The All-Purpose Motorsports Thread

Bamboozled said:
I'm not into racing really, but I like Rally and Drift and I think Formula 1 is fascinating in some aspects. I just wish they had Rally where you raced against others and not the clock. It'd be incredibly dangerous but I'd dig it. Have guys with teams at checkpoints to refuel. That'd be rad IMO
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Didn't they have those stages? Where they do laps of a track in a head to head setting? I don't know for sure because I haven't followed rallying for years (Seb Loeb was probably on his way to his first championship).
 
Graverobber said:
Great race IMO.
Action, drama, mistakes, etc.
smh, Vettel's ego still his undoing.
no way he was making that late pass.
he would have finished 2nd.

and I would have loved to be a fly on the wall in the Red Bull facility after that fiasco.
hopefully, Ricciardo goes to Ferrari next year so Verstappen can crash out his new teammate, whoever that may be.
you can move one time on your line, not twice, not three times.
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Good on the guy for going for the W. Those lost points might hurt at the end of the year though. Similar to being Verstappen'ed last race.
 
snakedafunky said:
That is the second race in a row in which Verstappen just crashes around.
Also might still be considered a racing accident. He still should not change the direction that often.

That must have been a real bummer for Bottas. Would have given him the lead over Hamilton I think.
Vettel a bit too aggressive but that's the kind of stuff that makes a 4 times World Champion. He wasn't happy with second place.

Looks like Ferrari has the overall faster car this year. A few races now where Vettel was faster than both Mercedes.
Should be interesting.
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Verstappen has to get his shit together. It's bad enough to crash out with a competitor but taking out a team car that has proven to be faster is inexcusable.

Vettel hasn't learned anything either. He's lucky that Bottas didn't try to fight him for it or neither of them would have finished. Vettel was lucky to get 4th after flat spotting his tires like that. Hamilton just couldn't get into enjoying that win. He was late getting to the podium because he was talking to Bottas.

I liked Bottas' reply when he was asked how he would recover from this. Maybe 10 pints of beer.
Why doesn't Formula 1 have street sweepers for these races? When a safety car comes out the sweepers should be out instead of counting on course workers.
 
agreed. a piece of debris deprives Bottas of a well deserved win?
unacceptable IMO
 
ralphc1 said:
Verstappen has to get his shit together. It's bad enough to crash out with a competitor but taking out a team car that has proven to be faster is inexcusable.

Vettel hasn't learned anything either. He's lucky that Bottas didn't try to fight him for it or neither of them would have finished. Vettel was lucky to get 4th after flat spotting his tires like that. Hamilton just couldn't get into enjoying that win. He was late getting to the podium because he was talking to Bottas.

I liked Bottas' reply when he was asked how he would recover from this. Maybe 10 pints of beer.
Why doesn't Formula 1 have street sweepers for these races? When a safety car comes out the sweepers should be out instead of counting on course workers.
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His reputation does him no good at all, but Danny Ric should've get a free pass on the crash. He's the one following and has full view of the action.

In saying that, jeez Max, how many blocks are you going to run? And what happened to the team mantra of "you can race all you want, but make sure both cars finish?". ie. give each other room
 
Foppa21 said:
His reputation does him no good at all, but Danny Ric should've get a free pass on the crash. He's the one following and has full view of the action.

In saying that, jeez Max, how many blocks are you going to run? And what happened to the team mantra of "you can race all you want, but make sure both cars finish?". ie. give each other room
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Yes, when your teammate is obviously faster, let him go to try to get to the next car. When Max moved, he took all of the air/downforce away from Daniels car so his braking was ineffective.
 
Formula one needs a few of these placed strategically round the tracks.
210h-hero-image.jpg

They're small enough to get around. If they had 4 placed evenly around the track, each one starts on the right side and moves to the left when it reaches the point where another sweeper has already swept. Each sweeper would go half the distance around the circuit. They might even get a sweeper company to provide them for the advertising they get then they can be sold after the season or maybe even after each race to some local entity. Maybe each circuit has them or they contract with local companies.
 
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submit your proposal to the FIA, ralph.
it's amazing tracks don't have these now.
 
ralphc1 said:
Yes, when your teammate is obviously faster, let him go to try to get to the next car. When Max moved, he took all of the air/downforce away from Daniels car so his braking was ineffective.
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I'm not too sure about that.

Simplistically thinking, they were still a bit away from the corner so dirty air hadn't come into play yet.

If anything trying to break Ricciardo's slipstream should've increase his downforce and helped slow him down. I could be completely wrong though.

