Adding a second bench day to 5/3/1

[turbozed]

Bench is currently my weakest lift. I've been plateaued for about a year. It's pitiful. My SOHP is a lot stronger in comparison and I've finally hit a goal of 1xBW (165 @ 165).

Currently I'm doing 5/3/1 with the 4 lifts but I'm thinking of making my SOHP day into another bench day for a while so that I can break through my long-time bench plateau. My SOHP day is tomorrow so I'm trying to make a decision about it soon.

Here's how my week looks like currently:
Squat+assistance-> empty day -> Bench + assistance -> empty -> Deadlift + assistance -> empty -> SOHP + assistance -> empty -> [repeat]

1: Would 2 days of bench in 5/3/1 be a good idea? Or would it be better if I just do something like Smolov Jr for bench and take it easy on my other lifts? What would a Smolov Jr for bench + 5/3/1 for squats/deads look like and would it be doable?

2: If 2xbench 5/3/1 is a good idea, what set/rep/% scheme should I use on either day? Which assistance exercise should I program? Obviously this last part depends on my weaknesses. My sticking point is halfway up the lift (lockout is fine and so is speed off the chest).

Any other thoughts and opinions are welcome.

 

[Tosa]

Wendler says that powerlifters may choose to do the second pressing exercise as narrow grip bench instead of overhead press. I think that's the simplest option, so it makes sense to try it first. If you do this, you should probably include some kind of overhead lifting as an assistance exercise.

There's also the 5/3/1 routine outlined here: T NATION | Blood and Chalk Vol 9: Jim Wendler Talks Big Weights, which has you squat and bench twice a week, and deadlift and overhead press once a week.

 

[Aleks Sytsevich]

You could add in a light set of 3x5 @ 55, 65, 75% of your training max on either squat or deadlift day. I wouldn't go heavier than 85% for the top set though.

I would continue pressing as the layover from press to bench is far greater than the layover from bench to press.

Do you have a sticking point that could addressed? Have you tried various grip widths?

 

[VoodooPlata]

What would a Smolov Jr for bench + 5/3/1 for squats/deads look like and would it be doable?

I'm just coming off Smolov Jr for bench, and it's worked very well. I don't know how your work capacity is, but I have a hard time picturing you doing anything else but bench on day 3 and 4 of every week. It might look like this:

Monday:
Bench (Smolov)
Squats (5/3/1)

Wednesday:
Bench (Smolov)
Deads (5/3/1)

Friday:
Bench (Smolov)

Saturday:
Bench (Smolov)

Monday and tuesday aren't consecutive, as they are in the Smolov original programme, because you need some rest between squats and deads so it's been changed to monday and wednesday. There is no assistance - Smolov is some draining stuff. Since it's only three weeks, maybe let your other lifts go a bit and focus on the one you're plateauing in.

 

[LZD]

Squat 5/3/1
+ Assistance

Bench 5/3/1
+ Assistance

Deadlift 5/3/1
+ Assistance

Narrow Grip 5/3/1
+ Assistance (overhead press)

 

[LegioTitan]

I've been plateaued for about a year.

And you're just now addressing it?? If a primary movement sticks for more than 3 weeks, I lose my mind. You must be one laid back fella.

 

[SaiWa]

wow... 8000+ posts and you can only bench your weight once?... less posting more lifting!???

5/3/1 plan is good but maybe you should do something different.

try some negative bench pressing. or high rep bench pressing.

and to answer your question, you can bench twice a week if you wanted to. i daresay, you can probably bench every day with the way you bench cause if you have been plateauing for a whole year, you haven't been really working on your bench at all...

 

[LegioTitan]

wow... 8000+ posts and you can only bench your weight once?... less posting more lifting!???

5/3/1 plan is good but maybe you should do something different.

try some negative bench pressing. or high rep bench pressing.

and to answer your question, you can bench twice a week if you wanted to. i daresay, you can probably bench every day with the way you bench cause if you have been plateauing for a whole year, you haven't been really working on your bench at all...

That's a bit strong don't you think? Let's try to keep the gloves up.

 

[PowerHungry]

wow... 8000+ posts and you can only bench your weight once?... less posting more lifting!???

That was a BW PRESS, not bench press.

 

[Keosawa]

Squat 5/3/1
+ Assistance

Bench 5/3/1
+ Assistance

Deadlift 5/3/1
+ Assistance

Narrow Grip 5/3/1
+ Assistance (overhead press)

I would suggest doing this; Tosa said basically the same thing and it's good advice. Close-grip training is, I think, the simplest fix for most lifters whose bench press is in a rut. I know that's a sweeping generalization, but it's the truth.

Personally, I think Smolov Jr. might be being a bit dramatic; I would suggest trying to find a more moderate solution before hammering your press with tons of volume.

I think that the BEST thing you could do is take a video of your next session and post it. I don't think your year-long plateau is necessarily going to be fixed through changes in technique, so that wouldn't really be the point. It would be, rather, to see what's giving you trouble. If we could get a look at your setup, your grip width, your bar-speed and whether/how much it changes during the concentric, etc., it would be a lot easier to provide a possible solution. Maybe you have an obvious, identifiable weakness that you haven't caught yet. Doing tons of volume, a la Smolov Jr., might fix it, but there could be other solutions that won't have you privileging your bench press so much.

