Elections 2016 Democratic National Convention

[TheStruggle]

If Trump wants to steal Sanders supporters, he has to come out strong against the TPP. Alot of democrats hate the TPP and Hillary continues to support it

 

[HunterSdVa29]

Having a more educated society isn't inherently a bad thing.

it is if it's largely liberal studies and things like that being studied

 

[HunterSdVa29]

of course Bernie capitulated like a bitch, a) he's for giving away shit to people that didn't earn it, and B) he already let the two BLM protesters hijack his stage, showing the lack of respect he commands and balls he possesses

 

[Trotsky]

I'll check out the documentary. But you are wrong about me. I may promote capitalism but in my ideal world and under ideal circumstances I support socialism. The problem is we/society isn't fit yet to my liking of what I consider "ideal circumstances" and as such I feel it is better to maintain a degree of capitalism.

If I misjudged, I apologize. However, your rhetoric on racial and ethnic hierarchy are completely contrary to a just society and with socialist perspective.

Also, socialism inherently has a "degree of capitalism". The two models being diametrically opposed is a myth: the former is merely an evolution of the latter.

 

[robotsonic]

And as usual people who have done nothing and will do nothing with their lives will hate on them. Often envious of the hardworking cause they are so stupid ,poor and lazy.

I've worked in finance for 20 years, if you think it's hard work you haven't got a clue.

 

[Amerikuracana]

It's been a damaging clown-show. I don't think Hillary will win.

 

[JonesBones]

It's been a damaging clown-show. I don't think Hillary will win.

I still think Hillary will win but Michael Moore of all people made an interesting point recently. The Jesse Ventura effect. Like, why not? Elect a pro wrestler or Donald Trump. Moore put more thought into it than I care to now but I thought it was a good point and one I hadn't thought of. I see the comparison to Jesse Ventura. Moore also thinks Hillary will lose.

 

[JonesBones]

Here's the Moore piece:

The Jesse Ventura Effect. Finally, do not discount the electorate’s ability to be mischievous or underestimate how any millions fancy themselves as closet anarchists once they draw the curtain and are all alone in the voting booth. It’s one of the few places left in society where there are no security cameras, no listening devices, no spouses, no kids, no boss, no cops, there’s not even a friggin’ time limit. You can take as long as you need in there and no one can make you do anything. You can push the button and vote a straight party line, or you can write in Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck. There are no rules. And because of that, and the anger that so many have toward a broken political system, millions are going to vote for Trump not because they agree with him, not because they like his bigotry or ego, but just because they can. Just because it will upset the apple cart and make mommy and daddy mad. And in the same way like when you’re standing on the edge of Niagara Falls and your mind wonders for a moment what would that feel like to go over that thing, a lot of people are going to love being in the position of puppetmaster and plunking down for Trump just to see what that might look like. Remember back in the ‘90s when the people of Minnesota elected a professional wrestler as their governor? They didn’t do this because they’re stupid or thought that Jesse Ventura was some sort of statesman or political intellectual. They did so just because they could. Minnesota is one of the smartest states in the country. It is also filled with people who have a dark sense of humor — and voting for Ventura was their version of a good practical joke on a sick political system. This is going to happen again with Trump.

http://michaelmoore.com/trumpwillwin/

I'm not voting for Trump but I am one of those guys he is talking about. lol. John Cleese recently had a great line on Twitter. He supported the Brexit. He said his beliefs are whatever amuses him. I am like that too. My beliefs are what amuse me at the time.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

I think its a wrap, the populist part of the right will win this election. These scandals are too much to ignore, you can't just blatantly rig an election, get caught, and act like nothing happened....that's not how this shit works

Granted, Bill had many a scandal running in 92 as well (weed, mistresses out the ass already), but he also has charm, personality, charisma, and people actually like him. Literally none of that applies to Hillary, she's in fact the opposite of that. And condescending on top of that

Its a wrap

 

[JonesBones]

I think its a wrap, the populist part of the right will win this election. These scandals are too much to ignore, you can't just blatantly rig an election, get caught, and act like nothing happened....that's not how this shit works

Granted, Bill had many a scandal running in 92 as well (weed, mistresses out the ass already), but he also has charm, personality, charisma, and people actually like him. Literally none of that applies to Hillary, she's in fact the opposite of that. And condescending on top of that

Its a wrap

And Donald Trump is one of the few guys she can beat. I despise Hillary Clinton and am one of the biggest contrarians I know but to seriously make a case for Trump is sophism. He could win but even a troll like me knows this guy is an idiot.

