I Like This Philosophy For The Missing Weight Issue

[eternaldarkness]

So speculation?

if your interested enough you can do the research, there are mountains of information available on the negative affects of dehydration on the body.

 

[CerebralKnievel]

the system is the problem. ufc has always actively encouraged fighters going to lighter weight classes. until recently.

Exactly. The adminstration all on up the chain to DW himself have explicitly advised that certain fighters cut more weight in the past. Now you no longer see or hear about it, but it was common years back.

 

[Darwinambrosius]

if your interested enough you can do the research, there are mountains of information available on the negative affects of dehydration on the body.

Do these take into account chronic dehydration or hydration a few times a year?

 

[D'z]

the system is the problem. ufc has always actively encouraged fighters going to lighter weight classes. until recently.

Weight-cutting in combat sports has been around since the Roman coliseums. Get over it. It's no more the system than it is the fighters themselves.

 

[eternaldarkness]

Exactly. The adminstration all on up the chain to DW himself have explicitly advised that certain fighters cut more weight in the past. Now you no longer see or hear about it, but it was common years back.

rogan always parroting on about "optimal" weight classes, was the norm back in the day. it created a whole culture where fighters were more worried about making weigh than training to fight.

 

[eternaldarkness]

Weight-cutting in combat sports has been around since the Roman coliseums. Get over it. It's no more the system than it is the fighters themselves.

interesting. i didn't think gladiators or boxers had weight classes in ancient times.

 

[eternaldarkness]

Do these take into account chronic dehydration or hydration a few times a year?

do i cares. my experience with weight cutting comes from being around fighters and race horses. being hit in the head is always worse if your dehydrated. ask around old fighters if you don't believe me on the effect making weight has on the body.

 

[Simian Raticus]

I actually don't think there's anything wrong with the system.

The problem here is one of attitude, professionalism and integrity.

 

[Darwinambrosius]

do i cares. my experience with weight cutting comes from being around fighters and race horses. being hit in the head is always worse if your dehydrated. ask around old fighters if you don't believe me on the effect making weight has on the body.

I was a Division I wrestler, I have an amateur MMA fight, and I'm a brown belt in BJJ with national-level competition experience. I know a little about this too. You're not getting my point though.

Is there an in-depth study on weight-cutting in MMA and it's effects on health? That is what I'm asking you. We know that it's "bad" for you in some unquantifiable way, just like the wear and tear accumulated accross a career, but I'd like to see some studies about longterm affects of it before I go about demonizing it.

How long is the average fighter's career? How many weight cuts are they doing? Is this actually taking years off of their lives? How do you separate this from the fact that it's a very demanding sport in the first place, and how do you measure the isolated affects of weight cutting against everything else detriment in the sport?

 

[eternaldarkness]

I was a Division I wrestler, I have an amateur MMA fight, and I'm a brown belt in BJJ with national-level competition experience. I know a little about this too. You're not getting my point though.

Is there an in-depth study on weight-cutting in MMA and it's effects on health? That is what I'm asking you. We know that it's "bad" for you in some unquantifiable way, just like the wear and tear accumulated accross a career, but I'd like to see some studies about longterm affects of it before I go about demonizing it.

How long is the average fighter's career? How many weight cuts are they doing? Is this actually taking years off of their lives? How do you separate this from the fact that it's a very demanding sport in the first place, and how do you measure the isolated affects of weight cutting against everything else detriment in the sport?

most of what i know about it is mainly the affect on the kidneys. i have heard of many jockeys and some fighters that have had to retire due to kidney failure. it is all anecdotal evidence but i believe every word of it. if you don't believe me just ask you doctor.

 

[Darwinambrosius]

most of what i know about it is mainly the affect on the kidneys. i have heard of many jockeys and some fighters that have had to retire due to kidney failure. it is all anecdotal evidence but i believe every word of it. if you don't believe me just ask you doctor.

I know it affects the kidneys to some extent, but we simply don't see enough instances of medical issues to warrant that as the main source of them.

