Metropolitan (1990) - Like The Breakfast Club but with college-aged yuppies

[drstrangelov]

Good movie, everybody's insufferable in it. I have used the line, "it's a composite, like in New York magazine" when caught being clueless on a topic. Nobody gets the reference.

 

[Guestx]

@shadow_priest_x

I don't really have a ton to say about the film to be honest.

Chloe Sevigny's character felt like she was supposed to be the logical progression of Audrey's from Metropolitan initially but then departed towards being more of a lost/confused soul but somehow that didn't make her endearing to me until very late in the film. But even then she felt more like a fuckup to me even if she did get her desired promotion/conclusion.

Kate Beckinsale's character fell flat for me even as the semi-bad guy; I felt nothing.

Chris Eigeman almost carried this movie for me but not quite. He played it a little too calm but delivered his dialogue with precision. They could of done a lot more with the fights with the bouncer and the club bust; it just seemed like an afterthought for this film.

I don't think people go from Audrey to Chloe's character; at least I hope not.

Felt almost like Metropolitan's writer/director started hanging out with Kevin Smith.

Bruh, I have to say, I thought this movie was an absolute NIGHTMARE. I hadn't gotten more than five minutes in when I was like, "Uh oh, I have a bad feeling about this shit."

You mentioned something about Midnight in Paris feeling like it was made for TV or something along those lines, well that is EXACTLY how I felt about this film: It seemed like a made-for-TV movie from the 90s. Everything from the lighting, to the performances, to the direction seemed C-class to me.

Stillman obviously did a great job with few resources with Metropolitan, but I felt like this one was a big bust. I just didn't care. I didn't care about the characters, I thought the plot was threadbare and there was nothing interesting in the way it was filmed. Is he a one-hit wonder? I guess I'd need to check out some of this other films before I can say that. But I read a comment where he said he was put in Director's Jail--if you're not familiar with it, that's a term used by directors when no one will hire them--for over 10 years after making this movie, and having now seen it I can understand why.

Apparently the movie has a 76% on Metacritic and Ebert gave it 3.5/4 stars, which absolutely stuns me. 1.5/4 is more like it.

This story has been done before, and done better, in 54. If you haven't seen that one, you really should. It's very similar in subject matter, but about 10x better in terms of quality.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Bruh, I have to say, I thought this movie was an absolute NIGHTMARE. I hadn't gotten more than five minutes in when I was like, "Uh oh, I have a bad feeling about this shit."

You mentioned something about Midnight in Paris feeling like it was made for TV or something along those lines, well that is EXACTLY how I felt about this film: It seemed like a made-for-TV movie from the 90s. Everything from the lighting, to the performances, to the direction seemed C-class to me.

Stillman obviously did a great job with few resources with Metropolitan, but I felt like this one was a big bust. I just didn't care. I didn't care about the characters, I thought the plot was threadbare and there was nothing interesting in the way it was filmed. Is he a one-hit wonder? I guess I'd need to check out some of this other films before I can say that. But I read a comment where he said he was put in Director's Jail--if you're not familiar with it, that's a term used by directors when no one will hire them--for over 10 years after making this movie, and having now seen it I can understand why.

Apparently the movie has a 76% on Metacritic and Ebert gave it 3.5/4 stars, which absolutely stuns me. 1.5/4 is more like it.

This story has been done before, and done better, in 54. If you haven't seen that one, you really should. It's very similar in subject matter, but about 10x better in terms of quality.

I'll check out 54.

I agree this felt a lot like a made for television film. I'm still going to check out Barcelona, I'll let you know if I really regret it.

Have you ever seen A Guide to Recognizing Your Saints? I have really mixed feelings about that film, mostly because it reminds me of my mother, but it's another period piece set in/around NY. I feel like it's pretty bad as a whole but really good at points --- which reminds me of 25th Hour as well.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Good movie, everybody's insufferable in it. I have used the line, "it's a composite, like in New York magazine" when caught being clueless on a topic. Nobody gets the reference.

