50 children a week referred to gender clinics in the UK?

[AviatorShades]

Ok so he was being tongue in cheek but you aren't ?

Alrighty then......

What about my post would be tongue in cheek? I'm genuinely heartbroken by the ultimate fate of the British people. Their ethnic passing is quite irreversible at this point barring WW3 and their police state strictly enforces some of the most extreme left dogma in human history.

It's a philosophical question about whether being replaced by a more primal fertile group is 'natural' or if their demise was an avoidable symptom related to the UK's foreign clique government.

 

[unimackpass]

So there's a British tabloid the Mirror that had a headline claiming that an average of 50 kids a week in the UK are referred to gender clinics. I guess it's kind of a trashy paper and it's not a very well written article, but are their numbers legit? Well, kind of. They count them from April to the end of the following March so the 2017-18 period is only halfway through. But the Mirror claims they've seen the numbers for April until October and it's 1302 so far.


https://www.channel4.com/news/factc...re-going-to-gender-identity-clinics-in-the-uk

So whatever the actual # is, it's a dramatic rise in a few short years. You can say that it's not a lot of kids compared to how many live in England, and I guess there's something to be said for that, but it's a worrying trend nonetheless.

http://gids.nhs.uk/number-referrals

I haven't seen the actual #s like this for here in Canada but I'm sure that along with the US, Australia and maybe other Western countries we've all had comparably dramatic spikes in gender clinic referrals for kids - I guess you could say that business is booming. But what jumped out to me in the stats above which wasn't mentioned in the article was how many more girls think that they're "born in the wrong body" as opposed to boys. Of the 2016 kids referred in the last year, 1400 were girls! Think about that, it's fucked up. Up almost 500 from the year before. #bringbackourgirls

My question is: does anyone here still doubt that this is mainly driven by social contagion? We've seen situations before where a diagnosis catches on like wildfire when it's featured in the media. Multiple personality disorder, recovered memories, bulimia, the list goes on and on. Of course we know that suicide is contagious as well. And those things became contagious even through such negative portrayals in mass media. Compare that to the glorification of adopting a trans identity in media today! And social media especially. Aren't teenage girls the demographic that uses social media the most? And they're also known for having body issues - and all of a sudden we see them saying that they're born in the wrong body in exponentially increasing numbers.

Not all of these kids will end up getting sterilized and sliced up, but out of the ones that do there's gonna be a ton that never should have and it will be a tragedy. We know how all those fads/social contagions end up and it's not pretty, so I think we need to get started on that with this ASAP and try to get it over with and move forward but it's hard in such politically charged times.

Thank you progressives for setting society free from narrow minded conservatives. Was almost awesome though, Hillary could have knocked it out of the park for America and progressive values.

 

[Gandhi]

What about my post would be tongue in cheek? I'm genuinely heartbroken by the ultimate fate of the British people. Their ethnic passing is quite irreversible at this point barring WW3 and their police state strictly enforces some of the most extreme left dogma in human history.

I understand you were taking his post calling it TIC and then making it for realz. That was my point. No need to elaborate further as I am not trying to engage the "liberal trannies are allowing sharia in the west " faction of Sherdog.

 

[FIMN]

Thank you progressives for setting society free from narrow minded conservatives. Was almost awesome though, Hillary could have knocked it out of the park for America and progressive values.

The UK Conservative party are not progressive. Not in HRC. Both are centre right.

Fuck this forum really is full of ignorant retards.

 

[unimackpass]

The UK Conservative party are not progressive. Not in HRC. Both are centre right.

Fuck this forum really is full of ignorant retards.

I'm talking the retards selling this shit here in America. Go through all the threads concerning this crap and it's the conservatives fighting this shit and the progressives calling us bigots.

I started a lot of threads on this subject and know who the real retards are.

 

[FIMN]

I'm talking the retards selling this shit here in America. Go through all the threads concerning this crap and it's the conservatives fighting this shit and the progressives calling us bigots.

I started a lot of threads on this subject and know who the real retards are.

Is this out of any kind of understanding of transgenderism based on any kind of education? Or just outrage porn?

 

[Amerikuracana]

The money is experimenting with population control. Not kidding. That's what it is.

 

[Spoken]

I'm talking the retards selling this shit here in America. Go through all the threads concerning this crap and it's the conservatives fighting this shit and the progressives calling us bigots.

I started a lot of threads on this subject and know who the real retards are.

