Who is the best HW submission practicioner?

[HI SCOTT NEWMAN]

Oleksiy Oliynyk

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

1. Werdum
2. Big Nog
3. Frank Mir
4. Fedor
5. Barnett

2 and 3 are so close IMO and it can oscillate back and forth. I would love to see young prime Big Nog vs Mir and see how the grappling exchanges are like

I actually think the question of who is a better submission artist between Mir and Nog was definitively answered.

 

[DCarf]

I'm not technica enough to give a correct answer but I would be terrified to go to the ground with Mir over any of the others

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Frank is the most dangerous submission specialist as he'll always just "go for it".
Sometimes he gets pounded in the face for his effort, and other times he breaks your arm.
In terms of pure submissions it's probably Frank.

In terms of overall grappling, which includes the defensive game just as much as the offensive game, Nog or Werdum.
Both had things they were better at then the other but they were both well rounded and cerebral grapplers.

I like the way you differentiate the strengths of various fighters in different areas of grappling here.

 

[DCarf]

I actually think the question of who is a better submission artist between Mir and Nog was definitively answered.

Yeah and Mir was rocked and about to be submitted so I think him being better then Nog is a definitive answer

 

[illegalnature]

Werdum. I almost want to say by far. People have purposely taken Mir and Nog down plenty of times. Werdum is someone nobody attempts a ground exchange with. Nelson is a beast at BJJ but vs. Werdum he would knock him down with a strike but even while he was standing up he still took 1 step and immediately was defending armbars/triangles and disengaged without even attempting to get on top.

Overeem is my dude but he avoided Werdum like the grnd is hot lava. Yet didn't hesitate to take struve down and tko him from guard in 1 rnd.

Say what you want bout mehico and cardio but Cain spends a LOT of time on the ground and wins. Its his happy place. He spent 20 seconds on ground with Werdum and tapped.

Fedor has spent like 8 hours total on ground with people. 60 seconds on the ground with Werdum....he tapped.

Maia has back packed people for long amounts of time with no sub. Let Werdum chill on your back for 3 minutes see if you don't get tapped.

Lastly most bjj guys don't sub other top ground fighters often. Yea mir subbed Lesnar and Maia subbed Condit....but Werdum has subbed people like Fedor and Cain who no fighter would see themselves winning by being on the bottom of these peoples aggressive top game.

 

[MMA__Analyst]

I'm not technica enough to give a correct answer but I would be terrified to go to the ground with Mir over any of the others

I would agree. The submissions he utilizes are much more painful and have long term effects like broken bones and etc... Leglocks, toelocks, armbars, and etc... I think its a fact that he's afflcited more broken bones than anyone in the UFC. The dude is very dangerous

 

[HelloJapan]

Should at least mention Oleksiy.
55 wins 45 via sub. That makes it 82% of his wins by subs.
holds the record for most Ezekiel choke wins in MMA competition, with ten.

Fucking this.

 

[ArtemV]

I would still like to see Werdum school Mir's ignorant ass at grappling.

 

[MMA__Analyst]

Can't believe I forgot Oleksiy. The dude may have fought alot of cans but theres no denying that he has some of the best BJJ in the HW division. 82% of his wins come by submission, he has the most ezekiel chokes and the only ezekiel choke in UFC, he submitted Travis Browne, Mirko Cro Cop, and Jeff Mosnon who is an incredible grappler and submission specialist.

Jeff Monson should also be up there among the best submission practitioners in the HW division.

 

[Taric]

Werdum is someone nobody attempts a ground exchange with.

Fun fact: Nogueira was submitted in the 2nd fight after the exact same set-up Werdum attempted in the 4th gif I just posted from the 1st fight.

The difference between the two fights was from 2006-2013 Nogueira had been through 22 different and separate surgeries. Many of them on his hips and knees.

 

[Scorius]

OMG! The man is Alexey Oleynik

 

[Gambit MMA]

what made barnett good was he had a solid takedown and he was strong as hell and tough to deal with. very imposing especially when he was on the juice. that combined with the skills he had on the mat were kinda unique. very underrated imo

still tho, probably werdum. at least guys would try to gnp or get into the guard of mir, fedor, and nog. with werdum no one wants to even try its a reputation thing. he doesnt have the best takedowns outta the list and wasnt the strongest but his guard game is by far the best.

 

[wufabufa]

Should at least mention Oleksiy.
55 wins 45 via sub. That makes it 82% of his wins by subs.
holds the record for most Ezekiel choke wins in MMA competition, with ten.

As of late he's the only one really subbing people at HW on a consistent basis.

 

[MMA__Analyst]

he doesnt have the best takedowns outta the list and wasnt the strongest but his guard game is by far the best.

Agreed. Big Nog is known for having one of the best and most dangerous guards in MMA, and Fedor spent two entire fights pounding Big Nog in his guard and was never submitted. All it took was less than a minute into the first round inside Werdums guard for werdum to submit fedor

 

[Taric]

Agreed. Big Nog is known for having one of the best and most dangerous guards in MMA, and Fedor spent two entire fights pounding Big Nog in his guard and was never submitted. All it took was less than a minute into the first round inside Werdums guard for werdum to submit fedor

I'd argue Nog is best known for his sweeps which are, imo, some of the best in MMA.

 

[Gambit MMA]

Agreed. Big Nog is known for having one of the best and most dangerous guards in MMA, and Fedor spent two entire fights pounding Big Nog in his guard and was never submitted. All it took was less than a minute into the first round inside Werdums guard for werdum to submit fedor

to be fair tho fedor had lost a step athletically and if he were younger probably could have scrambled or put more of an effort to get out of it. i think prime fedor that beat up nog could do the same to werdum.

i think fedor UD's him in a rematch if it happened right after cuz at that time werdum still was total dogshit on the feet.

 

[Coolidge]

I always wondered why he decided to stand and throw with so many good strikers because schaubjitsu is no joke on the ground.

Abu Schaubi is a wizard on the mat.

 

[Gregoire1]

Werdum
Nog
Oleynik
Mir
Barnett

 

[The Hash Slinging Slasher]

Toss up for me between mir and werdum