Why do big guys never shoot first???

[Cash Bill 52]

I mean, I get it. You don't want to get squashed in a sprawl and bigger guys seem to counter well. I see a lot of super/ultra heavyweight bjj guys do "bad judo." They just stand forehead to forehead holding onto a sleeve and lapel and try to snap down or try to grab a leg.

I am considered big at 205 pounds, but not really. Once guys get to around 230 I would consider them big. A strategy I use against super big guys is to hold them off on the feet long enough for the clock to run down, then pull guard. If I can't get a sweep or submission, I just stay active. Winning by advantage or ref decision isn't very glorious, but damn; what else should I do with those big mo fo's?

Thanks from a pretty big guy.

 

[lechien]

Learn some judo?

Actually I blame the rules. There is nothing really that forces people to fight for a takedown.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

Yes, I work on judo. I have a few moves. In a judo match if my seoi nage fails, I can just turtle and wait for a stand up. Osoto gari is a little safer.
My guess is that I would need years of regular judo practice for me to feel safe in an absolute black belt masters match.

Learn some judo?

Actually I blame the rules. There is nothing really that forces people to fight for a takedown.

 

[QingTian]

There are diminishing returns to strength, pound for pound, as your size goes up. That is, big guys have a harder time accelerating. So they aren't going to be changing levels and shooting as much.

The same thing happens in Judo as well. Big guys tend to be more upright and do less drop techniques. These are all techniques that require speed and some element of surprise.

The other thing said is that in BJJ the top position favors the heavy guy, as for the same reasons it's harder to get a sweep than in lightweight category. Or maybe I should say bottom is better in lightweight, since it's easier to give up points.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

I think this is why I consider myself a medium sized guy. I'm one of the bigger guys in my academy, but in the absolute division I find myself one of the smaller. Although there are some smaller beasts who sign up for absolute, I usually go against super heavy or ultra heavy guys.
Also, masters matches are 5 minutes, so I don't have a lot of time to get stuff done. If my opponent gets an advantage on me, I'm in trouble.

There are diminishing returns to strength, pound for pound, as your size goes up. That is, big guys have a harder time accelerating. So they aren't going to be changing levels and shooting as much.

The same thing happens in Judo as well. Big guys tend to be more upright and do less drop techniques. These are all techniques that require speed and some element of surprise.

The other thing said is that in BJJ the top position favors the heavy guy, as for the same reasons it's harder to get a sweep than in lightweight category. Or maybe I should say bottom is better in lightweight, since it's easier to give up points.

 

[lts5025]

Yes, I work on judo. I have a few moves. In a judo match if my seoi nage fails, I can just turtle and wait for a stand up. Osoto gari is a little safer.
My guess is that I would need years of regular judo practice for me to feel safe in an absolute black belt masters match.

The learning curve for judo is ridiculous, and if your opponent has 25+ pounds on you, technique becomes absolutely paramount. I think you'd get a better ROI with some wrestling takedowns. If you're worried about them sprawling, then something that you can chain off the sprawl would be appropriate. High crotch is my favorite.

Also, learning some trips or upper body takedowns will help too.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

Thanks. Yes, I've been working on some stuff. My wrestling game isn't so bad. I don't pull guard every time. (Insert smiley face)
I like the high crotch and I've been working on inside and outside trips.
Another strategy is to just frustrate the big guy and let him pull guard. I can usually use my speed to get into a good passing or adavatage obtaining position.
I am just trying to think about ways to beat the big guy. That's what jiu Jitsu is designed for, right?

The learning curve for judo is ridiculous, and if your opponent has 25+ pounds on you, technique becomes absolutely paramount. I think you'd get a better ROI with some wrestling takedowns. If you're worried about them sprawling, then something that you can chain off the sprawl would be appropriate. High crotch is my favorite.

Also, learning some trips or upper body takedowns will help too.

 

[Oleg Raktatov]

I have accomplished nothing special and didnt win anything big in comps.
So take this as you see fit.


But for background

-i am a judo black belt from Montreal Shidokan club since 2007.

-bjj black belt inthe Rigan lineage

-have some certifications in sambo



To dominate the gi game, you need grip fighting skills. It changes everything.


If well suppervised, its low efforts high reward technique wise, but lots of repetitions.