I mean, you can see what someone might assume this stuff is bigoted though right? Like, I have fairly conservative opinions on this stuff and whenever someone says that my paradigm is bigoted or whatever, I can't help but understand why think that. In the end, if you think the central tenants of contemporary queer theory are essentially correct, then I might well look like an oppressive mother fucker looking to take away your rights.
But then, I don't give a fuck about 'rights' because it's not a sustainable philosophical idiom. My own paradigm that substantiates my view of human dignity means I find the current cultural wave to be immoral or whatever.

What seems tough, and I think this is genuinely hilarious about secularism and the myth that religious ideology inherently separates culture and creates factions, is that the cultural and political space all of this gets hashed out in the West is generally "secular." I only mention this because I don't know what it means to come to a space where we all say, "right, I can't presume we have the same base presumptions about existence so we need to discuss it and clarify our positions," only to realize that void of the baggage of religion, we still cant clarify our positions to have a conversation... perhaps the left (and the right) assume their position to be genuinely and objectively obvious? As if reason necessitates going in their particular direction?

 

[Snake_Plissken]

That's criminal. Then again idiots believe everything they hear on bbc

 

[Bubzeh]

I'd like to know what's happened to the ones in 2009-2013 before the boom.

 

[Thycidides]

There have been numerous studies over the years showing that the vast majority of dysphoric kids grow out of it and live as their birth sex after puberty. Here's a few:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18194003/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21216800

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25231780

However, gender clinicians report a near 100% rate of persistence of trans identity when puberty blockers are used. That's why the Dutch researchers who started the practice advised against it, because there is the possibility of false positives. Regarding text books and doctors being way off....refer back to some of the things I mentioned in this thread. Multiple personality disorder, recovered memories, lobotomies. These are all things that doctors were on board with, until the wheels fell off. There are also a lot of professionals who are against this practice, but this is an extremely political issue and opposing child transition makes you basically a Nazi these days. Also, in some places they consider any type of treatment that doesn't affirm a child's self-diagnosed gender identity as "conversion therapy" which is illegal. My province of Ontario is like that and so are several states in the US. History won't look back on this practice fondly, let's just put it that way.

I read the abstracts you linked and none of them paint the over-prescription of these puberty blockers as some existential threat to western civilization much less a crises like the opiod crises in usa or the extremely high rate of suicide among First Nations in Canada and other places. You mentioned suicide among teens earlier and that seems like a bigger problem to be addressed than number of kids going to gender clinics in UK.

Now I can buy that there is a tendency to over medicalize gender issues but I think the solution is for schools and society in general to let kids be kids and not saddle them with gender expectations rather than banning medication. That would be like banning morphine to end Opiod addiction

In any case I'm not sure how you can say "History will not judge this practice kindly" when the practice in question is common place and widely accepted with few detractors in the medical community according to you. You can't even name these detractors are.

 

[Thycidides]

I find it kind of funny that conservative get so angry about these cultural issues but when you ask them what is to be done politically they have a hard time articulating a policy or pointing to allies in civil society.

Its always either the end of western civilization and nothing can be done, or these dumb liberals have no power are not a threat.

 

[Bald1]

Gender hypochondria.

 

[sangreporsangre]

I read the abstracts you linked and none of them paint the over-prescription of these puberty blockers as some existential threat to western civilization much less a crises like the opiod crises in usa or the extremely high rate of suicide among First Nations in Canada and other places. You mentioned suicide among teens earlier and that seems like a bigger problem to be addressed than number of kids going to gender clinics in UK.

Now I can buy that there is a tendency to over medicalize gender issues but I think the solution is for schools and society in general to let kids be kids and not saddle them with gender expectations rather than banning medication. That would be like banning morphine to end Opiod addiction

In any case I'm not sure how you can say "History will not judge this practice kindly" when the practice in question is common place and widely accepted with few detractors in the medical community according to you. You can't even name these detractors are.

Those studies show that gender non-conforming children usually identify as their birth sex after they go through puberty. So exposing children to the dangerous side effects of a prostate cancer drug while socially transitioning them is obviously gonna create false positives. Meaning, a bunch of people are gonna get sterilized and become lifetime medical patients who wouldn't otherwise if they were left alone. I can see how the pharmaceutical industry likes that, but that really doesn't concern you? I never said this was a bigger issue than the opiod crisis, so why did you build that strawman? Really weird.