I felt like Audrey was really endearing.

 

[Guestx]

I agree this felt a lot like a made for television film. I'm still going to check out Barcelona, I'll let you know if I really regret it.

Let me know if it's any good. Hopefully it's better than Disco.

Have you ever seen A Guide to Recognizing Your Saints? I have really mixed feelings about that film, mostly because it reminds me of my mother, but it's another period piece set in/around NY. I feel like it's pretty bad as a whole but really good at points --- which reminds me of 25th Hour as well.

I've heard of it but never did see it. At some point I may check it out.

 

[Guestx]

I felt like Audrey was really endearing.

Seeing her pop back up in The Last Days of Disco, if only for moment, was one of the film's very few highlights.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Let me know if it's any good. Hopefully it's better than Disco.

Just from the foreign setting he should of had a ton to work with; but I didn't like the ton of the trailer. So maybe not.

I've heard of it but never did see it. At some point I may check it out.

It's like a train wreck for me if I start watching it I finish it and then profess how bad it was to myself.


For anyone interested:

Spoiler

 

[Guestx]

Just from the foreign setting he should of had a ton to work with; but I didn't like the ton of the trailer. So maybe not.

All three of Stillman's first films were given Criterion releases. Probably should've just done Metropolitan and called it a day.

It's like a train wreck for me if I start watching it I finish it and then profess how bad it was to myself.

Looks interesting, I'll put it on the list.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Seeing her pop back up in The Last Days of Disco, if only for moment, was one of the film's very few highlights.

I was really disappointed she wasn't worked into the plot outside of that dance scene. At very minimum she deserved a talking role.

 

[Guestx]

I was really disappointed she wasn't worked into the plot outside of that dance scene. At very minimum she deserved a talking role.

Agreed. So I guess it was both a highlight and a disappointment. It's too bad Stillman couldn't find more for her to do.

As an aside, it was also kind of weird seeing Kate Beckinsale being so young.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

This story has been done before, and done better, in 54. If you haven't seen that one, you really should. It's very similar in subject matter, but about 10x better in terms of quality.

Yep, almost felt like a disco movie got the Goodfellas treatment. Not at that level but really high quality.

I was a bit lost at the end when he rejected Neve Campbell's character. She represented the scene, but less so than him, and she was clearly struggling with the 'bridge and tunnel' inferiority complex he was yet she still seemed sweet. It was almost like they cut her portion of the movie out. Selma Hayek's character was the worst of the bunch in my opinion.

Good film but the subject matter and time period is so foreign to me that it's hard for me to relate it back to me. If that makes any sense.

 

[Guestx]

Yep, almost felt like a disco movie got the Goodfellas treatment. Not at that level but really high quality.

I was a bit lost at the end when he rejected Neve Campbell's character. She represented the scene, but less so than him, and she was clearly struggling with the 'bridge and tunnel' inferiority complex he was yet she still seemed sweet. It was almost like they cut her portion of the movie out. Selma Hayek's character was the worst of the bunch in my opinion.

Good film but the subject matter and time period is so foreign to me that it's hard for me to relate it back to me. If that makes any sense.

Been a while since I last watched it, but I'm glad you gave it a look. From my recollection, it was a really interesting film about a fucking wild period of time in New York City. I mean, shit was just crazy then. I think, for me, one of the best parts of the movie was getting a glimpse into--as you say--a foreign world, which is pretty much what I also said about Metropolitan. It's getting that glimpse through the window.

In any case, I'm sure you agree that 54 >>> Last Days of Disco.

BTW, I'm glad you chimed back in because I have another movie recommendation for you. And in fact, I'd consider it something of a personal favor if you watched it. I just re-watched it a couple of nights ago and, unless I've just got you totally wrong, I think it's a film that you'd find interesting and would have some good thoughts on. Since I just checked it out again I'm eager to discuss it.