I think Jimmy Pedro made a decent dvd on this years ago.


Then the good news is you can combine that skill with an ankle pick, a snap down and a tani otoshi, and you will rock !


Been teaching this for years and it seem to work.

Cheers

 

[Cash Bill 52]

Thank you, sir. Yes, learning solid grip fighting would be great. Ankle picks are awesome!

I have accomplished nothing special and didnt win anything big in comps.
So take this as you seem fit.


But for background

-i am a judo black belt from Montreal Shidokan club since 2007.

-bjj black belt inthe Rigan lineage

-have some certifications in sambo



To dominate the gi game, you need grip fighting skills. It changes everything.


If well suppervised, its low efforts high reward technique wise, but lots of repetitions.


I think Jimmy Pedro made a decent dvd on this years ago.


Then the good news is you can combine that skill with an ankle pick, a snap down and a tani otoshi, and you will rock !


Been teaching this for years and it seem to work.

Cheers

 

[Oleg Raktatov]

Thank you, sir. Yes, learning solid grip fighting would be great. Ankle picks are awesome!

I guess i am just trying to say that grip fighting is an art in itself, underestimated and it will make you dominate the stand up part until a mistake (opening) is created.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

Thank you. I'm watching Jimmy Pedro right now.

Check out this video on YouTube:

I guess i am just trying to say that grip fighting is an art in itself, underestimated and it will make you dominate the stand up part until a mistake (opening) is created.

 

[Oleg Raktatov]

Thank you. I'm watching Jimmy Pedro right now.

Check out this video on YouTube:

Thats the one !

The original dvd was made with Rhadi Fergusson


Gotta love them jeans !

 

[MaxMMA]

The Low single is a great move to use against a larger opponent. If they have a significant size advantage i don't even tie up, just use your speed from the outside.

 

[rmongler]

He's done some more recent appearances too.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

So, just don't let anybody get grips on me. Genius. I know what I want to work on now. Thanks, very cool!

 

[Oleg Raktatov]

So, just don't let anybody get grips on me. Genius. I know what I want to work on now. Thanks, very cool!

Actually, if i may ; impose your grips by, at the same time, denying them their own grips.

Its also, as you know, the same thing on the ground. If as a bigger guy, i get you in my closed guard and start tying you up close to me, imposing the cross grip on ypur arm ; next step is you going flying from an easy sweep. But if you decide to pass you will break my grip, impose yours and fight to keep a straight strong good posture... exact same thing on the feet.
Stay straight up, impose yourself and fight.

Then swiftly attack with your favourite techniques (dont need many) and dont play the "wait around" game they will try to impose on you.

Keep them on the edge. They will tired out and make mistakes... or they will pull guard ! Lol

 

[ArtemV]

So, just don't let anybody get grips on me. Genius. I know what I want to work on now. Thanks, very cool!

Remember: grip their sleeve before they grab yours!

 

[Cash Bill 52]

Wouldn't you know it? The big guy in my division dropped out and a new guy came in. This one started judo at 3 years old. With only one guy in my division I have to rethink my strategy. This is still very good information. Maybe I can implement these techniques in the absolute division.

Edit... actually I can still use these strategies even when I have a disadvantage in the stand up.

 

[Russky]

I think this is why I consider myself a medium sized guy

FYI: Judo weight categories.

Lightweight (-63 kg/-139 lbs), Half-Middleweight (-70 kg/-154 lbs), Middleweight (-80 kg/-176 lbs), Half-Heavyweight (-93 kg/-205 lbs), Heavyweight (Over 93 kg/205 lbs)

Both 205 and 230 are fat monsters.

 

[Cash Bill 52]

Ha! I would definitely cut 1 pound to get to 204!

206 vs. 260 doesn't seem very fair...

I would like to think of my jiu Jitsu as technique over strength. However, we all know the reality. Big technical guys > smaller technical guys. (When technique is equal)

FYI: Judo weight categories.

Lightweight (-63 kg/-139 lbs), Half-Middleweight (-70 kg/-154 lbs), Middleweight (-80 kg/-176 lbs), Half-Heavyweight (-93 kg/-205 lbs), Heavyweight (Over 93 kg/205 lbs)

Both 205 and 230 are fat monsters.