Slow and steady will probably win the race here. Which is Hillary. I will not vote but if I had to it would be Hillary over Trump.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Jack, I don't disagree with you here. It was obvious from the beginning that Bernie would support Hillary because in doing so he at least inches toward the platform he was gunning for. However, is there no merit in being disappointed that the passionate arguments he made against corporate interests, rejection of TPP, and many others and then rolling over for someone who is very much the embodiment of the political elite class is effectively being chalked up to a typical run of the mill campaign cycle?

I simply don't agree that Clinton represents "corporate interests" in any meaningful way. Bernie won on the TPP thing (not necessarily a good thing, but it's not a big deal and an acceptable price to pay, IMO). And I'd say that small change in the direction you want to go is way better than huge change in the opposite direction. I think Bernie should be really proud. He built a movement from nothing and had a major influence in the direction of the party. He didn't go down without a fight. He just fought meaningfully rather than vindictively and self-destructively. In another thread, I said that Clinton was RDA when the left wants Jay R. Palmer. The same applies to Bernie here.

All of this is compounded by the fact that the primary was actually literally being led by someone slanted against him. I agree he lost fairly squarely, but none of that stinks to you?

If there were evidence of actual inappropriate actions taken (rather than just snide comments made), that would stink to me. I'm not saying there isn't. Just haven't seen that. Like, the debate timing and scheduled seemed fucked up, but then they changed it after complaints. Do you focus on the original problems or the fact that they got fixed?

Bernie's appeal was that he was different, in the end, he was not. In the end, Bernie led many naive people to believe he wouldn't bow down, but he did, to the very type of person he told his followers to rail against.

Bernie appealed to different people for different reasons. The man himself cares a fuckload about his perception of fairness and about regulating finance.

Yes, he took her farther to the left. Yes, voting for her, in his supporters minds, is better than voting for trump. But isn't this the very "team" type of politics you've said is dividing the country.

I don't remember saying that. I think that people tend to not understand that others disagree with them. Like, there's a perception that we know what the right thing to do is, but some people are just too evil to do it rather than an understanding that Americans don't agree about what the right thing is. I'd call for more empathy, but I wouldn't have any expectation that that would lead to universal agreement.

To me, Cruz is a total POS that I can't stand to even look at, but a part of me admires the fact that he was going to stand alone on what he believed was right. And that belief was more important to him than the team.

What principle, though? Trump was a colossal dick to Cruz, and Cruz wasn't going to help him. I think Cruz also sees Trump as not a true conservative and an idiot, but I think if Trump didn't go sooo far in attacking him, Cruz would have been on board.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

And Donald Trump is one of the few guys she can beat. I despise Hillary Clinton and am one of the biggest contrarians I know but to seriously make a case for Trump is sophism. He could win but even a troll like me knows this guy is an idiot.

Slow and steady will probably win the race here. Which is Hillary. I will not vote but if I had to it would be Hillary over Trump.

George W Bush won......

Twice

 

[JonesBones]

George W Bush won......

Twice

Things are changing, man. I actually haven't been following politics closely but sunbelt states for example are a toss up. Actually leaning Democrat:


“This shift was probably coming anyway because of the changing demographics of the Sunbelt, but Trump radically accelerates it on both ends,” said long-time Democratic strategist Paul Begala, a senior adviser to the pro-Clinton Priorities USA political action committee.


The trend was underlined last week by the release of a flurry of NBC/Marist College/Wall Street Journal polls that showed Trump even with Clinton in Ohio and just narrowly behind in Iowa, while lagging by virtually identical margins of six to nine percentage points in Virginia, North Carolina, and Florida in the Southeast, and Colorado in the Southwest.

