Are athletes really getting faster, better, stronger? | David Epstein

[Loiosh]

A video discussing how much we have improved over the years, why, and if some of the improvement is technological or a product of selection as opposed to biological.

TED
Published on 29 Apr 2014

When you look at sporting achievements over the last decades, it seems like humans have gotten faster, better and stronger in nearly every way. Yet as David Epstein points out in this delightfully counter-intuitive talk, we might want to lay off the self-congratulation. Many factors are at play in shattering athletic records, and the development of our natural talents is just one of them.

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[asharak]

I watched this the other day. He does talk about specialization and body types also, which does a lot.

Technology has advanced a lot, so a lot of his points are along those lines.

He didn't really talk about how money or time/attention develops a sport. IE Tyron>>Royce in the same way that LeBron>>Jordan

 

[Mr Mojo Lane]

Athletes are bigger. I don't know about better. Look at NFL rosters. Look at the heavyweight division in boxing. The heavyweight boxers are not better but they are bigger

 

[Madmick]

Yeah, old talk. Good points.

Still, I don't think I've ever met anyone who believed we have improved genetically as a species over the last 50 years. I think most are intuitively aware that an increase in population size, increased development of global infrastructure, increased sophistication of sports training largely due to a huge influx of money from the rise of professional sporting culture, increased sophistication of sports chemistry/PEDs, and other environmental factors are the primary force driving this; including one of the more obscure factors that, IIRC, was the focus of this talk: the increased sophistication of sports equipment and competitive facilities (such as track surfaces and shoes).

The thing is this part of the iceberg has always been mostly underwater, so I doubt people sincerely care why. We measure progress in results, not potential.

 

[Fluffernutter]

National Geographic just had a cover story on this.

Yes, steroids were mentioned, but they also touched upon how sports have changed over the years.

Sure, Bolt has eye-popping speed. However, givem today's technology, Jessie Owens would be able to keep up with him.

After all, during Owen's time:

- Cinder tracks absorbed energy. Today's tracks bounce the energy back to the feet of the runner.
- Leather shoes with spikes. Today's shoes are specially made and are light as can be.
- Loose fitting clothing. Today's is like a second layer of skin.
- Clocks were only as accurate as the man holding them. Today, computers do the measuring.

 

[Madmick]

National Geographic just had a cover story on this.

Yes, steroids were mentioned, but they also touched upon how sports have changed over the years.

Sure, Bolt has eye-popping speed. However, givem today's technology, Jessie Owens would be able to keep up with him.

After all, during Owen's time:

- Cinder tracks absorbed energy. Today's tracks bounce the energy back to the feet of the runner.
- Leather shoes with spikes. Today's shoes are specially made and are light as can be.
- Loose fitting clothing. Today's is like a second layer of skin.
- Clocks were only as accurate as the man holding them. Today, computers do the measuring.

I seriously doubt this, and manual timing favors the racer.

 

[Drain Bamage]

Athletes are better cuz they training is smarter, they diets is in more in check, and they gear is way better

Just compare runnin shoes from today to runnin shoes from 1970

 

[Drain Bamage]

By the way, the greatest raw athlete of all time is alive today, name is Jim Brown

 

[Loiosh]

I seriously doubt this, and manual timing favors the racer.

What do you seriously doubt?

 

[Madmick]

What do you seriously doubt?

That if we had a time machine to transport Jesse Owens to 2008, and threw a modern tracksuit and pair of shoes on, that he would match Usain's time on that track.

 

[Loiosh]

That if we had a time machine to transport Jesse Owens to 2008, and threw a modern tracksuit and pair of shoes on, that he would match Usain's time on that track.

Not sure if you watched the video recently, but they adjusted time for track type and Bolt was still faster, but the difference was a lot smaller.

I would bet if they raced on the track Owens used, Owens would win.

 

[Deleted member 484047]

I just had a conversation much like this one with a buddy of mine. Our eventual conclusion was that stonger+faster does not always equal better.

