Are there any top tier Dutch kickboxers who have successfully incorporated true Muay Thai?

[Snubnoze707]

The power of Dekkers lied in his hands. Their were a few Thais who could punch of course, but the way Dekkers used his forward fighting and the fighters needed to adapt their defense for his style.
Im not saying he completly changed the game, but he was a new style. and they needed to adapt their gameplan to that.

I'm not buying that. Their has been Thai's with good hands going back to the 60's, ones that also went on to winning major Boxing titles. Even the combo spam can be seen especially in that golden era where guys went for the kill more aggressively.

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

the muay mat style which Dekkers fits in perfectly has been around since the golden era at the very least and I can only guess it dates back to much earlier times.

 

[Kanka]

Dekkers lost to thais in Japan, Netherland, Germany, China and Morocco so i don't even understand why people buy into this "Ramon Dekkers always got robbed by corrupt thai judges" thing?

 

[Snubnoze707]

Dekkers lost to thais in Japan, Netherland, Germany, China and Morocco so i don't even understand why people buy into this "Ramon Dekkers always got robbed by corrupt thai judges" thing?

It's because Dekkers and his camp kept pushing that point and people just took it at face value without actually watching the fights. Just like they saw a highlight stating "He went to Thailand and beat them all" and "the only foreigner to win fighter of the year in Thailand".

People buy into the hype rather than looking for real facts.

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

Maybe hate was a bit too strong of a word to use..
But almost half of the topics on this forum are about Muaythai compared to Dutch kickboxing in some sort of way. Gives a bit of the feeling that people just want to tell here how superior MT is above Kickboxing in their eyes..

Half the threads are here are definitely not about comparing muay thai to dutch kickboxing. Those ones get some people really riled up but they are actually few and far between.

This thread has nothing to do with comparing muay thai and kickboxing. It's essentially a mythbusting session because some idiots repeated all the long debunked Ramon Dekkers myths. What Ramon Dekker did or didn't accomplish in muay thai has no relevance as whether kickboxing or muay thai is a superior sport.

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

The power of Dekkers lied in his hands. Their were a few Thais who could punch of course, but the way Dekkers used his forward fighting and the fighters needed to adapt their defense for his style.
Im not saying he completly changed the game, but he was a new style. and they needed to adapt their gameplan to that.

Pretty much all pure punchers in the history of muay thai have fought on the front foot. Dekker's style is unique in the trivial sense that every fighter's style is somewhat unique. He did not create a new fighting archetype and he did not in any way significantly change the style of fighting used in stadium muay thai bouts, either during his career or in subsequent generations. Not debatable, end of story.

 

[Snubnoze707]

 

[Kentaro]

Ryan Simson was a good muay thai fighter.
At one point he was ranked #2 at lumpini stadium!!!

 

[Kentaro]

Ivan Hippolyte

 

[Maroli]

Modern Muay Thai isn't even the true Muay Thai. True Muay Thai is like arms stretched out like a zombie with no boxing guard. They throw like taking punches.that aren't even real punches with the intent of just cutting guys.

Absolutely not. A few regional variants like muay korat had hands outstretched but others like chaiya had something very close to a Queensbury guard and and outwardly similar defense to crazy monkey they use in mma (like rampage uses)

 

[superpunch]

Absolutely not. A few regional variants like muay korat had hands outstretched but others like chaiya had something very close to a Queensbury guard and and outwardly similar defense to crazy monkey they use in mma (like rampage uses)

you seem to know a bit about regional styles and their history. you should write an article or a thread about it because that kind of info is really hard to find online.

I used to do muay thai here in the states and would try to find info about all these famous muay thai fighters from history.. Like dudes that fought in the stadiums in the 70s, 80s, 90s, even now -- and it was impossible. It's an oddity to know that even in 2017 there's information that's not easy to access.

there's gotta be a ton of information about muay thai and its history, even modern history, that thai people just take for granted and its all in their heads. And you can barely access it now, and its for sure gonna disappear for good after they all pass.

 

[Maroli]

you seem to know a bit about regional styles and their history. you should write an article or a thread about it because that kind of info is really hard to find online.

I used to do muay thai here in the states and would try to find info about all these famous muay thai fighters from history.. Like dudes that fought in the stadiums in the 70s, 80s, 90s, even now -- and it was impossible. It's an oddity to know that even in 2017 there's information that's not easy to access.

Most thais don't really know much about muay boran either... beyond what they've seen in ong bak. Lol actually that isn't identifiably muay boran either. Anyway, I am no expert... just had the privilege of learning from kru preang for a summer. He is the real deal, maybe one of a small handful of people left that are grandmasters of a true boran style. Buakaw, yodsanklai, and even tony jaa visited and learned from him.

The Human Weapon show on Discovery Channel has a segment on him in the muay thai episode.


Also did the choreography in muay thai warrior, which is a fun movie and also stars buakaw (and saenchai amongst others)

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

For anyone who believes that Dekkers or fighters from the Netherlands were the first foreigners or Europeans to fight Thais in the big stadiums in Thailand, watch this fight from 1985 from Rajadamnern stadium:



And there would definitely have been other fighters from Japan and elsewhere who would have done the same thing previously.

 

[Kassitus]

I wonder who that guy is? Some savateur?

 

[Bluesbreaker]

I'm glad I found this thread and now know the Thais are the greatest at everything ever, especially the beautiful, majestic art form that is Muay Thai. An art that is only truly understood by a select few forum posters on the internet.

 

[AbeRudder]

I'm glad I found this thread and now know the Thais are the greatest at everything ever, especially the beautiful, majestic art form that is Muay Thai. An art that is only truly understood by a select few forum posters on the internet.

Yeah man it's crazy. Who would have thought Thais were dominant in the art of muay THAI! Crazy coincidence. Almost like the sport was invented there and they've been developing it for decades, or something like that.

 

[jono83]

Judging criteria, punches are scored less compared to kicks and knees.

Not as much as you'd think. Meaning him losing due to the judging criteria. I've seen plenty of his fights over there where he was just outstruck and was covered in blood by the end of it. Not at all trying to take away any credit from his accomplishments but he did lose more than half of his fights over there even with the size advantage. Even today it's rare to see anyone outside of Thailand be able to be competitive in the stadiums. Damian Alamos, unsure of the spelling, and now Chad Collins is doing a pretty good.