The trailer makes it out to be a romantic comedy--and in some ways it is--but it's also a pretty serious film in lot of ways, too. Let me know if you're interested.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Been a while since I last watched it, but I'm glad you gave it a look. From my recollection, it was a really interesting film about a fucking wild period of time in New York City. I mean, shit was just crazy then. I think, for me, one of the best parts of the movie was getting a glimpse into--as you say--a foreign world, which is pretty much what I also said about Metropolitan. It's getting that glimpse through the window.

In any case, I'm sure you agree that 54 >>> Last Days of Disco.

Certainly much better but it's an 'apples and oranges' comparison for me.

BTW, I'm glad you chimed back in because I have another movie recommendation for you. And in fact, I'd consider it something of a personal favor if you watched it. I just re-watched it a couple of nights ago and, unless I've just got you totally wrong, I think it's a film that you'd find interesting and would have some good thoughts on. Since I just checked it out again I'm eager to discuss it.

The trailer makes it out to be a romantic comedy--and in some ways it is--but it's also a pretty serious film in lot of ways, too. Let me know if you're interested.

I'll check it out this weekend.

 

[Guestx]

Certainly much better but it's an 'apples and oranges' comparison for me.

They're different but they're also about the end of a club scene. In fact, I could be wrong, but I assume that Last Days of Disco is inspired by the story of 54.

I'll check it out this weekend.

Cool. Give it a look.

Like I said, I think you'll connect with it.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

They're different but they're also about the end of a club scene. In fact, I could be wrong, but I assume that Last Days of Disco is inspired by the story of 54.

It's certainly the same setting but 54 was about the scene itself while The Last Days of Disco just used it as a weak backdrop. One was a dialogue driven character piece and the other was a high energy drama.

I'm not defending the film, you're certainly right about it, but it's a rough comparison for me.

 

[Guestx]

It's certainly the same setting but 54 was about the scene itself while The Last Days of Disco just used it as a weak backdrop. One was a dialogue driven character piece and the other was a high energy drama.

I'm not defending the film, you're certainly right about it, but it's a rough comparison for me.

Indeed. Well I agree with you on that.

LOL dude I have to tell you, watching The Last Days of Disco literally made me angry. I had my chips and salsa and a 12 pack of beer and I was ready to DO THIS THING! And then . . . I just felt like all that effort and enthusiasm was wasted. I literally felt offended and robbed of my time.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Cool. Give it a look.

Like I said, I think you'll connect with it.

Just finished it so I haven't really had a chance to process it and this is more of a first impression.

Thank you for recommending this film to me.

You're right, I am at a point where I can relate to this. But of course I don't have the options the protagonist Calvin has with his status, intelligence, and capability as a writer. Just having the option of using my work as a way for people to pursue me would be hard to resist and I don't think a man's work is separate from him. If you really put your heart into your work and someone admires it enough to pursue you that's a real compliment.

I think it was shot well and presented it in an entertaining way during the early scenes during his suspected insanity and their honeymoon period. However, the movie really began for me when she started her art class and ended when he approached his ex-girlfriend at the house party. Those were the moments of this film where I saw some honesty and maybe just a little bit of myself. I often think of how I'm always the good guy in my own story; the good hearted victim of circumstance, of the cruelty of others, and maybe just maybe of my own personality. The fact is my role as a operator in my own life is very often neutral, apathetic, or even slightly destructive.

He knew rewriting her was wrong and destructive but living without criticizing himself was more important; yet, he couldn't deal with the consequences of molding her either. When he spoke with his ex-girlfriend the story felt complete; he wasn't a victim but an equal part saboteur of his own mating relationships. Sure she left him but he was never checked into the relationship either. And if I wrote the script I would of had them leave the house party right then, had him go upstairs, and write Ruby her freedom. No huge fight or sloppy climax scene; I would of given her her freedom without explanation or apology and I would of had Calvin write himself completely out of her life. She was an innocent party in this standoff and she deserved her happiness.

Not sure what to think of the ending to be honest. Was it all a piece of Calvin's imagination? or writing process? Accepting it as a story at face value works great, until you reintroduce them.