Political strategists in both parties generally rank those four states, plus Nevada, as the five true swing states in the Sunbelt. New Mexico, a sixth Sunbelt state, was competitive during the George W. Bush years, but both sides now place it safely in the Democratic camp. Together, the five most competitive Sunbelt states offer 72 Electoral College votes (led by Florida with 29).

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/07/trumps-path-through-the-rustbelt/491699/

 

[ncordless]

Crowd was a little unruly. Had mikes next to Bernie supporters who booed Hillary. Several times where a B

Jack, I don't disagree with you here. It was obvious from the beginning that Bernie would support Hillary because in doing so he at least inches toward the platform he was gunning for. However, is there no merit in being disappointed that the passionate arguments he made against corporate interests, rejection of TPP, and many others and then rolling over for someone who is very much the embodiment of the political elite class is effectively being chalked up to a typical run of the mill campaign cycle?

If you noticed, the rejection of TPP won. It's on the platform, Hillary has come out against it, and the crowd loved it.

Bernie's campaign wasn't run of the mill. It was very impressive, and is one of the few losing campaigns I can think of that had such an impact on the party platform and the winning candidate's positions.

Bernie is and has always been a politician. People who thought otherwise are just silly. Politicians end up having to make compromises. All of them . . . except maybe Ted Cruz who will shut down the government, or speak out against his party's nominee to fan his own ego at the expense of the greater good.

 

[ncordless]

I think its a wrap, the populist part of the right will win this election. These scandals are too much to ignore, you can't just blatantly rig an election, get caught, and act like nothing happened....that's not how this shit works

Granted, Bill had many a scandal running in 92 as well (weed, mistresses out the ass already), but he also has charm, personality, charisma, and people actually like him. Literally none of that applies to Hillary, she's in fact the opposite of that. And condescending on top of that

Its a wrap

How was the election blatantly rigged?

The Dem leadership obviously preferred Hillary to Bernie. And of course they would. Hillary is a lifelong Dem and has been out there raising money with and for down-ballot candidates. Bernie joined the Dems just to run and has done a pretty poor job of helping down-ballot candidates with no real plan to lift the whole boat in the general. Bernie's campaign was all about Bernie and his revolution, not about winning up and down. That the people in charge would prefer Hillary is a no-brainer.

 

[Deleted member 429137]

What a difference between the two conventions. Dems have their shit together.

 

[Deleted member 429137]

it is if it's largely liberal studies and things like that being studied

Lots of conservatives view science as leftist. It's fucking ridiculous.

 

[TheStruggle]

What a difference between the two conventions. Dems have their shit together.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA......HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[HunterSdVa29]

How was the election blatantly rigged?

The Dem leadership obviously preferred Hillary to Bernie. And of course they would. Hillary is a lifelong Dem and has been out there raising money with and for down-ballot candidates. Bernie joined the Dems just to run and has done a pretty poor job of helping down-ballot candidates with no real plan to lift the whole boat in the general. Bernie's campaign was all about Bernie and his revolution, not about winning up and down. That the people in charge would prefer Hillary is a no-brainer.

the media coverage of it certainly was, it was obvious. Any Left leaning show (which is virtually everything but MSNBC and Fox News) went OUT OF THEIR WAY to avoid mentioning Bernie and his policies. In fact, they'd mention Hilary's views on those issues, w/o even bringing up Bernie's name....

That is as egregious as it gets IMO

 

[ncordless]

the media coverage of it certainly was, it was obvious. Any Left leaning show (which is virtually everything but MSNBC and Fox News) went OUT OF THEIR WAY to avoid mentioning Bernie and his policies. In fact, they'd mention Hilary's views on those issues, w/o even bringing up Bernie's name....

That is as egregious as it gets IMO

They've actually done studies on this. It is true that Bernie was mentioned less, especially early on. The dems got less coverage in general early on, and Hillary as frontrunner got the larger share. That evened out later in the campaign as the GOP race died down and Bernie's momentum gained.

On the other hand, those same studies showed that Bernie got BY FAR the most favorable treatment as far as positive vs. negative coverage. A big part of this was because Bernie ran clean. But the fact remains, no candidate got a higher percentage of favorable coverage than Bernie.