 

[Keosawa]

wow... 8000+ posts and you can only bench your weight once?... less posting more lifting!???

You either don't know how to read or doing know what the acronym for a standing overhead press refers to.

Also: turbo, I see now that you posted your sticking point. It sounds like your triceps are your weakest point. A second day for just close-grip training would be my advice, and I'd run the percentages just as heavy as you're doing for your normal grip width, but based off a hypothetical "close-grip one rep max."

 

[toonie]

wow... 8000+ posts and you can only bench your weight once?... less posting more lifting!???

5/3/1 plan is good but maybe you should do something different.

try some negative bench pressing. or high rep bench pressing.

and to answer your question, you can bench twice a week if you wanted to. i daresay, you can probably bench every day with the way you bench cause if you have been plateauing for a whole year, you haven't been really working on your bench at all...

Learn to read.

 

[turbozed]

Thanks for all the advice, guys. After Tosa and LZD posted suggested switching out SOHP for narrow grip BP, I was thinking that I'd go that route. Smolov Jr does seem like a pretty extreme attempt at fixing the problem. Looks like Keo is endorsing that strategy as well so it looks like I got my answer.

For full disclosure, my BP hasn't been really that flat for the past year. Here's how it looks:

So it looks like my bench has gone up from about 215 to 240 for the first 2/3rds of the year before plateauing. Unfortunately all those peaks come from 1rm estimates of my 5/5/5 AMRAP days. I have really poor heavy sets below 5 reps. Here's how the list of my best reps looks like:

So what could be causing this? I think lack of a consistent spotter is one. I've had some really lousy spotting absolutely ruin a bench day. I might be psyching myself out and letting form degrade on my heavy sets as well. Maybe I just need to get used to benching lower reps? Perhaps do the 5/3/1 for powerlifting rep scheme for just my bench (again, because I've tried it before)?

Basically I'm perplexed...

 

[SaiWa]

yeah i totally misread his post. I thought he was benching 165 @ 165. that's my bad.

benching 240 @ 165 is respectable. i am mucking at 225lbs and weigh 155 so i can relate...

 

[LegioTitan]

"So what could be causing this? I think lack of a consistent spotter is one. I've had some really lousy spotting absolutely ruin a bench day. I might be psyching myself out and letting form degrade on my heavy sets as well. Maybe I just need to get used to benching lower reps? Perhaps do the 5/3/1 for powerlifting rep scheme for just my bench (again, because I've tried it before)?

Basically I'm perplexed..."


I'm a big proponent of lower reps when you're gunning for a new PR. High rep/volume work is great, fantastic shit but when you're ready to toss another 10-20lbs on and go big I believe the numbers need to drop wayyyy down.
For just two weeks try some lower numbers. Say an 80-88% week with 89-103% to follow obviously culminating in a new PR. Thats assuming you're at a point in your training where you can do this.
Approach 60%x5, 75%x3, 80%x2, 86%x1, 88%x1, and then go back to 80%x3 and call it a day. The following week 75%x3, 85%x2, 90%x1, 96%x1, 103%x1 or something similar.
Just a suggestion.

Also... you have a GRAPH?!?!
EDIT: Also love how the icon for a exercises is a man doing a jerk. The KING of all movements.

 

[calvus]

Turbo -

I've run 5/3/1 with benching twice a week before & it's worked really well for me. I used Overhead Press and Push Press as assistance, so I still got some overhead work in. I think Keosawa & Tosa's recommendations are spot on.

If you want to mix it up a little, you could do Matt Rhodes 5/3/1 with singles as your rep progression for bench & then do basic 5/3/1 for close-grip bench. This would let you focus on some heavy singles & set some "real" PR's instead of estimated. I've also done this twice by integrating the MM2K or "add50" bench program into my 5/3/1 template. Those programs have you benching twice a week, it's pretty easy to work it in.

And on the heavy sets or heavy singles, having a spotter will make a HUGE difference - just for the lift off. For me, when I have assistance unracking the bar my upper back stays much tighter. I usually look for a spotter when I'm around 90% of my 1RM.

 

[EddieLovesYou]

Subscribed, I'm kinda in the same boat. Just started 5/3/1 though so I'm going to do a few waves before changing anything. Good info so far guys, thanks.

 

[turbozed]

yeah i totally misread his post. I thought he was benching 165 @ 165. that's my bad.

benching 240 @ 165 is respectable. i am mucking at 225lbs and weigh 155 so i can relate...

No worries, honest mistake. Benching BW after all this time would be truly sad. But I don't think my bench is respectable at all, since it's lagging far behind my other lifts.

 

[SaiWa]

No worries, honest mistake. Benching BW after all this time would be truly sad. But I don't think my bench is respectable at all, since it's lagging far behind my other lifts.

hhmm well you're not weak. you can definitely bench more though that's for sure.

when was the last time you got a week or two of full rest? maybe you need a time out to recharge your body/mind.

 

[WildCard]

What app are you using there Turbo?