 

[Guestx]

Thank you for recommending this film to me.

You're right, I am at a point where I can relate to this.

I was hoping you would be able to appreciate it and I'm glad to find out I wasn't wrong. When I first discovered this film a few years ago it really kind of blew me away. It felt so fresh and original and was a movie that stuck with me for days after I watched it.

I think it's well-acted, well-directed, and has BOTH some genuine moments of humor (LOL at the fucking scene with Antonio Banderas trying to give him the chair) as well as some genuine, hard-hitting dramatic moments. The trailer makes it out to be a light romantic comedy, but it's really a lot more than that.

This was one of our Movie Club picks this week, but it became clear very early on that it wasn't going to win. I went ahead and re-watched it anyway so I'm glad to have someone to discuss it with.

But of course I don't have the options the protagonist Calvin has with his status, intelligence, and capability as a writer. Just having the option of using my work as a way for people to pursue me would be hard to resist and I don't think a man's work is separate from him. If you really put your heart into your work and someone admires it enough to pursue you that's a real compliment

Yeah, that's an interesting predicament. I can understand both sides.

I mean, obviously the things that you do are a big part of who you are. So if those things attract women, why not be happy about that? On the other hand, I get what he meant about these girls not wanting HIM, but rather wanting the idea of him that they had created in their minds. That is, they didn't want Calvin the anti-social depressive guy who likes to cuddle with a stuffed animal in therapy, they want Calvin the genius author.

I think it was shot well and presented it in an entertaining way during the early scenes during his suspected insanity and their honeymoon period.

There are really some great moments there. I always have to laugh when they cut to him hiding under the desk and talking to his brother, or the whole sequence when his brother first meets Ruby, or the can-you-see-her scene on the street.

Plus, Zoe Kazan is just the most adorable thing. Not sure if you're aware, but she actually wrote the script.

However, the movie really began for me when she started her art class and ended when he approached his ex-girlfriend at the house party. Those were the moments of this film where I saw some honesty and maybe just a little bit of myself. I often think of how I'm always the good guy in my own story; the good hearted victim of circumstance, of the cruelty of others, and maybe just maybe of my own personality. The fact is my role as a operator in my own life is very often neutral, apathetic, or even slightly destructive.

I can relate to the part of Calvin that dive bombs his own relationships. I've always been that way, wanting something very specific and getting upset when it's not given to me. And being paranoid about women leaving. And I can't seem to shut that part of myself off.

There's a part of me that wants the traditional marriage with the kids and dog and the house. And another part of me that feels like that's just impossible because of who I am.

He knew rewriting her was wrong and destructive but living without criticizing himself was more important; yet, he couldn't deal with the consequences of molding her either. When he spoke with his ex-girlfriend the story felt complete; he wasn't a victim but an equal part saboteur of his own mating relationships. Sure she left him but he was never checked into the relationship either. And if I wrote the script I would of had them leave the house party right then, had him go upstairs, and write Ruby her freedom. No huge fight or sloppy climax scene; I would of given her her freedom without explanation or apology and I would of had Calvin write himself completely out of her life. She was an innocent party in this standoff and she deserved her happiness.

I find the scene in his office where he is forcing her to snap her fingers, speak French, bark like a dog, etc to be the most powerful scene in the film. It's always stayed with me.

In that moment my heart really breaks for BOTH characters, because they are both clearly in emotional agony. Sure, Calvin is being a huge asshole, but I don't think he's doing it out of malice but rather out of a deep-seated pain he has inside himself. And obviously for Ruby it's very uncomfortable because she's learning for the first time that she is not who she thinks she is and she is being forced to do things against her will.

Heavy shit.

Not sure what to think of the ending to be honest. Was it all a piece of Calvin's imagination? or writing process? Accepting it as a story at face value works great, until you reintroduce them.

Yeah, I think there are a lot of ways to interpret the ending and I'm a bit ambivalent on it personally.