Take Frank Tarkenton for example. One of the all time great NFL QBs, he retired in the late 70s. He is still in the top 15 for overall passing yards over an entire career, when he played the ground game was far more important and QBs didnt have anywhere near the protection they do today. Put him in his prime in todays game, and he would decimate records.

Wayne Gretzky. The man was a god on the ice on his bad days, when he ramped it up it was like god gave him built in cheat codes. Todays NHL players are faster, stronger, and better trained and his records will stand for a long, LONG fucking time.

Babe Ruth. The guys training routine was booze, cigars, hot dogs and hookers. Still considered one of the greatest of all time. Imagine if he had actually trained to improve his already phenomenal skills.

If you want fighting sports, look no further than Jack Johnson. The man even in todays sport would dominate inside the ring, and would be a champion a hundred years after his greatest achievement cemented his place in history.

Every sport has players just like these, that decades (or even a century or more) removed from todays version would quite simply still be at the top of the game, if not the best in the business. Granted some of them were just plain freaks (Gretzky isnt human, no way its possible) but most of them were just tremendously talented athletes that did what they did without the benefits of todays training methods and knowledge. Are todays athletes stronger and faster? In a lot of cases yes. But by no means does that make them 'better' than the athletes of the past.

 

[Loiosh]

I just had a conversation much like this one with a buddy of mine. Our eventual conclusion was that stonger+faster does not always equal better.

Take Frank Tarkenton for example. One of the all time great NFL QBs, he retired in the late 70s. He is still in the top 15 for overall passing yards over an entire career, when he played the ground game was far more important and QBs didnt have anywhere near the protection they do today. Put him in his prime in todays game, and he would decimate records.

Wayne Gretzky. The man was a god on the ice on his bad days, when he ramped it up it was like god gave him built in cheat codes. Todays NHL players are faster, stronger, and better trained and his records will stand for a long, LONG fucking time.

Babe Ruth. The guys training routine was booze, cigars, hot dogs and hookers. Still considered one of the greatest of all time. Imagine if he had actually trained to improve his already phenomenal skills.

If you want fighting sports, look no further than Jack Johnson. The man even in todays sport would dominate inside the ring, and would be a champion a hundred years after his greatest achievement cemented his place in history.

Every sport has players just like these, that decades (or even a century or more) removed from todays version would quite simply still be at the top of the game, if not the best in the business. Granted some of them were just plain freaks (Gretzky isnt human, no way its possible) but most of them were just tremendously talented athletes that did what they did without the benefits of todays training methods and knowledge. Are todays athletes stronger and faster? In a lot of cases yes. But by no means does that make them 'better' than the athletes of the past.

The truth about Gretzky is that he wasn't physical, he just saw the game in a way nobody else could.

 

[Deleted member 484047]

The truth about Gretzky is that he wasn't physical, he just saw the game in a way nobody else could.

That happens when you start every game with the Konami code activated. Dude probably saw the matrix code while on the ice or something.

 

[Rob Battisti]

The idea that Jack Johnson would be able to dominate in today’s fight game is insane. He wouldn’t last 3 rounds with a Tyson or a Klitsbro.

 

[bubbleboyjones]

The idea that Jack Johnson would be able to dominate in today’s fight game is insane. He wouldn’t last 3 rounds with a Tyson or a Klitsbro.

Come on bro. Everyone knows Jack Johnson would be UFC HW champ with 3 weeks training at Jacksons

 

[boingyman]

If I had to guess the correct answers are yes, no, maybe and it depends. Even if athletes are getting faster, better, strong as a whole or pushing absolutes individually, when you take into consideration of every variable it's really hard to say

 

[Drain Bamage]

The truth about Gretzky is that he wasn't physical, he just saw the game in a way nobody else could.

Reminds me of Joe Montana

 

[JinKazama]

better drugs

 

[PolishHeadlock]

@therealdope