What messed him up was Max swerving back and forth trying to cover and ultimately taking away the space for both to get around the corner intact
 
Seb had to make that move. He was under pressure from ham. Max was at fault for that incident. Made too many moves. Magnussen is dangerous. He is going to kill someone.
 
Foppa21 said:
I'm not too sure about that.

Simplistically thinking, they were still a bit away from the corner so dirty air hadn't come into play yet.

If anything trying to break Ricciardo's slipstream should've increase his downforce and helped slow him down. I could be completely wrong though.

What messed him up was Max swerving back and forth trying to cover and ultimately taking away the space for both to get around the corner intact
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clean air is what helps enable downforce. disrupted air, like Ricciardo had, complicates it.
they were clearly in the braking zone as well.
 
Graverobber said:
clean air is what helps enable downforce. disrupted air, like Ricciardo had, complicates it.
they were clearly in the braking zone as well.
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But the air was disrupted to his benefit was it not? Given that he was using slipstream (and DRS) to pass. Sorry, probably a bit of a noob question. I would've thought that Max trying to break the slipstream would increase downforce of Ricciardo's and thus slow him down a bit. Do accept that his air was inconsistent given the swerving so he would've been at least a little bit unstable from that too.

Again, correct me if I'm wrong on the aero side. Max should've given room though. He's going to have a hard time taking turn 1 from the inside.. at least if he wants his sidepod to still be attached to him going into turn 2 there
 
aero, downforce, 'ground control' as it's often been called functions optimally when the incoming air is pure, clean and undisturbed. the various foils, wings, etc. are specifically designed to operate at a high level when these conditions exist. if the air in front of the vehicle is turbulent, there are gaps in the air flow and this causes all sorts of problems for a vehicle, primarily loss of expected control and maneuverability.

Verstappen changed his line at least twice ifo the oncoming Ricciardo, disrupting the air, depleting the effectiveness of the car's downforce, making it float rather than suck the ground, and ultimately loss of braking control and collision.

Verstappen IMO is a truly gifted driver and will excel once he gets his ego somewhat reined in.
 
Just read this quote from formula1.com. attributed to Ross Brawn:

“One of the key episodes of the Azerbaijan Grand Prix was the collision between team mates Daniel Ricciardo and Max Verstappen. I don’t want to comment on who might be held responsible or how a team should manage these issues during a race, but I do think the Steward’s decision to reprimand both drivers was the right course of action. But I would like to highlight a technical point. Once Daniel had settled for his line, and Max had changed direction once more, the Australian suddenly had to cope with a car that was very light at the front end due to the turbulent air generated by the leading Red Bull.

“In these conditions Daniel was no more than a passenger with few, if any, options to manage the situation: he could not change direction and the hard braking he tried would have had little chance of success. This highlighted once more the need of finding a way to re-write the rules so as to make the cars more raceable in these conditions. The decision of the Strategy Group and the F1 Commission taken yesterday, sanctioned by the FIA World Motor Sport Council, to approve a number of aerodynamic modifications, aimed at promoting closer racing and more overtaking, to the cars already for 2019 season is definitely an important step in the right direction.

“It’s also important to note that the decision has been taken after an intense period of research into the FIA’s initial proposals, which were made with the support of Formula and, conducted by a majority of the teams. A good spirit, a good way of working together for a better and more spectacular Formula 1, which is what the fans want.”
 
Graverobber said:
aero, downforce, 'ground control' as it's often been called functions optimally when the incoming air is pure, clean and undisturbed. the various foils, wings, etc. are specifically designed to operate at a high level when these conditions exist. if the air in front of the vehicle is turbulent, there are gaps in the air flow and this causes all sorts of problems for a vehicle, primarily loss of expected control and maneuverability.

Verstappen changed his line at least twice ifo the oncoming Ricciardo, disrupting the air, depleting the effectiveness of the car's downforce, making it float rather than suck the ground, and ultimately loss of braking control and collision.

Verstappen IMO is a truly gifted driver and will excel once he gets his ego somewhat reined in.
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I don't think Max's does him many favours these days. Dunno about ego, it's more the poor decision making. He'll get better with experience one hopes.

Also, reading back, I don't think I was too far off. I had classified it as instability of the car but I definitely didn't think about the ground effect on braking.
 
rearnakedchoke said:
Seb had to make that move. He was under pressure from ham. Max was at fault for that incident. Made too many moves. Magnussen is dangerous. He is going to kill someone.
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Seb had to make the move because he's a racer. I'm not sure though if he had enough time to set up to get close and set up a overtake in the next lap or 2 on the straights. In saying that, Bottas' tyres probably makes that point moot. He would've been very unlikely to get close enough to set up a pass.
 
like I said, I think Verstappen is a world class driver and future F1 world champ.
 
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