Only one of my teammates from high school or college has kidney issues that I know of, and he has been a heavy drinker for as long as I've known him. Did cutting weight from ages ~11-22 hurt his kidneys. I'm sure it did, but what extent I can't say. Did that combined with lifestyle choices and maybe genetics contribute as well? Again, I'm sure it did, but to what extent I can't say. That's my point.

 

[eternaldarkness]

I know it affects the kidneys to some extent, but we simply don't see enough instances of medical issues to warrant that as the main source of them.

Only one of my teammates from high school or college has kidney issues that I know of, and he has been a heavy drinker for as long as I've known him. Did cutting weight from ages ~11-22 hurt his kidneys. I'm sure it did, but what extent I can't say. Did that combined with lifestyle choices and maybe genetics contribute as well? Again, I'm sure it did, but to what extent I can't say. That's my point.

personally my biggest issue with weight cuts, are poor fights because someone has been unable to rehydrate properly. i understand weight cutting has been a thing in boxing and wrestling forever, it's just that in ufc they took it to another level of stupid.

 

[Darwinambrosius]

personally my biggest issue with weight cuts, are poor fights because someone has been unable to rehydrate properly. i understand weight cutting has been a thing in boxing and wrestling forever, it's just that in ufc they took it to another level of stupid.

I genuinely agree. A draconian day-of weigh-in would probably cause more problems then it solves, and moving weigh-ins back another day would probably just invite more drastic cuts.

It's a shitty situation but honestly I don't see any other system working better than the current one.

 

[OrigFan255]

Where is Cerrone?

 

[Uber_Noober]

 

[xMaxPower]

This was posted by Gerald Harris on his Twitter (https://mmajunkie.com/2018/05/ufc-liverpool-twitter-reaction-darren-till-misses-weight).

"I will say this final thing about weigh ins, all the negotiations are fine but in the end being over is an advantage. So, I am willing to give my opponent as long as he needs to make weight as long as I or someone in my camp is present. That puts all the responsibility on them."

This is a great idea. Give the fighter missing weight 2 options. (1) Continue cutting weight with/without the commission (2) If you give up on Option 1, then we can decide about continuing the fight with financial sanctions.

What is the barrier to telling the fighter who missed the official weight, to continue cutting until it makes it?

wow, i cant believe i never thought about this.

This should just be how it is.

The fighter has to make the weight at anytime between the weigh in and the fight, but he still gets fined if he doesnt make weight at the ceremonial weigh in.... this works. Because at the end of the day the fighter that missed weight screwed himself over because he loses 30% of his purse and most importantly, he has less time of being fully hyrdrated since he'll be using more time to cut weight.

 

[eternaldarkness]

I genuinely agree. A draconian day-of weigh-in would probably cause more problems then it solves, and moving weigh-ins back another day would probably just invite more drastic cuts.

It's a shitty situation but honestly I don't see any other system working better than the current one.

i get your point, i still think there has to be something better though.

 

[beaglepuss]

The easiest solution to the issue would be to have same-day weigh ins like you see in amateur boxing. It would help eliminate extreme weight cuts, adverse medical issues related to the cuts, missed weights, and lethargic athletes.

 

[Franc Mittelo]

wow, i cant believe i never thought about this.

This should just be how it is.

The fighter has to make the weight at anytime between the weigh in and the fight, but he still gets fined if he doesnt make weight at the ceremonial weigh in.... this works. Because at the end of the day the fighter that missed weight screwed himself over because he loses 30% of his purse and most importantly, he has less time of being fully hyrdrated since he'll be using more time to cut weight.

Exactly. I fail to see objections to this system. Especially, if you are going to stipulate that the fighter who missed weight must remain below a certain limit, as in Wonderboy telling Till he can't weigh passed 188 tomorrow at 1pm.

Just let him cut the weight until the ceremonial weigh-ins, and if he can't make it by then, implement the financial sanctions (if you want to proceed with the bout), and on top of that, you can still tell him he can't go passed a certain weight until a certain time the next day.

This is just adding more stress on the fighter who missed weight and no advantages.