But here's how I see it: When he releases her and she leaves the house, then she becomes actualized as a person. Before that moment, even though she existed in the flesh, and had thoughts and feelings, she wasn't quite real. But in that moment when he lets her go and she moves on to her own life without him, then she becomes truly real, as real as you or me. By what mechanism does this happen? Who knows. But we never know in the story how these things happen, "it's love, it's magic."

So that's what I think happens and when Calvin runs into Ruby in the park at the end, then he is meeting her--the real Ruby, the independent Ruby, the actualized Ruby--for the first time. Will they be a good match this time around? Who can tell.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Not really my response but what I can cover quickly.

Plus, Zoe Kazan is just the most adorable thing. Not sure if you're aware, but she actually wrote the script.

No, I wasn't aware and frankly I'm surprised a woman could write a male this well. It's interesting. I'll do some research and get back to this.

There's a part of me that wants the traditional marriage with the kids and dog and the house. And another part of me that feels like that's just impossible because of who I am.

Just remember that version of marriage is only 'traditional' in the post industrial revolution world. I'm probably more conservative than most traditionalists but I think there's value in living a far more mobile life than that of finding a house in suburbia and toiling for twenty years. Children need stability but you can provide that in the family structure.

If your concern is internal and whether or not you can handle being 'trapped' by a woman in either life or monogamy that's something you should approach initially. It's a really tough question but it's one you should have a dialogue with yourself over. It'd probably make for a good film piece if you wrote to it.

In that moment my heart really breaks for BOTH characters, because they are both clearly in emotional agony. Sure, Calvin is being a huge asshole, but I don't think he's doing it out of malice but rather out of a deep-seated pain he has inside himself. And obviously for Ruby it's very uncomfortable because she's learning for the first time that she is not who she thinks she is and she is being forced to do things against her will.

Heavy shit.

See I felt like Ruby had that moment at Calvin's mother's retreat and then Calvin had it while talking with his girlfriend. Scenes like those are often too much for me; sensory and emotional overload. Just felt way over the top.

 

[Guestx]

Not really my response but what I can cover quickly.

Well feel free to elaborate when you have time.

No, I wasn't aware and frankly I'm surprised a woman could write a male this well. It's interesting. I'll do some research and get back to this.

I was a bit surprised as well.

Apparently just recently she worked with Paul Dano to adapt some novel for a film that Dano is directing. It's a movie called Wildlife, due out later this year. That's her only other writing credit.

Just remember that version of marriage is only 'traditional' in the post industrial revolution world. I'm probably more conservative than most traditionalists but I think there's value in living a far more mobile life than that of finding a house in suburbia and toiling for twenty years. Children need stability but you can provide that in the family structure.

The idea of having a house somewhere is not the part that bothers me. That actually sounds kind of nice

If your concern is internal and whether or not you can handle being 'trapped' by a woman in either life or monogamy that's something you should approach initially. It's a really tough question but it's one you should have a dialogue with yourself over.

Oh, this is something that's been on my mind for all of my adult life. When I was in my teens I assumed I'd meet someone and get married in my early 20s. In my early 20s I said it would happen before I was 30. Now that I'm in my 30s, I'm not sure that it will ever happen.

I've just been saying, "I'm not ready yet." But I don't know that I ever WILL be ready.

See I felt like Ruby had that moment at Calvin's mother's retreat and then Calvin had it while talking with his girlfriend. Scenes like those are often too much for me; sensory and emotional overload. Just felt way over the top.

I'm looking at it as a supernatural thing, not a psychological thing. As I mentioned in my last post, we don't know the mechanisms by which Calvin was able to bring a girl to life, but it happened. There was some supernatural reality that made it possible, even if knowing the details is really unimportant to the story.

I am just extending this idea and saying that when Calvin released her on paper, then this triggered something that allowed her to become a genuinely real girl. At that moment, the gods granted his wish, so to speak, and finished their work in Ruby's creation. Or whatever.