma champ, she's as good as any wmma fighter i dare say. no one else though. i think suzuki or whatever his name is, his grappling is too shit to be anything.

 

[Killer Kadoogan]

i think for striking arts, there are definitely good orgs like there, but mma not any more. Rizin did a good job with some guys who became world class fighters, but i think that dried up long ago unfortunately...the only world class fighter from Rizin in my opinion is their sw wmma champ, she's as good as any wmma fighter i dare say. no one else though. i think suzuki or whatever his name is, his grappling is too shit to be anything.

MMA far less, but I wouldn't give up on Rizin yet. They are coming into their own and have developed a lot more. Seika Izawa is a legitimate WMMA champ for sure. Suzuki also smoked Vugar in Aizerbaijan which was ridiculous. His grappling is shit, but he has passed the tests, so far. Kleber Koike prob would beat him again. Asakura bros, shinryu, gucci, suzuki, koike, kanehara, ougikubo other stand up fighters ren hiramoto, and the occasional buakaw stand up match ups? i'm in. Rizin is on the ascent, slowly but surely. Now would be the most ridiculous time to count them out, a few years ago, sure. It feels nothing like it was when it first started and I am confident they will continue on, longer than DREAM.

MMA wise though, yes, the UFC has the best. But you have to ask yourself, how many of those are even truly definable as the best? The answer is very, very, very few. We're talking maybe 2, 3, 4 guys in a division that actually have a chance at winning the belt, if that. flyweight, featherweight, WW, MW, LHW, HW have MAYBE 2-3 guys who have a legitimate shot at the belt. the rest are just paddy cake for those dudes. and that's not even talking about WMMA. the UFC has the best, but there is a very thin line on "the best." if you're watching the best of UFC / MMA, then realistically you're watching very few events throughout the year.

 

[HI SCOTT NEWMAN]

I have to be honest I miss WEC and Pride so much, I loved them both. Never missed an event. I feel its gone downhill since both were finished off.

UFC has improved in the lighter weightclasses, but LHW and HW has gone backwards badly and the skill level is not there.

 

[CieloLuce]

UFC dying confirmed.

No, I think what we need is a real competitor for the UFC to drive up competition and wages. The UFC would have to raise its standards if it had to compete. That is tough sledding though, not easy to compete with a dominant org; it would take someone with savvy. Hopefully the anti-trust lawsuit will make some kind of changes.

Yeah, I feel like if One FC or PFL could compete in the same atmosphere it would push the UFC/endeavor to try harder.

I honestly feel like the presentation is starting to feel outdated and the cards way more diluted. Like for fucks sake Zhang vs Xiaonan doesn't feel like a big fight(in China for sure, just not in Vegas).

 

[Levi_]

Yeah, I feel like if One FC or PFL could compete in the same atmosphere it would push the UFC/endeavor to try harder.

I honestly feel like the presentation is starting to feel outdated and the cards way more diluted. Like for fucks sake Zhang vs Xiaonan doesn't feel like a big fight(in China for sure, just not in Vegas).

Yeah, and that was one of the things I was referring to- the talent pool is going to be shallower the lower your pay starts. The idea would be that competition bumps the pay up through competition, and you have a bigger pool of people that want to join the sport.

 

[FreddieRoachsVoice]

I moved abroad in 2019 so instead of watching a card for the hell of it, it's a commitment to stay up and watch it with the time difference so it better be a REALLY good card to justify it. Let's just say it has become easier and easier to skip cards in the past 5 years with many of the fight nights being so bad that I wouldn't even check the play by play results the next day.

2007-2015 I was a massive massive fan... but holy crap has the sport gone downhill. For me, it all started with the immediate rematch era which removed all excitement from a big upset and significantly clogged up divisions. This leading into the "3 cards a weekend" watered down era was a slog but now we don't even get nearly that same volume of cards and yet the quality is EVEN WORSE than back then. I legitimately wouldn't even call myself a fan in modern day... it's now a thing I "used to watch"

 

[Paolo Delutis]

I feel like the UFC is in a dangerous place for the first time since ive been watching which was pre TUF 1.. I feel like they might be losing their identity abit as a the sports leader ...key word being sport and leaning to hard into the entertainment side of things because money is becoming to important to them vs the sport that actually made them rich in the first place...