You haven't really read through what I posted then if you don't understand the comment about history judging this "trans kid" phenomenon. The lobotomy was widely practiced at the time - hell the inventor of it even won the Nobel Prize - and how is that looked back on now? How are the people who prosecuted daycare workers for ritual satanic sexual abuse looked back on? Or the psychologists who convinced people that they were recovering memories of sexual abuse from their parents? The point of this thread was to point out that we are living through another situation exactly like those previously mentioned - a mass delusion, a mass hysteria. There are gonna be books, documentaries etc not to mention malpractice lawsuits on this one day, so you can remember how some guy on a karate forum brought it up and you dismissed his concerns.

As far as detractors, yea they're out there. Remember, it's politically incorrect to speak out against this, but some professionals are. Dr Debrah Soh is one, she's written a lot on the subject.

https://www.newsday.com/opinion/commentary/why-bans-on-conversion-therapy-are-misguided-1.13742599

That's just one of many articles she's written on the subject. I would really recommend this paper written by a clinical psychologist named Dr David Schwartz, where he outlines some of the potential dangers of "affirmative care" when it comes to so-called trans children.

https://autogynephiliatruth.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/schwartz-2012.pdf

We've also seen mental health professionals like Jordan Peterson and Paul McHugh speak out against pediatric gender transition. When the tide of public opinion turns, you're gonna see a lot more of them come out of the woodwork. The climate is just too highly politically charged right now.

 

[unimackpass]

Those studies show that gender non-conforming children usually identify as their birth sex after they go through puberty. So exposing children to the dangerous side effects of a prostate cancer drug while socially transitioning them is obviously gonna create false positives. Meaning, a bunch of people are gonna get sterilized and become lifetime medical patients who wouldn't otherwise if they were left alone. I can see how the pharmaceutical industry likes that, but that really doesn't concern you? I never said this was a bigger issue than the opiod crisis, so why did you build that strawman? Really weird.

You haven't really read through what I posted then if you don't understand the comment about history judging this "trans kid" phenomenon. The lobotomy was widely practiced at the time - hell the inventor of it even won the Nobel Prize - and how is that looked back on now? How are the people who prosecuted daycare workers for ritual satanic sexual abuse looked back on? Or the psychologists who convinced people that they were recovering memories of sexual abuse from their parents? The point of this thread was to point out that we are living through another situation exactly like those previously mentioned - a mass delusion, a mass hysteria. There are gonna be books, documentaries etc not to mention malpractice lawsuits on this one day, so you can remember how some guy on a karate forum brought it up and you dismissed his concerns.

As far as detractors, yea they're out there. Remember, it's politically incorrect to speak out against this, but some professionals are. Dr Debrah Soh is one, she's written a lot on the subject.

https://www.newsday.com/opinion/commentary/why-bans-on-conversion-therapy-are-misguided-1.13742599

That's just one of many articles she's written on the subject. I would really recommend this paper written by a clinical psychologist named Dr David Schwartz, where he outlines some of the potential dangers of "affirmative care" when it comes to so-called trans children.

https://autogynephiliatruth.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/schwartz-2012.pdf

We've also seen mental health professionals like Jordan Peterson and Paul McHugh speak out against pediatric gender transition. When the tide of public opinion turns, you're gonna see a lot more of them come out of the woodwork. The climate is just too highly politically charged right now.

It's amazing that this has to be spelled out to people but here we are.

 

[cabal]

You haven't really read through what I posted then if you don't understand the comment about history judging this "trans kid" phenomenon. The lobotomy was widely practiced at the time - hell the inventor of it even won the Nobel Prize - and how is that looked back on now? How are the people who prosecuted daycare workers for ritual satanic sexual abuse looked back on?

They will performer frontal lobotomy over who is not agree with the butchery of all those poor childrens.

 

[sangreporsangre]

They will performer frontal lobotomy over who is not agree with the butchery of all those poor childrens.

Yea they'll take you to room 101 for re-education. Hell here in Ontario, Child Services can take your kid from you if you don't affirm their "authentic self".

 

[Thycidides]

Those studies show that gender non-conforming children usually identify as their birth sex after they go through puberty. So exposing children to the dangerous side effects of a prostate cancer drug while socially transitioning them is obviously gonna create false positives. Meaning, a bunch of people are gonna get sterilized and become lifetime medical patients who wouldn't otherwise if they were left alone. I can see how the pharmaceutical industry likes that, but that really doesn't concern you? I never said this was a bigger issue than the opiod crisis, so why did you build that strawman? Really weird.

