This isn't going to be a popular idea, but I don't think you can just discount a guy that pops.

[Jonny Ninja]

Look at the list of fighters that have tested positive. Some goats. Some decent guys. Some gatekeepers. Yes, it is cheating, and I agree with that 100%. But JJ, Silva, hell even Brock had something that made them great. I am going to pick Jones here, because he popped the most, and I am not a fan of him. The guy has never lost a fight. He got a DQ. He had a close one with Gus. I just don't think you can erase an entire career for getting busted for roids. And that is just talking about the guys that have been caught. No one really knows who is on the juice. 4 of the best. Silva, JJ, Fedor, GSP. I cannot say this list is any different because 2 popped. Overturn the tainted wins, fine them, suspend them. All that is ok with me. I just don't think you can ignore them as being great fighters.

fck them they are cheats and most will remember them as such. Bans should be far longer, but that doesn't suit the UFC

 

[moogie101]

The sad part is we'll never know & constantly argue about how much of Jones success came from cheating. But PEDs certainly allowed him to train harder & recover quicker which contributed significantly to his abilities in the Octagon. And repeatedly failing tests is where it gets a lot easier to discount a fighter's achievements.

I've said before but I think repeatedly failing tests should result in all wins being changed to N/C, no title reigns being recognised & no HOF qualification.

 

[Jonny Ninja]

I don't completely discount a guy for failing a test, but I do discount them a bit. Like I can't ignore cheating, but I still think Lance Armstrong is the best cyclist ever.

You're the only one that thinks this. One of sports biggest cheats and he has rightfully paid the price

 

[Ozze]

I think it's hard to ignore them because no one can say for sure how much of a difference does steroids make since MMA is such a complex sport. It envolves a lot of other things such as technique, fight IQ, heart, luck even, etc.

For instance, Lance Armstrong having drugs so he can pedal uphill is a huge advantage. He is somebody that is out of discussion for me in cycling (have no clue who is the best though since I never watched it).

So I don't discount those fighters, but it sure make them lose some points.

 

[Matthew Fedler]

I find this odd. I have no opinion.

But if you take a strong stance on PED use, how do you reconcile putting a PRIDE fighter on there? They were not tested and encouraged to use PEDs.

I also take a strong stance on due process and the presumption of innocence. He has fought plenty of times in the states at this point and never popped. Obviously he hasn’t been rigorously tested by the likes of USADA, but I stand by innocent until proven guilty.

Once someone has tested positive though (especially on multiple occasions) it casts a shadow of doubt over their entire career.

 

[Ruthless_swag]

I don't completely discount a guy for failing a test, but I do discount them a bit. Like I can't ignore cheating, but I still think Lance Armstrong is the best cyclist ever.

every cyclist juices so lance could very well be the best. I believe DC has never popped for peds so jones popping twice is a blemish on his record. Dc losing to him obviously affects his status as well but if dc beats stipe, he can proclaim that he is GoAT

 

[ANIM4L]

try a proper cycle and do something competitive, it'll answer all your questions

 

[cooks1]

I will completely write off any competitor in any sport that pops....................until they make an honest, full and complete account of their cheating. Regardless of whether it comes of their own accord or whether they are forced into a full contrition. Only at that point will I reconsider their greatness, now with the appropriate context.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

You're the only one that thinks this. One of sports biggest cheats and he has rightfully paid the price

No, I'm not. And it isn't clear at all that he is one of the sport's biggest cheats, unless by biggest you mean most successful. As far as the price he's paid, it doesn't concern me.

When it comes to Jon Jones, I think the guy is a bit of a dirty fighter, a fuck up outside of the cage who would probably be in jail if he weren't wealthy, and the best MMA fighter I've seen inside the cage. Does it diminish his accomplishments that he used PEDs? Yes, to me it does. Does it erase his accomplishments? No.

 

[GrantB13]

I don't care if a guy cheats, as long as he doesn't get caught. Do as much illegal shit as you can get away with, if you don't get busted then it's not illegal. Simple as that.

Murder is legal unless you get caught?

 

[markg171]

The people who tend to have the most vocal stance on anti-PEDs for GOAT status happen to generally be fans of the guys who need to eliminate the ones ahead of their favourite fighter and cannot do so based on accomplishments.

 

[Mike]

You don’t understand how sherdog works do you?

You gotta realize some haters here are so emotionally invested in certain fighters that they’re just waiting for them to stumble in some way so that they can have a reason to discredit them.

For example no one is gonna discredited Nogs legacy for pissing hot, or Brian Ortegas, or Josh Barnett’s.

But guys like Jonesy and Anderson get crucified because it’s a way to distract from the goat thing.

Sherdog doesn’t care about being reasonable, most are just looking for any excuse to bury a fighter they dislike while blindly nitriding their favourites.

Plenty of people discount Ortega and Barnett. Especially Josh, there have been many threads over the years discounting his accomplishments.

 

[private user]

I dont really care that he got caught. That just means so many others didnt get caught. Not like they're not all on something.

Hes still the best we've seen to date, failed tests or not. Hard to dispute what hes done, and I dont even like him