Its dangerous because it has to function like a legitimate sport or fighters will leave or never even try for this sport in the future.. there's no need for a pseudo pro wrestling " real fighting" sport.. its either real fighting or its pro wrestling... corporate greed is ruining most things in the world and i fear it may be trickling into sports and MMA too ...

Ive never watched as much outside of the UFC MMA as i have in the last few years , because i feel like the UFC is selling out abit and theres some real questionable things taking place at the UFC .. changing the drug testing to the NFL guys to me is a potentially massive step backwards and the favoritism is at all time high ..

Another promotion ( PFL) may just be able to gain some ground on the UFC by simply just operating more transparently and fairly .. fighters have enough to worry about they dont want to have to worry about fucking Dana white and his negotiation tactics too .

 

[whocares]

Every sport is sliding down the shitter, including MMA. But MMA has one little built in caveat that those other sports don't. Fighters still have to get in a cage and fight somebody who's trying to destroy them, preserving the sporting integrity that built it up from day 1. Other sports have long since jumped this shark. So despite all of Dana's work to put as many low paid fighters on as many cards as possible and stifle any talented fighter from building a profile that gives them leverage over the company, you still get that octagon door slamming shut 12 (or whatever) times every event, and as a lifelong and former sports fan, at this point I will take anything I can get that still resembles the good old days of sporting competition.

 

[Mammothman]

I don't mind it talent wise but I'm getting fed up with this trash talking/social media/drama stuff

 

[Romulas]

ESPN has ruined it. I watch a couple of events a year now and that's just if I'm home with nothing better to do.

I've been watching mma since the mid 90s. I worked in the industry. When I wasn't at an event I used to plan around them, have friends over and order the ppvs at my bars. Now over the past 2 or so years nobody really gives a shit. They struggle to make the top fights, pad cards with wmma and are aiming for quantity over quality.

There's no grit or personality left. It's been espn washed of 90% of what made the UFC great.

And there's money in the sport now but they still don't pay the fighters.

 

[BOTTICELLI]

There is no competitive architecture thats the problem, rank squatters, and gifter title shots. Its almost feels scripted

 

[Van Daz]

talking about australia, who knew possible fw goat would come out of there and guy like Rob? pretty shocking.

Too true. Considering the population is about 25Mill, Australia has done very well.

 

[Killhippies]

The vision just doesn't feel there for the UFC. Instead of a leader, it's all just done by a committee that feels disconnected to what the fans want and just hope something sticks to get them by.

- They seem to have put all their eggs in one basket in hopes to drive on big personalities like Conor but don't have the skill to promote personalities when the fighter doesn't do all the work for them.

- There was a half-assed attempt to be looked as a legitimate sport but jumping rankings, gimmick fights, relaxed testing rules and BAMF belts threw that all out the window.

- The rules don't feel cutting edge or willing to experiment to make a more exciting product. ONE has more different rules and novelty matchups that don't devolve into pure clownery.

It honestly feels like they are content with stagnation and kinda fumbling by, they are the market leader so its going to take a long time before it shows.

 

[Dick]

MMA is ridiculously watered down these days. MMA was better in general 15-20 years ago when the sport was nothing but legitimate tough, men. Any dork who trains from the age of 12 can be a UFC fighter these days. I'm looking at you Chase Hooper.

 

[DapperDave]

I've only been watching it for 20 years.

It hasn't changed: MMA fights in a fenced ring.

People keep watching it.

If you make a show and people watch it for 20 or 30 years, it's a good show.

No amount of sherdog sniveling will change any of this.

 

[DapperDave]

MMA is ridiculously watered down these days. MMA was better in general 15-20 years ago when the sport was nothing but legitimate tough, men. Any dork who trains from the age of 12 can be a UFC fighter these days. I'm looking at you Chase Hooper.

If Hooper wanted a horbitch, and if you were there, Hooper would make you his horbitch if he wanted to.
Easily.
For fun.

Just sayin.

 

[markantony20]

You're still young sir.
Not many people my age still have optimism and enthusiasm.

Im one of a small percentage that still holds on to those things as a positive.

You’re right Lemur you’re a really chill dude.

How you doing btw I know I haven’t been too active on this forum lately.

 

[markantony20]

they need Jesus, huh?

Idk find your meaning through whatever you can is what I say.

 

[Ozze]

I think what I liked better was fewer cards but more stacked. I don't care for a card every weekend so I would rather have like 15-20 a year but all top fighters.