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Discussion in 'Sports Bar' started by Bluntforce420, Apr 1, 2018.
Barry Bonds and it’s not even close.
Barry Bonds and it's not even close.
His insane numbers were actually deflated due to park factors. He played 15 seasons in SF. Candlestick Park and AT&T Park are notoriously difficult stadiums to hit in. Night games in the middle of summer at 50 degrees, swirling winds, and a heavy marine layer. Good luck getting any carry on the ball.
If he got to play in those AL East band boxes with warm, muggy, summer nights, I reckon he would have hit 85 HRs in 2001.
I also want to add that I feel terrible for all the pitchers that had to face that cheating POS Bonds during their career. All these pitchers were choir boys that have never touched a drug in their life.
It's true that Bonds played in a bad hitter's park. His numbers were probably deflated by it. Although he did also hit more HRs and for a higher average at home that season. I think Barry's late prime is the most incredible thing to happen in the sport. However, full context still has to be considered. It's an expansion era. Expansion twice in the 90's. This is something I think gets underrated because of the steroids, but expansion played a part in the offensive explosion of the 90's-00's.
And the steroids. I agree that the entire league was juiced, including most of the pitchers. I think his dominance of the era is actually fairly legit. It's also impossible to argue that the steroid era didn't give us inflated offensive numbers, especially HR numbers. So the raw number, I don't value as much.
That's why I have him in the conversation with Mays and Williams for second, behind Ruth. His dominance of the early 90's was great, but not as great as Mays and Williams (or Mantle, Musial, he's second tier at best, probably around #15 or #16 before the explosion in 2001). His second prime was Ruthian in it's dominance, but didn't last nearly as long as Ruth's.
Side note: the one truly good legacy of the steroid era is that it destroyed once and for all the notion that strength training for baseball was a bad idea. We don't have multiple guys hitting 60+ a year, but top to bottom, lineups are far more dangerous now than they were up until the 90's. Even if we have lost some things like real leadoff hitters. (And no, I'm not claiming the sport is clean, just not openly flagrant about it like it was)
Stats wise hard to go against Ruth.
Pujols and Musial need some love.
Also not GOAT but i wish Ichiro came to the MLB at an earlier age.
I'm a stats guy. So Ruth.
it is absurd to name anybody like Babe Ruth Or Ty Cobb when they didn't play with the greatest African American baseball players. The only possible answer to this question, is Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Josh Gibson, or if you want to go more modern, Barry Bonds.
Tim Tebow AINEC.
How long have you watched baseball? He's not even close to the best pitcher that pitched for the Dodgers.
Babe Ruth and pretty much everyone else were on greenies, too.
I hope you're at least 100 years old with an opinion like that.
You just don't appreciate him because he's our contemporary. His numbers are Koufax-esque. And that's the only Dodger pitcher that comes close to him. Koufax pitched during a pitchers' era too. Hershiser had a nice season or two, but Kershaw is going on a decade of excellence.
I been watching since '86.
kershaw is a great pitcher. definitely too soon to put him at the very top though, especially since he has failed miserably in the post season. that said, a few more good years and he will be in the discussion as a top 5 guy. not now though. not nearly the longevity. that same reason is why koufax is not usually put at the very top. not enough games
It comes down to Willie Mays and Ken Griffey Jr. with Mays taking the edge.
Both players played 20 seasons, had 10+ Gold Gloves, career BA .300+, Top 5 in HRs, Top 20 in RBIs, Top 50 in Hits.
"The Say Hey Kid" & "The Kid"
How do people argue against babe Ruth?
He was one of the greatest pitchers of his era, and one of the greatest hitters of any era.
Its as if you had a football player, that was not only 1 of the greatest QB's of all time, but a hall of fame linebacker as well.
That guy is a better football player then Brady, elway, or montana.