You haven't really read through what I posted then if you don't understand the comment about history judging this "trans kid" phenomenon. The lobotomy was widely practiced at the time - hell the inventor of it even won the Nobel Prize - and how is that looked back on now? How are the people who prosecuted daycare workers for ritual satanic sexual abuse looked back on? Or the psychologists who convinced people that they were recovering memories of sexual abuse from their parents? The point of this thread was to point out that we are living through another situation exactly like those previously mentioned - a mass delusion, a mass hysteria. There are gonna be books, documentaries etc not to mention malpractice lawsuits on this one day, so you can remember how some guy on a karate forum brought it up and you dismissed his concerns.

As far as detractors, yea they're out there. Remember, it's politically incorrect to speak out against this, but some professionals are. Dr Debrah Soh is one, she's written a lot on the subject.

https://www.newsday.com/opinion/commentary/why-bans-on-conversion-therapy-are-misguided-1.13742599

That's just one of many articles she's written on the subject. I would really recommend this paper written by a clinical psychologist named Dr David Schwartz, where he outlines some of the potential dangers of "affirmative care" when it comes to so-called trans children.

https://autogynephiliatruth.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/schwartz-2012.pdf

We've also seen mental health professionals like Jordan Peterson and Paul McHugh speak out against pediatric gender transition. When the tide of public opinion turns, you're gonna see a lot more of them come out of the woodwork. The climate is just too highly politically charged right now.

If other issues are more important why make this thread ? It seems to me banning these puberty inhibitors would be like banning morphine so I brought it up the Opiod crises . Just like some people have a legitimate need for morphine some people have a legitimate need for these medications.

You are making a lot of assumptions of wrongdoing based off a few studies and a Tabloid story mentioned in the OP . I read the newsday article as well and that doesn't mention banning these inhibitors at all. It suggests another treatment option but it doesn't call for a ban of these procedures or some other policy president or PM needs to implement . It doesn't suggest that this is anything like lots of people getting lobotomies for no reason or that there is widespread fraud and abuse.

Also your logic doesn't make any sense- in order for there to be changes in science and exper opinion it HAS to be politicized. There needs to be a big effort to bring attention to the public similar to what Al Gore did with Climate change etc

 

[Thycidides]

Yea they'll take you to room 101 for re-education. Hell here in Ontario, Child Services can take your kid from you if you don't affirm their "authentic self".

And what have you done about it?

 

[sangreporsangre]

If other issues are more important why make this thread ? It seems to me banning these puberty inhibitors would be like banning morphine so I brought it up the Opiod crises . Just like some people have a legitimate need for morphine some people have a legitimate need for these medications.

You are making a lot of assumptions of wrongdoing based off a few studies and a Tabloid story mentioned in the OP . I read the newsday article as well and that doesn't mention banning these inhibitors at all. It suggests another treatment option but it doesn't call for a ban of these procedures or some other policy president or PM could do. It doesn't suggest that this is anything like lots of people getting lobotomies for no reason or widespread fraud and abuse.

Lmao, seriously? If it's not as important as the opiod crisis than we *shouldn't* make a thread on it on a freakin mma forum? Hell we should shut the whole mma section and training subforums and the Mayberry then, to meet your standards. Your morphine analogy is a false comparison anyway. Nobody would deny that there are legitimate uses for morphine. I'm not saying that Lupron should be completely banned, it has uses in treating prostate cancer for example. But using it on pre-pubescent children to chemically suppress their puberty? That's twisted. Especially when we see that puberty itself is the best cure for gender dysphoria in kids.

I didn't quote the tabloid story in the OP. I don't think you actually read what I've posted. I posted a fact-check article and the actual stats from Tavistock. The article didn't mention puberty blockers, it talked about social transition of pre-pubescent children. All of the negative aspects of that (how it leads to false positives) are amplified when you chemically suppress the natural process of puberty in these same kids.

Anyway I don't know why you're so fixated on the puberty blockers. That's one aspect of this issue. I posed an open question in the OP: do you think this exponential increase in trans identification is caused by social contagion or not? Also don't know why you fixate only on what a President or PM can do. I stated my opinion that this is more of a cultural issue than a political one. Although another political solution to this imo would be to re-do the conversion therapy bans on the books to exclude the term "gender identity". But other than that, it's gonna take more people speaking out against it, it's gonna take media coverage of people who have desisted from trans identity, and giving more of a platform to arguments against this insane phenomenon. Slowly but surely it will happen (like it has with those other things I mentioned e.g. lobotomies or recovered memories), I just want it to happen sooner rather than later. Which is why I try to spark discussions on it.